posted by
martyb
on Wednesday December 10 2014, @09:39AM
from the things-look-different-from-up-here dept.
from the things-look-different-from-up-here dept.
The old fashion saw is that shoes make the man, but it turns out that they may affect him in other ways as well.
The well-heeled Marilyn Monroe reportedly once said if you give a girl the right shoes, she can conquer the world.
The allure of high-heeled shoes is no secret among women, who have used them to entice men from the streets of Ancient Rome to the New York City sidewalks of Carrie Bradshaw. Heels have also been a controversial symbol in the battleground of sexual politics.
Now a scientific study in France has measured their power.
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(Score: 2) by zafiro17 on Wednesday December 10 2014, @10:50AM
Not a complaint, mind you, just pointing out this same week we've had an article about the bionic bra and the power of high heeled shoes on women. What's everyone got on their minds this week?
Dad always thought laughter was the best medicine, which I guess is why several of us died of tuberculosis - Jack Handey
(Score: 2) by hoochiecoochieman on Wednesday December 10 2014, @11:42AM
This week???
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Wednesday December 10 2014, @06:21PM
> What's everyone got on their minds this week?
Women actually keeping their clothes on.
That's a change.
(Score: 2) by davester666 on Wednesday December 10 2014, @07:38PM
Bangin'
Just like every week.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by wonkey_monkey on Wednesday December 10 2014, @10:57AM
Women sure as hell don't wear them for comfort.
Heels make you look taller. That was/is a vague but very obvious (and easily altered) indicator of general fitness and quality of diet.
Did they try putting a short woman in heels and comparing her results to those of a taller (such that head height was the same) woman in flats?
Now a "scientific study" in France has measured their power.
Foot fetishists are getting smart.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk
(Score: 5, Informative) by hoochiecoochieman on Wednesday December 10 2014, @12:34PM
It's not only about height. High-heels make legs look sexier because it contracts the muscles on the lower leg, making them stand out. It also makes women curve their lower spine, making the butt stand out.
I know high-heels are not practical, and definitely not healthy. But they look great.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by frojack on Wednesday December 10 2014, @11:31PM
But they look great.
Speak for yourself.
You've seen good looking women in high heels and you just assume the heels make them good looking. Its called confirmation bias.
I find them ridiculous, and pretentious.
I've often thought women wear them to impress other women, rather than to impress men.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by hoochiecoochieman on Thursday December 11 2014, @10:57AM
Who are you to know what I assume or not? Last time I checked, telepathy across the web wasn't invented yet.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 11 2014, @07:18PM
Yeah frojack is an idiot.
Just have the same girl walk in heels, then have her walk on "flats". Same girl different movement. And what a difference it is ;).
The heels tend to encourage more motion with the hips (that's assuming you don't fall down, or walk bow legged).
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Friday December 12 2014, @01:36AM
I've often thought women wear them to impress other women, rather than to impress men.
--
Possibly, frojack. But the question we all want the answer to is: why do you wear them?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by romlok on Wednesday December 10 2014, @12:08PM
"Empower them in romance"? How do they do that exactly? Oh, by emphasising a woman's status as a sex object to be ogled by men - just from the perspective of someone who likes the power that being such a sex object brings.
Not to mention that this "reasoning" only holds valid for sexually available women on the prowl, which is probably not the image most regular heel-wearing women want to portray most of the time.
Personally, wearing heels tells me that a woman cares more about appearing pretty than being useful, and I cannot abide useless people.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by hoochiecoochieman on Wednesday December 10 2014, @12:56PM
Come on! Get a fucking life!
We have gotten from a Male Supremacy society into a Femino-Fascist society. I can't stand this over-the-board feminism anymore. Turning it around: I can't wear a nice suit because it will make me a sex object to be ogled by women? What if a lesbian chick wears high-heels to be ogled by other lesbians? Is it misogynist, too? Head explodes.
Maybe everybody should be fat and ugly, and wear KKK-style robes and hoods, so nobody will see us and "ogle" us.
I'm waiting for the Femino-Fascist Movement to get together with the Islamic Fundamentalist Movement to force the dress code of Saudi Arabia on every woman.
Of course, because the world is all black and white, with no shades in between. A pretty woman is not "useful", whatever the fuck that means. That's not misogynist at all. Yeah, go ahead. Good luck for you.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by romlok on Wednesday December 10 2014, @03:53PM
Not what I said. My comment was about my personal perception of a woman's priorities toward their life and health, based on their choice of footwear. Followed up with a somewhat related Firefly quote.
And lest you continue to think me misogynist; I make the same judgements about men. However, their day-to-day footwear is usually not so ostentatious or impractical.
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Thursday December 11 2014, @02:54AM
Come on! Get a fucking life!
Says the Solentil with the handle "hoochiecoochieman"? Truly, irony is dead.
(Score: 2) by hoochiecoochieman on Thursday December 11 2014, @10:55AM
I'm a Muddy Waters fan. So what! I was listening to him when I enrolled here, I used the first nickname that came to mind.
I'm not an American, maybe that's why I didn't get the irony. Would you care to explain?
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Friday December 12 2014, @02:04AM
Evidently you do not know what "hoochiecoochie" is! Look it up.
This reminds me of those westerners who love to get Kanji tattooed on there bodies, with out being able read Chinese.
(Score: 2) by hoochiecoochieman on Friday December 12 2014, @03:59AM
Ok. Followed your advice, it was quite easy. As many expressions related to the blues, it can mean a bunch of things. The original usage is quite naughty. However that song is so popular, even here in Europe, that I guess the original naughtiness is lost. Does anyone still use this expression in the US?
I used it as a nickname because I love blues music and it popped up in my mind, not to mean anything sexual. If it can be misinterpreted, I'd better change it. Could you give me your point of view, being an American? I don't mean to offend or shock anyone..
I think it's quite different. US culture is everywhere here in Europe. We know more about you than you know about us. But we don't have the slightest idea about Chinese culture. I listen to American music all the time. I don't know any Chinese music at all.
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Saturday December 13 2014, @06:57AM
Original naughtiness lost? You should keep up with American culture. Not lost, just enhanced and shameless!
So you now get the irony? No need to change your handle, I don't think anyone would be offended. Most Americans are clueless, and the ones that are not are beyond being offended, so all is good.
China? It is a country, and a culture, with a long history. Good idea to pay attention to it of late.
(Score: 2) by hoochiecoochieman on Saturday December 13 2014, @03:24PM
Thanks for the eye opener. About China, they own everything around here, nowadays. About time to get acquainted with the boss's culture. Mandarin courses are all the rage, now. But I suspect it takes a lot more than a course just to have a simple conversation.
(Score: 2) by bradley13 on Wednesday December 10 2014, @01:06PM
Why get upset? This is biology 101, wired into people at a pretty fundamental level. Our instincts may be weaker, but they are not substantially different from other animals. (1) Females initially attract male attention by looking healthy, or emitting pheromones, or whatever each species does. (2) Males then compete for female attention, by showing big tail feathers, by driving a fancy car, or whatever each species does. (3) The females then choose among the competing males. Oversimplified, but that's basically the way it works for most of the animal kingdom, humans included.
For humans, step 1 is largely visual: hotness goes before inner beauty. For humans, step 2 is "good provider": successful and rich goes before hotness. This is why you see rich, old guys with hot, young women, but not often the other way around. This is all reality, it's wired pretty deeply into our behavior, there's no point in getting upset about it.
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 10 2014, @07:14PM
If it were so simple then it wouldn't be an issue of debate. The real world is never so one dimensional as you chose to believe.
Simplification eliminates important context and guarantees failure of analysis.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 11 2014, @07:52PM
By the way there's a very important factor in why things are the way they are- women carry the babies. Just this fact alone has shaped society and the world over the years.
For example: women consensually raping 14 year old boys isn't going to spark as much outrage as men consensually raping 14 year old girls. If the woman gets pregnant she's the one paying by default even if there are no laws "protecting" the boy. Whereas you need laws for the latter case. And that's why in the ancient past before the green revolution and reliable and safe contraception, families tend to disapprove of daughters having illicit sex more than their sons. Guess who pays to support the bastards? In those days a single farmer and farm can't support as many people as today.
Some Uber Queen ain't gonna copy her genes about as much as an Uber King - don't matter how many she fucks - she can't have that many babies. So what's the genetic motivation for a woman to be an Uber Queen? If she wants to have many copies of her genes out in the world, she should snare Uber King material and bear him sons. Not try to be an "Uber King".
And that's why you see more cases of rich powerful old guys with young hot girls than rich powerful old women with young hot guys.
(Score: 2) by nitehawk214 on Wednesday December 10 2014, @05:05PM
So, what are you saying here? Slut-shaming is bad... unless it is being done by the feminists? Talk about mixed messages.
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 10 2014, @05:51PM
> "Empower them in romance"? How do they do that exactly? Oh, by emphasising a woman's status as a sex object
Yes. Sex is a big part of romance, some would even say that sex (and procreation) is the most important part of romance.
The problems start when sex is a substitute for competence in non-romantic parts of life.
> probably not the image most regular heel-wearing women want to portray most of the time.
So stop wearing heels. I recognize that there are all kinds of social conventions and pressures, but heels serve no other purpose than to increase sexual attractiveness. If someone just wants to be taller, then they can wear lifts like men do. This is one of those things where people make decisions without fully thinking through the implications.
> Personally, wearing heels tells me that a woman cares more about appearing pretty than being useful
That is too simpleminded. There are lots of occasions where wearing heels does not detract from a person's ability to be useful - for example social occasions. If a person doesn't expect to run a foot-race or lift heavy objects then wearing heels doesn't make them any less useful.
(Score: 2) by shortscreen on Wednesday December 10 2014, @06:59PM
While I don't see anything wrong with women being ogled by men generally, I do find it mind-boggling that women would wear something as ridiculous as high-heeled shoes in the context of daily life. If I was a woman I certainly wouldn't wear them.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 10 2014, @07:10PM
Much of that decision to wear them is the result of societal norms. The kind of thing that SJWs have a problem with and social injustice warriors think have no influence over people's choices.
(Score: 1) by Darth Turbogeek on Wednesday December 10 2014, @10:54PM
Women in high heels are useless?
Clearly YOU haven't had a woman wrap her high heels around your ass.
Now the obvious snap back is done, what kind of stupid clap trap is your assertion about....... oh fuck it,. there are so many actual smart and highly talented women who wear heels that your bullshit dribble is obviously shit and is not worth any other reply.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 11 2014, @02:14AM
What you said was good, but I would change 1 word.
drivel [google.com]
-- gewg_
(Score: 2) by khakipuce on Wednesday December 10 2014, @03:32PM
Of course this doesn't address the really interesting question of why? Married women and women in stable relationships still wear high heels; plenty of capable and confident women who have no need to seek to influence men still wear high heels. A lot of women say they dress for fashion, because they like the look or a host of other reasons none of which include attracting men. It seems to be men who are obsessed with the idea that women should want to be attractive to men all the time.
The obvious explanation would seem to be conditioning and societal norms. The other question is: if heel height works for women why haven't men adopted it?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 10 2014, @04:12PM
My pet theory is that women almost exclusively dress up to be seen by other women.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 10 2014, @05:37PM
Why do you assume that someone can "turn it off" after they have attained a mate?
These behaviors are hardwired into us as animals and continue at some level for an astonishingly long time.
Retaining those behaviors serves a purpose as well, in that it is an insurance policy.
If someone needs a new mate (say, their mate leaves them, dies, or could be ditched in favor of a better one), then it is helpful to still be somewhat "in the game" attracting the opposite sex.
Genes that get passed on by reproduction are genes that become prevalent. So keep on keepin' on! That's how we got to where we are.
(Score: 2) by frojack on Wednesday December 10 2014, @11:41PM
Women dress to impress other women. They's much rather get a compliment from a woman than a man.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2002391/Sorry-chaps-women-dress-impress-other.html [dailymail.co.uk]
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kelly-oreilly/women-dress-for-other-wom_b_218619.html [huffingtonpost.com]
http://www.lifeunsweetened.com/2013/06/27/do-women-dress-for-men-or-other-women/ [lifeunsweetened.com]
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by Aiwendil on Wednesday December 10 2014, @04:52PM
"high heels" vs "flats"? now that is a completly non-informative criteria.. I don't know about you but I know I react differently on flip-flops and on boots that end on the middle of the thigh that are properly laced.. heck, even the basic design of the footwear, its material and how it is laced matters quite a bit..
Just for kicks.. Imagine the differences between a) an overly obese woman b) a fit woman c) an overly obese man d) a fit man [;] wearing any of I) "common" high heeled shoes II) sneakers III) loafers IV) flip-flops V) riding boots VI) knee-high laced leather boots VII) thigh-high laced leather boots VIII) high heeled riding boots IX) high heeled laced leather boots that ends on the middle of the thigh..
for instance a-IX would just look painful, and d-I depends an awful lot on other factors.
(And don't even get me started on terrain or snow)..
Personally I tend to prefer to see function and fashion combined - so for instance properly laced boots with a flat heel would be the most eyecatching for me. Also I do have a dislike for highheeled shoes (regardless of type) albeit a few (sadly enough a minority) persons do pull them off (and then I prefer the high heels on boots).
Out of curiousity, why didn't they also try platform-shoes?
(Score: 2) by hankwang on Wednesday December 10 2014, @06:28PM
"Personally I tend to prefer to see function and fashion combined"
When it's for me watching, I like high heels.
When the woman is with me (romantically or not), I curse at those heels and the fact that it makes them incapable of a 15-minute walk, never mind running to catch the train.
I'm curious how some female airport staff (Amsterdam airport) and cabin crew for some airlines manages to stand on those things for eight hours a day.
Avantslash: SoylentNews for mobile [avantslash.org]
(Score: 2) by Aiwendil on Wednesday December 10 2014, @06:49PM
It is a matter of training - I have a few female friends that easily can run in high heels (and one can even run over steel grates (she is trained in classical ballet, might have something to do with it))..
As I said, a few can pull it off, but the majority basically just tries to cope rather then learn exactly how one can and should move in the high heels.
(Score: 2) by Common Joe on Thursday December 11 2014, @05:40AM
First of all, I think a study on high heels is interesting. I don't like them because of the ankle twisting, back-pain inducing problems. Still, there is an allure about them. An interesting note I'm curious to know more about: I see shorter women tending to favor heels more often then not. (Personal observation. Nothing scientific.) I'd like to see a scientific study on women who do and don't wear heels and how it affects their position in society.
Ancient Rome? They must mean recent Rome. Heels were first used in medieval times and used to help horse back riders. You can check out Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] or even a BBC article [bbc.com].
Personal opinion: I'm more likely to pick up a dropped glove on the street for a woman wearing heals simply because of how awkward it is to pick up anything in high heels. My mind's eye sees some poor gal falling over, twisting an ankle, and flashing everyone her underwear. I'd rather pick up the glove for her than have that happen. I don't like to see people in pain and embarrassed.