from the first-you-lose-your-phone-and-then-you-cannot-buy-another dept.
Credit card giant American Express is apparently onboard with Apple's forthcoming mobile payment system, expected to be a part of the company's next-generation iPhone set to be unveiled at a Sept. 9 media event. Word of the Buffalo, New York, financial giant's apparent partnership with Apple was first reported on Sunday by Re/code ( http://recode.net/2014/08/31/apple-9-9/ ), which reaffirmed that the payment system is expected to be tied to the forthcoming "iPhone 6" The so-called e-wallet system would allow users to use their handset to make payments at retail outfits, negating the need for a physical credit card.
The news site The Information previously reported ( https://www.theinformation.com/Apple-Mobile-Wallet-Talks-Heat-Up ) that Visa had also agreed to work with Apple. Representatives for Apple and American Express declined to comment.
(Score: 5, Funny) by Nerdfest on Tuesday September 02 2014, @12:04AM
I'm sure it will support all platforms and have a nice open API.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by frojack on Tuesday September 02 2014, @12:16AM
Probably not.
But there should be.
The carriers unilaterally shut down Google Wallet and kept it neutered for two or three years while they tried to get their own payment system in place. But because they are carriers, and can't agree on anything, that whole effort came to naught, and Google finally went ahead and implemented wallet the way they originally wanted.
You still can't buy much with google wallet, (but its great for sending money). There are a few places that till take if at "tap to pay" terminals.
And anyone can get a Google card (which is processed as if it were a MasterCard). Great for sending money to kids at college. (no transfer fees).
Had the carriers not stepped in and put the kabosh on Google Wallet we would have been miles ahead by now in the electronic payments arena.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by Nerdfest on Tuesday September 02 2014, @12:43AM
It's also cross-platform, which I *highly* doubt will the the case with Apple.
(Score: 2) by kaszz on Tuesday September 02 2014, @03:27AM
Transfer fees? use bank account - to - bank account?
(Score: 0, Offtopic) by E_NOENT on Tuesday September 02 2014, @12:33AM
Timing couldn't be better:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/celebritynews/11067182/Nude-Jennifer-Lawrence-photos-leaked-by-hacker-who-claims-to-have-private-pictures-of-100-A-listers.html [telegraph.co.uk]
I'm not in the business... I *am* the business.
(Score: 2) by TrumpetPower! on Tuesday September 02 2014, @12:45AM
If they've got even the slightest hint of a clue, this won't be exclusive to the next iPhone.
I could possibly consider using this on my iPhone 5s, but there's no fucking way I'm going out and buying a new phone just for some niche payment scheme. Neither will anybody else -- thereby guaranteeing it to be some niche payment scheme.
On the other hand, push it with the next version of iOS and keep the same level of backwards compatibility, and they'll likely have an instant hit.
Open the API and publish an Android app, and they're guaranteed to dominate the market.
The only conceivable reason to tie it to a new iPhone is if it requires some new hardware, and there's just no valid reason to do so. Between WiFi and Bluetooth and cellular network connections, there's no need for new communications hardware. If a chip-and-pin credit card can handle the computation requirements for mobile financial transactions, an iPhone is embarrassing overkill. That leaves user identification -- which, again, the existing iOS devices are more than capable of handling. For old school hardware, there's PINs and passphrases and other options every bit as secure as anything else in use; for the 5s, you've also got fingerprint authentication.
So...yeah. Either iOS with no hardware restrictions (plus apps for other platforms), or fuck off.
Cheers,
b&
All but God can prove this sentence true.
(Score: 2) by frojack on Tuesday September 02 2014, @12:51AM
I could possibly consider using this on my iPhone 5s,
I've kind of lost track of Iphone models, so help me out here...
What model did Apple include NFC in the phone?
Pretty sure that is needed at payment terminals.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by iwoloschin on Tuesday September 02 2014, @01:07AM
No NFC in any current iPhone. But, you might be able to do some sort of magic with bluetooth and wifi, though I'm not sure if there's anything in the bluetooth spec that does something close enough to NFC.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by TrumpetPower! on Tuesday September 02 2014, @01:17AM
My point / complaint would be that every smartphone out there already has at least three different wireless data transceivers, any one of which is overkill for the task. Neither I nor anybody else is going to buy a new phone just so it has yet another transceiver just so we can leave a credit card behind (but still have to carry a driver's license, all those other credit cards, various insurance cards, and the rest).
If they want to see this take off, it'll have to be the merchants who make it work with new hardware they themselves provide, either with that supposedly-low-cost ad-hoc Bluetooth stuff we've been hearing about, or with local WiFi, or even just with GPS-location-based Internet lookups.
Hell, it could even be done with a QR code, for that matter; point-of-sale system displays a barcode and an human-readable total amount that your phone reads, independently connects to Apple's servers to verify, shows you the amount you'll be charged on your phone, confirm and done.
This isn't rocket science, and suggesting new hardware is needed is, frankly, insulting.
b&
All but God can prove this sentence true.
(Score: 2) by frojack on Tuesday September 02 2014, @01:37AM
My point / complaint would be that every smartphone out there already has at least three different wireless data transceivers, any one of which is overkill for the task. Neither I nor anybody else is going to buy a new phone just so it has yet another transceiver just so we can leave a credit card behind
A little investigation will help you understand that the Wifi, Bluetooth, and NFC are usually built into the same single chip.
Each radio protocol behaves dramatically differently, and nobody would choose to use an additional one if the existing one would suffice as you claim. Also NFC has nothing at all to do with wifi, nor do you want any part of WIFI involved given how insecure it is, and the range it has.
As for your assertion that nobody will buy that, you are 100% wrong. They will buy it in droves. They've already done so.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by TrumpetPower! on Tuesday September 02 2014, @04:45AM
If it's the same hardware, then, again, there's no reasonable need to tie it to a specific phone.
And the set of people who'd buy an iPhone 6 just for this is much, much, much smaller than the set of people who'd use it on all their iOS devices plus all other devices.
Security concerns of WiFi are moot. There's no need to actually register as a node with an access point, and therefore to deal with shared secrets or WPA keys or any of the rest.
Rather, create a new protocol on top of the same link layer. Build it from the ground up, model it on whatever wireless protocol you already think is secure enough. Just use the WiFi transceivers to send ones and zeros according to this new protocol, as opposed to IPv?.
Or, do the same thing with Bluetooth.
Or, encapsulate it within IPv? and send it over the public Internet, with it being the phone's problem of how to connect to the Internet and reach the server.
Point is, the existing hardware is overkill six ways from Sunday, on all smartphones, and restricting it to one model of one brand of smartphone is like opening a new nationwide chain of gas stations that'll only service 2015 model year FU-trim BMW I9s -- but those same cars can still fill up at regular gas stations, as well, and the only difference between the pumps at the special stations and regular ones is a different nozzle that pumps the same gas but won't fit in a regular filler neck.
What's the "value-add" here, exactly?
b&
All but God can prove this sentence true.
(Score: 2) by Nerdfest on Tuesday September 02 2014, @09:59AM
For customers? I don't think you understand Apple's goal here.
(Score: 2) by iwoloschin on Tuesday September 02 2014, @10:27AM
Also, this is the year that *EVERYONE* upgrades their iPhone, since their two year contract on an iPhone 5 is now up (in the USA at least). It's a brand new model year, with "extreme" changes and "revolutionary" "new" features. Like NFC! Because no other [i]Phone has done that before!
Seriously though, you're bitching about your phone being good enough. So great, don't go out and buy a new one. But you know what, if there's a new hardware feature, that happens to roll out with a major upgrade year, so millions of folks will be buying new hardware. It might be because of the new features, or it might just be due to the giant crack on their old iPhone 5 screen that they haven't fixed because they're just going to replace it in a few months anyways.
(Score: 2) by frojack on Tuesday September 02 2014, @06:02PM
and restricting it to one model of one brand of smartphone is like opening a new nationwide
You DO Understand, don't you, that virtually every android phone on the market already has NFC chips, and uses them for phone to phone transfers of pictures and documents, and all sorts of stuff [trendblog.net] as well as payments?
Pleas tell me you weren't laboring under the assumption that Apple was coming up with something novel and new.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Tuesday September 02 2014, @11:30AM
"but still have to carry ... all those other credit cards"
There are many new payment technologies out there, square, google wallet, a bunch of others, and I still haven't been able to try ANY of them because no one locally uses them for anything but independent coffee houses for $9 coffee cups and I don't drink coffee I'm more into tea.
I just checked square's app while posting this and there's nothing I want to spend money on. The google wallet app seems to have changed and I can't figure out how to list nearby google wallet cash registers (probably because the result is even more pitiful).
I'm not asking for much here. Gasoline? Food? Clothes? What little I can spend money on, is useless to me. Hipster $15/drink bars, and I don't drink booze and don't go to hipster bars. Independent coffee shops and I don't drink coffee (admittedly they might sell tea which I do drink). Piercing establishment (I'm way to rebellious and individualistic to have piercings or tattoos like everyone else around my age or younger) There's a vaping shop for e-cig users, again no interest to me. Thats pretty much it.
I've got money, piles of it, I am pretty well off financially although not near 1%er life, but I can't find a way to spend my stacks of money using the new payment technologies.
It pisses me off because I was a very early adopter when I heard of square so I went to the effort of setting it up and making an account and linking my CC and whatever else, and then I'm all fired up to go spend money and ... I can't. There was nothing and still is nothing. BORING!
"even just with GPS-location-based Internet lookups."
I believe this is how square works. You and the cash register have a known and nearby location and you both talk to a central server somewhere and your account pops up on the register w/ your picture and they click it and you're done. I wouldn't know for certain, because I've never been able to buy anything with square. Maybe someday. I predict they sell the GPS tracking info and buying history as an additional revenue stream, which also makes me want to pay cash.
(Score: 2) by chewbacon on Tuesday September 02 2014, @01:37PM
Then you'd also have to get an Amex card. Fuck that. Not that I'm rushing out or need to buy shit with my phone, but I would likely never use it if it didn't tie into my debit card.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by NowhereMan on Tuesday September 02 2014, @01:35AM
And for your convenience it uploads your receipt and your credit card number to your iCloud account.
(Score: 2) by mtrycz on Tuesday September 02 2014, @09:25AM
This is clearly the traditional payment establishment that's realizing it's got surpassed by the magic internet money, and trying to catch up, and probably using their connections to force out the competition.
Probably.
In capitalist America, ads view YOU!
(Score: 2) by PizzaRollPlinkett on Tuesday September 02 2014, @03:40PM
Getting between you and the companies you purchase from to assemble an aggregate profile of your purchases is the last holy grail left in data collecting. No one has managed to convince consumers they want it, and no one has been able to get retailers to sign up and give away this information. Anyone who can pull it off will be the last big thing in data collecting. If they can tie it in to online behavior, the aggregate information will be much more valuable.
(E-mail me if you want a pizza roll!)