SoylentNews is people
SoylentNews
The 2017 tax overhaul vastly expanded the number of people who could file simplified tax returns, a boon to millions of Americans.
But the new law directly threatened the lucrative business of Intuit, the maker of TurboTax.
Although the company draws in customers with the promise of a "free" product, its fortunes depend on getting as many customers as possible to pay. It had been regularly charging $100 or more for returns that included itemized deductions for mortgage interest and charitable donations. Under the new law, many wealthier taxpayers would no longer be filing that form, qualifying them to use the company's free software.
Intuit executives came up with a way to preserve the company's hefty profit margins: It began charging more low-income people. Which ones? Individuals with disabilities, the unemployed and people who owe money on student loans, all of whom use tax forms that TurboTax previously included for free.
(Score: 3, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:01PM (13 children)
And the factual claims are based on what evidence?
[CITATION NEEDED]
(Score: 2, Interesting) by DeathMonkey on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:09PM
Do we need to rename the website to SoylentSpeculation?
(Score: 5, Interesting) by ikanreed on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:16PM (5 children)
Ah the classic, bare assertion, no link summary by anonymous. This level of fact checking and sourcing is almost good enough for the op-ed section of the New York Times.
Anyways, yes, this is not the first I've heard of this, the IRS expands on the details of free filing here [irs.gov]. Because of my own bias I'd like you to note that in spite of the positive spin in the document, a lot of people ate shit on that law, specifically where family deductions and earned income credits were concerned.
Nothing in the summary is particularly wrong, though it's worth noting what enabled Intuit to get away with this is a bipartisan bill sponsored by Chuck Grastley, preventing the IRS from offering it's own free-file program. [propublica.org]
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:26PM (4 children)
I don't have a problem with Chuck's law (it's stupid but so are most things that happen in Congress) but I have a massive problem with people being expected to follow laws that they can't understand or keep up with.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday July 17 2019, @11:37PM (3 children)
It was major news at the time. And I'm not sure how much change individual filers actually experienced in terms of their obligations.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday July 18 2019, @11:10AM (2 children)
Wasn't speaking of this change specifically. More referring to the fact that pretty much nobody who isn't a CPA whose business it is to do so can understand and keep up with federal tax code.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 18 2019, @10:06PM (1 child)
Which is why I think the IRS needs to release software to calculate this stuff for free. This is even more reinforce by the fact that they already have the software they use to do the same calculations and their data-entry monkeys aren't CPAs either. They need to just break everything down to simple questions. For example, ask a regular person if they have "carried interest" or "deferred income" and they'll probably just look at you funny. Ask them if they are in charge of a registered investment fund or if their business received money for the sale of a product they haven't delivered, and you will get clear answers. Yes, I understand that some of the concepts are more complicated than that, but the basics are the basics, something is better than nothing, and the IRS already makes the determination of most variables through some automatic analysis, so they've broken it down somehow already.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday July 19 2019, @07:42PM
I'd prefer an amendment along the lines of "Laws that cannot be understood or kept up with by Average Joe are null and void," myself.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:19PM (5 children)
Fixed. Blame martyb
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:23PM (1 child)
Still not seeing it....
(Score: 2) by takyon on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:38PM
It takes a few minutes for edits to show up.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:32PM (2 children)
If you can't be arsed to cast blame manually, you can hop in #soylent on our irc server and type "~blame" instead. Bytram is his irc nick and we long ago saved ourselves time by letting the bot do half the typing since we blame him for everything from bugs in my code to the weather to the fish not biting.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday July 17 2019, @11:48PM (1 child)
That's a feature not a bug. Were the fish biting, you'd have something to do, something that would distract you from the serenity of fishing.
It take a strong will and years of practice to ignore the annoyance and keep on fishing. For this reason, many go in extremes and cheat, just casting an empty hook.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday July 18 2019, @11:12AM
Sweet potatoes are also used by the wiser of such folks. You can't beat or bribe a fish into biting a sweet potato.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:17PM (8 children)
I don't give a fuck what TurboTax does, the real problem is that I have to go via a middle man to file my taxes electronically.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by http on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:16PM
What Turbotax is doing is trying to make themselves the only viable option for filing your taxes "electronically."
Still not giving a fuck?
I browse at -1 when I have mod points. It's unsettling.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:33PM
Only if you pay them.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by ikanreed on Wednesday July 17 2019, @11:40PM (5 children)
That's what was shit about the amendments. The IRS was going to have a free-to-file online web-app hosted by the government. And our proud not-at-all-in-the-pocket-of-everyone legislators protected us from that danger.
(Score: -1, Troll) by khallow on Thursday July 18 2019, @02:03AM (4 children)
(Score: 4, Touché) by ikanreed on Thursday July 18 2019, @02:44AM (3 children)
The IRS shouldn't be in the business of processing returns?
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 18 2019, @11:11AM (2 children)
My point here is that the IRS can't simultaneously maximize government revenue and minimize the taxes you pay. My take is that when push comes to shove, processing returns to maximize tax revenue is going to be a higher priority for them than the best interests of the taxpayers will be. That's why it's a conflict of interest and why I think the conflict of interest will be resolved to harm tens of millions of people.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 18 2019, @10:23PM (1 child)
Almost no one calculates their own taxes anymore. You take your tax form, copy numbers from one box to another, add here, multiply there, and it spits a number out at the end (or pay someone else to do it for you). And then, when you are all done the IRS gets to tell you if you did it correctly or not. So, why not just have the IRS present you with the numbers (that they already have most of BTW), ask a few questions and adjustments, and do the calculations for you? Either way, the final calculated result is the same, as the IRS is still free to challenge the data you provide, but I didn't have to pay someone else to do if for me or whip out the calculator.
Hell, it would probably result in less revenue, as you would know in advance what information the IRS has on you. This would allow you challenge that data when it hurts you and not volunteer it when it helps you.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 18 2019, @11:08PM
I already explained why. The IRS can raise more revenue by presenting you with larger numbers. The private tax filers can't. Sooner or later, someone is going to play that game.
Except when it's not, because the IRS needed to make more revenue and thus, calculated larger tax numbers. Meanwhile those tax filers still get more money by lowering the tax load.
Conversely, this provides a convenient bit of machinery for the IRS to demand more information from you. You do want that tax refund, right?
(Score: 2) by Snow on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:21PM (6 children)
You'd think that with an annual Revenue of over $5 Billion, they could make a piece of software that wasn't so fucking painful to use.
One of the biggest rackets going.
(Score: 1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:59PM (1 child)
I don't know but I've been told, Eskimo pussy is mighty cold!
(Score: 2) by Gaaark on Wednesday July 17 2019, @11:13PM
The Northern girls with the way they kiss
They keep their boyfriends warm at night
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:31PM
It's *my* ass.
*They* are Intuit.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:31PM
Tell that to my face in my igloo, tough guy.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 18 2019, @08:34AM
Copy the Australian one?
(Score: 2) by ilsa on Thursday July 18 2019, @04:47PM
You have to understand that no amount of money will ever be enough. They will do everything to continue maximizing their profit, because both the law, and Wall St, demand that they do, and they will be castigated if they don't.
The very laws of society not only encourage, but demand, sociopathic behaviour from corporations. And then we're surprised when sociopathic assholes rise up the ranks and run these companies.
(Score: 2, Disagree) by krishnoid on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:41PM (11 children)
If the disabled, unemployed, and student lendees all got together ... they could pay for one copy and just use that. I don't think there's a limit to the number of people who can use an installed copy.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by fustakrakich on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:52PM (5 children)
Yes, they should unite! to vote out the incumbents, and not reelect those who sell their souls.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:34PM (4 children)
To know the value of a soul, you need to have one yourself. That is contraindicated in DC.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2, Informative) by fustakrakich on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:45PM (3 children)
With the feeblest of effort the voters can change that too. It's all upon them to take the initiative.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday July 18 2019, @11:13AM (2 children)
This is true. Bullets aren't very expensive.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Thursday July 18 2019, @05:01PM
Is shooting people all you can think of?
You know you guys are a bit weird, right?
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by etherscythe on Friday July 19 2019, @01:30PM
No, but the externalities in the aftermath of their use are.
"Fake News: anything reported outside of my own personally chosen echo chamber"
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:13PM (3 children)
Does anybody, anywhere, use the installed app and not the online one?
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:26PM (1 child)
I do. Because I want to do my taxes on my own computer instead of 'someone else's computer' e.g. the cloud. I also like to save various alternative 'what if' scenarios to help plan for next year. I save the files on an encrypted thumb drive that then lives in the fireproof safe next to the printed paper copies of the tax forms. Way better than sitting on 'the cloud' just waiting for TurboTax to have some major breach.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 18 2019, @08:29PM
so you use closed source shit from some whore ass company in bed with the government?
(Score: 4, Interesting) by KilroySmith on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:55PM
>>> Does anybody, anywhere, use the installed app and not the online one?
I do. Because I don't trust Intuit as far as I could throw the M*****F*****s.
How valuable do you think having a database of every person in the country, which includes their SS#, Name, Address, Phone, exact earnings, savings (including bank name and account numbers), investments (including investment house and account numbers), deductions, and donations (including those to your church, so they know your religion also)? And updating that database every year? And being the information whores that they are (IMHO), they've got every little bit of it and sell it to as many people as they can - a sale that you don't profit from one iota. You didn't really think it costs on the order of $70 for R&D to update the program every year, did you? And the bastards have a nice cozy relationship with the IRS - that "E-File" that you can do from the app first gets sent to Intuit, who datamines and then sends it to the IRS. No way to send it direct.
And so, I buy TurboTax (or TaxCut, or TaxAct, whichever is cheaper) because the automation simplifies handling of stock option / RSU sales enough to make it worthwhile to me. Then I install and update it on my laptop, then put the laptop in Airplane mode while I do my taxes and print them out.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by SrLnclt on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:39PM
If you plan to efile there is a limit, I believe of 5 tax returns. A number of years ago they tried reducing this to a single return, and caught holy hell in reviews and comments online. They eventually reversed course. If you want to use dead trees and stamps I don't believe there is a limit.
I know a number of people that use a single license to do multiple returns, typically for minor children or for elderly relatives in assisted living.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @09:46PM (21 children)
Like ProPublica's prior hit pieces.
Amazing that so many people want their cake and eat it too. The promise has always been people file for free with simple, uncomplicated returns. The kind of returns that one can do on paper in about one hour. There have always been disqualifications that if one has a certain level of complexity to their return they must choose another option. (In other words, fuck with their revenue stream they can fuck right back...)
No matter your income levels or conditions, you are still welcome to file for free, period. On paper. And you do the sweat work for what forms apply to you.
After I wrote that I looked it up and The IRS does in fact offer electronic versions of the forms that even do the basic math for you, [irs.gov] but you still have to know what you're doing.
I'm sure Intuit has gotten their tits in a wringer and will pay for this, and perhaps they should. Unless they did their homework first.
But it is also amazing how many people want someone else to pay for their responsibilities, and this is one of those instances where my reaction is, "goddamn kids want me to foot their tax prep bill by having to pay higher taxes for the gov to develop another overpriced and underfunctioned piece of gov-designed software? Nah."
OK, you can get the "fuck you's" out of your system now. And right back at'cha.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:09PM (14 children)
"on paper"
lol
Filing tax returns electronically should not be a complicated process and allowing corporations to fuck with customers like this is just wrong. Unfettered capitalism is a cancer on society, it merely allows greedy bastards to do all the shady shit they want in search of profits. So fucking dumb.
It is amusing to see someone complain about entitlement when it comes to the government collecting taxes. The government SHOULD make it as easy and simple as possible to take our money, and private corps shouldn't factor into the process in any way. Now individual accountants? That is where such services should remain, not some rent-seeking website / software that works like shit.
Get your head out of your ass, you're complaining about the symptoms not the actual problems.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:37PM (13 children)
Has nothing to do with capitalism. The corruption under communism was every bit as bad if not worse. The only real chance you have at avoiding it is a dictatorship where the dictator gives a fuck about it for some reason or other. It's rare but at least it's happened before in human history.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 3, Informative) by c0lo on Wednesday July 17 2019, @11:56PM (9 children)
Not in regards with taxes, no, it wasn't.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday July 18 2019, @11:17AM (1 child)
Does it really matter which aspect of the laws were bought and sold to favor one business or individual over another?
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday July 18 2019, @10:32PM
Yes, when it comes to corruption and/or dictatorship, it matters
E.g. if the laws impacting free-speech are "sold", you'll be able to live (if you keep the offending speech not know to authorities).
If the laws regarding the private property are "sold", you may very quickly expropriated "by the eminent authority", a destitute and dead in 30 days of hunger.
The communist regimes started with the second; they used the first only as a pretext to apply the second, but you could be subject to the second even if you kept your mouth shut.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 18 2019, @11:44AM (6 children)
When they own you, they don't need to play games to get what they want.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday July 18 2019, @03:03PM (5 children)
The silver lining - yes there is one - only *they* own you, not the whole corporation and zillions of *their* agencies which each fucks you in a different way.
But yeah, I can see the disadvantage: you don't have the liberty to choose who fucks you and in which hole, after a while you get bored to be fucked in a single way.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday July 19 2019, @12:48AM (4 children)
A hundred masters does sound worse than one. Except that how do the hundred masters "fuck" you? Selling a few bits of information about your buying interests or playing little games that cost you a little money is a far cry from the police state.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday July 19 2019, @12:57AM (3 children)
Some fuck you over the cable/fibre. Others fuck you over the phone. Some others fuck you in physical presence
Some fuck you for taxes. Others for credit rating. Again, some others fuck you in a medical setup that pretend to care about you.
Examples are innumerable.
Should I continue or can you take the words of others [soylentnews.org]?.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday July 19 2019, @11:42PM (2 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 21 2019, @11:15PM (1 child)
Would you like it to be?
I can offer some perspective if you can afford the rent.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday July 22 2019, @12:17AM
Rent is free here. But keep what I said in mind. You're not going anywhere with the argument that 100 minor paper cuts are more dangerous than a bullet to the head.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday July 18 2019, @12:10PM (2 children)
Unrestrained centralization of power, be it under a capitalist or a notionally communist society, leads to this. Capitalism vs communism is a red herring; either system COULD work, neither system DOES work without a hell of a lot of oversight, and as things stand, the advantage in capitalism (decentralization) is being rapidly eroded by globalism and high technology.
Centralization. Of. Power. Doesn't matter how it happens, we're fucked when it happens.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday July 18 2019, @12:25PM (1 child)
Somewhat. The only differences between state/local/national centralization are scope and a slightly larger disconnect between those governing and those governed. The main advantage of freedom of movement and keeping power as local as possible is if your opinion is that where you live sucks, you can easily go elsewhere and live under a kind of suck that better suits your sensibilities.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday July 18 2019, @07:39PM
You don't read so good, do ya boy? That era is quickly coming to a close. Globalization means the people on top, be they corporate or government or the inevitable unholy incestuous offspring of the two, own it all. Everything. Everywhere. You have a history of refusing to see that the border between business and government is blurry to nonexistent at large scale, probably because it would blow gaping holes in the foundation of what I will charitably call your worldview.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 4, Informative) by AthanasiusKircher on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:56PM (3 children)
True. Multiple years and by multiple companies I've been ensnared by such a promise. You spend 30 minutes entering information only to discover some prompt that says, "Oh, actually we can't file for you with your current level -- you need to upgrade by paying us $20/$50/$100+ more." Sometimes the kind of weird exceptions that caused that were completely unpredictable based on the product description. I've wasted several days over the years getting that far with a piece of software only to abandon it and go looking for another cheaper option.
Oh, absolutely. But let me explain something, if you haven't done this. I have. It's been quite a few years since I filled out all the forms for my own return manually. But a couple years ago due to a stupid issue involving my son's income (he was about 6 years old at the time), I gave up trying to file using various software that promised to do it for anyone with income less than X, but then it wouldn't have the right forms or whatever. You see, my son had a very small amount of investment income due to some mutual funds sold or something. When he was only a year old or so, we transferred some money to him, but my wife got some bad advice in how she did it, and it's now stuck in a weird account that belongs to him.
Anyhow, point is that it wasn't a lot of income or a lot of money, but it was enough in some income category that it triggered the IRS threshold where he was required to file a return. He didn't owe tax, but he was legally required to file a return.
And after spending a couple hours trying to use free software and not getting anywhere, I said, "To heck with it!" and went to the IRS to just fill out the forms manually. Have you done this? Have you ever had to read the instructions to file a Schedule D (investment income) yourself? I'm a reasonably smart person with a lot of patience, but the way those instructions are written is absurd. Yes, I got it done, but it took much longer than if it had been reasonably written by a reasonable person.
Point is: The IRS should be legally required to offer simplified instructions that basically mirror the kind of simplified instructions TurboTax or similar products can offer. Yes, obviously there will always be exceptions that require some advanced stuff, but TurboTax somehow manages to handle almost all of that in a plain-language sort of way.
Software? I don't know if it's necessary if the IRS simply provided the kind of plain-language explanations for filling forms that tax prep companies do. And yes, that should be legally required. I have a Ph.D. and I found following the maze of forms and their instructions to be a pain in the ass. What are most Americans supposed to do? If we're effectively forcing people who are stupid to pay for tax prep, that's an additional tax on the stupid, and if we're going to do that, let's try actually instituting a tax on the stupid to pay for government-issued tax software... but I don't think that would go over too well, do you? No, because reasonable tax instructions available to all Americans should be a reasonable and required thing for the IRS to issue by law.
Oh, and as you might already see in links up this thread, apparently there was a deal struck between the IRS and the tax filing companies where they colluded and said the IRS wouldn't develop software as long as free filing is available with people with incomes under X. That sort of collusion is what you're arguing in favor of?
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Thursday July 18 2019, @02:35AM (1 child)
Vote for income tax reform?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 18 2019, @08:36PM
reform? what the fuck is wrong with you people? only cowards, idiots and whores pay the income tax. what are you sheople so scared of? they can't enforce if you don't pay them to! Are you so dumb you think it's patriotic or that it helps the country do things it's supposed to be doing? do you not pay attention to the "news"? or maybe you're just another suited whore ruining this country? don't rock the boat as long as you get yours. fuck you own grandchildren's future like a real piece of shit. i hope you fucks remember what you did when you're going stupid from the Alzheimer's you caused yourself by eating and drinking poison your whole life like a good little slave.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 18 2019, @03:02PM
Grandparent AC here.
Yes, this does happen, and there should be better descriptions of what one can and cannot use free file for, and/or at what point you know you won't be able to use it. The government itself presents it like "Under 66K? It's FREEEEEEEEEEEE!" and it has never been that way. Fault the Government, who deflects the answer off to the free file preparers despite the fact they know it doesn't work that way. Could it become an absolute under $X no matter how you got them? Yep, but I'd expect to cut that back to under $40K total income then, maybe $30K. Someone who takes come about $3,300 a month can afford to set aside $8.33 per month of that for tax software IMO. Someone taking home $1650 a month ($30K / 12 * .66 taxes) probably still could, but I'd give them a clean break.
Yes I have. For fifteen years worth of returns starting from age 16, before I started using a paid product. I filed in years when I didn't have to because my income was low enough. The first few I got to file 1040-EZ, which I found laughably simple. And yes, the default understanding is that if you're able to have investment income then you probably should be paying for a filing product. Even though that unfairly swept you up I don't have a problem with that aspect of the program. People who have investment income can pay for their tax filing.
I'm not a Ph.D., but the last time I chose to file on paper I didn't have much of a problem working through it all. Involved? Yep. Because tax code. But the instructions were a lot simpler than many other multistage products I've had to engage with in my life. Can one replicate guides similar to what the programs do? Yeah, but the real advantage of the tax prep software is that it asks you a string of questions, "Do you A,B,C,D, OR E? Yes? OK, we'll take you through all five. No? We'll skip all of them, then...." The point is that it costs to develop that, and I don't think the system is broken. Right now people pay for convenience and/or because their return is complex, and if return is simple and you don't mind the complications you do it for free. You might have a problem with that, and that's fine. I don't.
Yep. That's the sort of partnership I'm in favor of. Those who need the assistance to be free because they cannot afford $100 of software per year get it for free. Everyone else can pay based on the complexity of their return for the product they need. For example... if you own your own business - you can pay for your tax filing software out of your own money. If you're living off dividends - you can pay for your tax filing software out of your own money.
The alternative is not the Federal Government wasting billions on duplicating that system. The alternative is EVERYBODY gets to pay, period. I'd accept an alternative that under a certain amount of AGI gets to deduct a further fixed amount ($100 or $150 is fine) automatically for what the cost of the software is if they can prove they purchased it, even though that's also a burden to all equally. So yeah, I'll take the system that we have now, and pay my money every year for my copy of tax filing software, and expect anyone else with any complexity to their return to do the same.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by darkfeline on Thursday July 18 2019, @02:29AM (1 child)
Guess who bribed the government to make the taxes so complicated?
Yep, we should totally pay someone for making tax filing simpler, the same person who made tax filing complicated in the first place.
God, I wish I had that kind of job security. Cause problems and get paid to fix them.
Join the SDF Public Access UNIX System today!
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 18 2019, @12:04PM
2) Tax filing software companies bribe government to make the free tax filing software both complex and cost the filer more.
You can't fix a problem by relying on the same broken mechanisms that created the problem in the first place.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:10PM (2 children)
This kind of crap started when the use of cuss words in the class room became a norm.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Username on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:34PM
I agree, taxes is the WORST cuss word.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday July 17 2019, @11:59PM
And you still believe unlimited free speech should be allowed? (large grin)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 17 2019, @10:48PM
Lynyrd Skynyrd was totally misunderstood by a lot of people!
Woopsie
(Score: 3, Interesting) by SomeGuy on Wednesday July 17 2019, @11:27PM
What Intuit should do is partner with smart phone manufacturers, and then get all other forms of tax submission made illegal because it is good for the planet and high-tech and trendy and stuff. Oh, and since it changes every year, you have always have to buy the absolute latest cell phone first.
They would if they could.
Fuck them.
(Score: 2) by GreatAuntAnesthesia on Thursday July 18 2019, @08:46AM (1 child)
From all the griping on this thread, this sounds to me like an open source project just waiting to happen.
If the government isn't going to provide a tool to file your taxes, and the private sector is just going to gouge you and then sell your data on the side, why shouldn't a bunch of US-based coders (with advice / support from a tame tax accountant) just get together to write and release a freeware alternative?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 18 2019, @02:57PM
Because Americans fear the IRS, they wouldn't use it in case there was an error in calculation. Turbotax advertises an "audit guarantee", while the IRS will actually check the figures you send and propose changes if they feel there was a mistake. Even if it results in a greater refund. They will also self apply certain credits you may have missed.
Tax forms for the year come out when? If it is January, it will be pretty tight to get all the changes in before people would want to have their taxes completed.
Historically, many Americans treated their tax refund as sort of an interest free holiday savings scheme. That is, they would file for taxes and two months later get a few grand they overpaid during the year and go on a vacation. Turbotax lends this money out in anticipation for their customers. Trump has tried to curb that abuse of the tax system though, getting the withholding tables changed.
How many of the myriad tax forms will attract developer effort? sa, sb, sd: probably. sc: maybe? sk: uuh. Statement of income from marijuana crops on land affected by a federal disaster declaration: forget about it.