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A recent murder trial involving the most medieval of weapons has recently concluded with a guilty verdict, thanks to some high-tech sleuthing.
From the BBC's report:
Some modern, expensive cars are installed with electronic systems which can track and store information about its movements. This so-called telematics system can be used as a tracking device if the car is stolen. It can also tell when a car's engine is started or stopped and even when a window, door or boot is opened and closed. When combined with evidence of owning a crossbow and bolts of the type used in the murder, it was enough to secure a conviction.
Like a mobile phone on wheels, the system uses a SIM card. Nick Harvey, risk data manager for Plant-I telematics company, said data is live constantly and GPS tracking could be accurate within 5m.
He said over the past 10 years, such tracking had become more commonplace in car technology and security systems and could now help with investigations. "Wherever a vehicle is going, it is sending into a cloud - no matter what happens to that vehicle there is always data behind," he said.
A car belonging to the defendant was found burned several miles away two weeks after the murder, but the incriminating data had long since been sent to the cloud. It placed the owner outside the victim's house at the time of the murder, with timestamps indicating details like the engine being turned off, and when the doors and boot (trunk) were opened and closed.
The complexity of the case saw it generate 5,500 documents and involve a team of 50 police officers before going to a trial lasting five weeks.
"If it wasn't for the electronics, the black box in the Land Rover - which didn't just record information but sent it to Jaguar Land Rover, [the defendant] Whall would have got away with his lies," the jury was told.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:06AM (35 children)
What about BMW, Mercedes and all the other 'mob prestige' vehicles?
If you know this shit is spying on you you aren't going to use your own vehicle.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Booga1 on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:33AM (9 children)
Don't use your own car.
Don't burn the car and make it an obvious crime scene.
Don't take your cellphone with you.
Don't drive past any security cameras.
Don't use a credit card when you buy the crossbow.
Don't touch the crossbow bolts with bare skin at any point.
Don't kill people and maybe you won't have a murder investigation looking into your activities. Just maybe, though. No guarantees.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:48AM (1 child)
"Skip all instructions, and goto EOL."
Just love how programmers conjugate crime. Except for the Rieser guy.
(Score: 5, Funny) by tangomargarine on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:33PM
Whoa, whoa, whoa! Let's keep it civil here; no need to use the G-word.
So in addition to you probably not being a programmer yourself, I'm guessing you've never studied German. For double vowels like that, it's the second one you pronounce (unless there are umlauts involved in the double vowel...then good luck): it's spelled Reiser.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:58PM (3 children)
I prefer to live by this one first, but as you say...
Duh.
Seriously, if you're going to do a murder, you'd better be able to at least pull off car theft.
Good luck with that one - I think a better precaution is tinted windows (bring the tint with you when you steal the car, it's not like you have to do a good job on the install...)
I think this one is debatable... a 55 gallon drum filled with gasoline (now, there's a trick: buying $150 in fuel without a credit card...) and a scuba tank to drive the gasoline out through a quick and dirty sprinkler system always seemed like a (suspiciously specific) interesting way to light both the vehicle and the crime scene solidly ablaze - perp can leave the scene on an e-bike.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by Osamabobama on Thursday February 27 2020, @10:15PM (2 children)
You could probably add to the list 'don't discuss your suspiciously specific methods on a registered forum.'
Appended to the end of comments you post. Max: 120 chars.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:51PM
But, the idea is slowly refining... the SCUBA tank was never used in practice - 'twas but a hypothetical plot of how to deal with a crack house that the city lawyers had been unable to shut down for 10+ years. Away from Miami, the SCUBA tank might be harder to come by, but... a propane tank would not only supply high pressure propellant (getting higher as the tank warms up), but also extra fuel, and propane tanks are bloody everywhere.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Friday February 28 2020, @03:17AM
This is a poseur thread. Only the most stupid of criminals would use those methods. As others have suggested, stealing cars and/or plates and then ditching them after committing the crime is what most small-time crooks do around here.
To deal with getting rid of a car properly requires a whole criminal enterprise, preferably a cross-border one. And that's insanely difficult to do nowadays in California. I remember back when peoples' cars were getting old and they just wanted the insurance money, they'd have it "stolen" and driven across the border into Mexico when back then there was no traceability. Now, it is goddamn impossible to drive a junker into Mex. You have to let a few middlemen and crooked freight companies that specialize in junked cars to do it for you.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:06PM
Don't have anything to hide, citizen. You are being monitored for your protection.
(Score: 3, Informative) by dry on Friday February 28 2020, @04:19AM
Judging by the number of people the innocence project have saved from execution, that's the hard one if you're part of the wrong demographic.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Friday February 28 2020, @03:13PM
Marked insightful. But there are some issues with every one of the items...
Use someone else's car with their permission and then they know. Steal a car and risk being caught (especially in an age of automated license plate scanners), although this is less risky than the murder. Hopefully you aren't pulled over after committing the murder with your crossbow in the vehicle still.
Don't burn the car and risk leaving trace evidence, like your DNA, behind.
Don't take your cellphone and you need to know whatever was happening wherever your cellphone was. ("I'm sorry, sir, but cable service in your neighborhood went out during the whole time you say you were watching the SuperBowl on your TV".)
Don't drive past any security cameras is impossible in the UK, but if you were to do so wear a mask of someone else. It almost worked for Dabney Coleman's character in Columbo episode Murder of a Rock Star...
Using cash for your purchase may make you even more memorable to the staff wherever you bought the crossbow at. Buy used (far less traceable), or use someone else's credit card that you've stolen (a much lesser crime).
You can touch the bolts with bare skin, just wipe them down with a protein denaturer that also degreaser before firing. Or buy bolts with a surface that will not pick up prints and skin flakes.
And as you say, no guarantees. Just because you aren't the murderer doesn't mean the police and prosecuting attorney can't turn your life into a living hell that would make you accept a plea bargain even though you didn't do it.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by sjames on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:54AM (14 children)
I have no intention of killing anyone, let alone with a crossbow, but I DO find the idea of a car keeping a log in the cloud of everywhere I go more than a little creepy.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:20AM (1 child)
the biggest problem is that other guys with crossbows can buy access to this data when they want to kill their next victim.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Friday February 28 2020, @03:20AM
The biggest problem is that unlike firearms, convicted felons can walk right into a sports store and walk right out with a crossbow.
Hell, if a convicted felon wanted something deadly enough to level "big game" and had the money to afford it, they could easily and legally buy an air rifle [airforceairguns.com] that was up to the task.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:22AM (3 children)
How can it be turned off?
Are people required to sign away their rights when buying?
Do they tell people?
Who pays for this?
Who ownes the data?
Is this data collection legal?
(Score: 2) by kazzie on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:44AM (1 child)
And that gets even murkier for any second-hand sales...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @12:02PM
You can stops and won't move because it hasn't spoken to home base via phone sim call in 3 months.
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Friday February 28 2020, @03:25PM
n.b.: And will enough people care to make any difference?
This sig for rent.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @10:53AM
1 coronavirus apocalypse, 1 kill
(Score: 2) by driverless on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:19PM (6 children)
I just killed someone with a crossbow about fifteen minutes ago. Well, technically something, fourth possum in the last two weeks. Crossbows are brilliant for this, completely silent, fit them with a torch and a RDS and they're perfect for taking out nocturnal pest animals without having to worry about someone panicking about hearing a gunshot at night. Hope they're finally being thinned down, the damage they do to the fruit trees is tremendous.
Sometimes medieval weapons are the best ones...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:55PM
Real Gentlemen use a mace.
(Score: 2) by sjames on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:13PM (1 child)
Sounds like you need one of these [youtube.com].
(Score: 2) by driverless on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:24PM
In theory the ideal thing would be the Cobra Adder which was derived from Joerg's work, but really you don't need repeat-fire capability so much as an ability to track a dark moving target at night. Possums move pretty slowly so once you've acquired the target you're almost certain to hit it, the problem is finding the thing. So a coaxial long-throw torch paired with an RDS is the perfect combination.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:40PM
Entertainment and dinner in one.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Friday February 28 2020, @03:23AM (1 child)
I actually considered that option for home defense, because if I had to defend myself with a firearm in California, myself rather than the invader would be treated like the criminal and would be bankrupted by legal fees. Then I'd be sued in court by the criminal for racism and cruel and unusual punishment.
Only problem with the crossbow is, you only get one shot through the eye-socket and into the skull, and if you miss that shot, that jumped-up crackhead is going to have your ass even with the ass-end of a bolt sticking out of his chest.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 28 2020, @03:30PM
Backup with a good kitchen butcher knife. (Why, yes, I'd been enjoying some nice cheese and crackers in bed earlier and thus my best knife was right at the bedside! ... Also, gives an excuse and mandate to enjoy cheese and crackers in bed every evening if you can avoid the crumbs.)
And you'll be just as screwed for using a crossbow as with a firearm. Moreso, probably. You'll likely need to defend yourself either way, and that can happen even in the reddest-of-red Stand Your Ground states if the prosecutor thinks it will get him or her good publicity.
(Score: 4, Funny) by MostCynical on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:00AM (6 children)
no, sales in Saudi Arabia and similar places will increase - cars with built-in wife tracking - no need to install extra devices!
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @12:12PM (3 children)
This is complete bullshit.
The husband puts the software on the phone and locks it with a code before giving it to the wife.
No need at all for the car to track the wife.
Are females even allowed to drive there yet?
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @09:41PM (1 child)
Islam is right about women and homosexuals.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @10:02PM
Go join them then.
Maybe you will piss one of them off badly enough that they will cut off your junk put you in a dress and treat you like a woman.
Maybe you'll like it.
(Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:06PM
Yes. I believe as of last year sometime.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:52PM (1 child)
"DURRR WUHMANS RIGHTS"
Stupid white fuck.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:40PM
stupid? you don't like the internet? If it were up to your race you'd still be grunting with the wind. fucking monkey.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:36PM
First rule of mob recruits: they aren't terribly bright.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:25PM (1 child)
If those cop shows have taught me anything, it's to steal the car that I use while committing a crime.
"Oh hey, somebody got the license plate of the vehicle"
"Yea but it was reported stolen this morning"
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by dry on Friday February 28 2020, @04:29AM
Don't steal, borrow. Most people don't keep close track of their mileage and will never realize their car/van was missing between 3:00 am and 4:00 am.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:29AM (8 children)
Someone drugged this guy to knock him out
Made a silicon mask and wig to look like him
Wore clothes to cover skin and makeup to match skin tone
Took his car and phone
Got a crossbow (bonus points for buying a crossbow and bolts while dressed as him using his apple pay)
Drove to someone's house
... Window.. Boot.. Door. Engine.. Bolt shoot.. Leave
Burn car
Throw phone and crossbow into lake or river or burn
Leg it.
...
Sit back to watch the mayhem unfold
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:32AM
Mayhem?!?
Call M.A.S.K.!
(Score: 4, Informative) by kazzie on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:42AM (3 children)
Good (if scary) thinking, but the defendant also got caught with some lies about his ownership of the crossbow. He said he'd sold his crossbow months previously, but there were records of him buying bolts for the it (of the type used in the murder) after that date.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:44AM (2 children)
Yes, I did purchase bolts. For the crossbow I used to own. Then I realized later that I had sold it. So that was silly. Oh well. It's only money. Sometimes I walk up to the wrong car and fail to open it with my key. It happens.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:07PM
It was an accident. I was cleaning it and didn't know it was loaded. My Land Rover was in the shop as usual.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Friday February 28 2020, @03:27AM
Easy to do. Whenever I go into a grocery store I instinctively walk over to the booze aisle and load up before I realize, "Oh shit, I just came here to buy food and have to go to work in an hour."
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday February 27 2020, @01:33PM (1 child)
(Score: 2) by Booga1 on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:24PM
Nah, the M.A.S.K. theme song [youtube.com] is pretty standard 80's rock.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:13PM
That would attract scooby doo and the case would for sure get solved by those darn kids
(Score: 2) by SomeGuy on Thursday February 27 2020, @09:07AM (4 children)
Oh my, tracking did something good! We must all be tracked! We love tracking! We love big brother! More tracking please! Tracking will catch all murderers. You can't be too safe, think of the children, pollywannacracker!
Please kill me.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by stretch611 on Thursday February 27 2020, @09:33AM
Just add another quote about the need for giving all encryption keys to the FBI/CIA/NSA and Bill Barr will immediately hire you on as a consultant.
Now with 5 covid vaccine shots/boosters altering my DNA :P
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday February 27 2020, @01:34PM (2 children)
With a crossbow, amirite?
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Thursday February 27 2020, @05:08PM (1 child)
Crossbow not the best way to go, I think.
I would prefer to be decaffeinated by guillotine.
When trying to solve a problem don't ask who suffers from the problem, ask who profits from the problem.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday February 28 2020, @06:40AM
It doesn't work in quite the same way as Taster's Choice, but it must be conceded that the guillotine will also decaffeinate you.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Thursday February 27 2020, @10:18AM (10 children)
Setting aside the moral dimensions of the crime, the choice of weapon is interesting. It's a quiet option. Some recent models are crazy powerful, too. The Nitro XRT shoots 470 feet-per-second.
Guns can be quiet, too, though, if you use subsonic ammo. I've watched videos of a guy testing it on a range and the loudest sound the weapon made was not from the shot but from the chamber slamming back with the recoil.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:49AM (4 children)
maybe the paperwork is simpler. obviously not as simple as they guy hoped, since they did track it to him, but a gun may also require background checks etc.
(Score: 2) by kazzie on Thursday February 27 2020, @12:40PM (3 children)
Guns certainly require more checks in GB: everything requires a firearm certificate from the police, detailing who will be resopnsible for the weapon, why they have a "good reason" to keep a firearm, and where it will be stored. And some categories of firearm (e.g. pistols/handguns) are banned outright.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:44PM (2 children)
i suggest brits start running guns before all of your daughters are pimped out by musrats.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @09:57PM (1 child)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal [wikipedia.org]
Too late
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday February 28 2020, @06:38AM
Can someone explain why that's a thing in Britain? I know what the technical definition of grooming gangs is, but how the hell did that develop in the UK and nowhere else, and how on God's green Earth have the British authorities deported or imprisoned all of them? How have British vigilantes not taken care of the miscreants if the crimes are as widespread as they're reported to be?
How is it possible that the indomitable nation that faced down the Nazis has come to this?
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:12PM (4 children)
Difference being: subsonic ammo is obvious stealth tech, while crossbow bolts are nothing special but just as stealth.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday February 27 2020, @09:19PM (3 children)
Yes, but subsonic ammo comes in a multi-shot clip, whereas crossbows are generally not repeating.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:47PM (2 children)
If you're going for a stealth kill, you really want to get the take down with the first shot. Hypothetically speaking.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday February 28 2020, @06:35AM (1 child)
Yes, but where's the fun in that?
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Friday February 28 2020, @01:37PM
Well, I've only taken down squirrels - and those with a mini crossbow pistol - but... even if the pistol could fire again in 1/2 second, if I miss with the first shot, the second and later shots become much harder with the target running away. Sport, as you say... not great for the "no witnesses" goal.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 3, Interesting) by bradley13 on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:09AM (5 children)
While it's all well and good that a murderer has been found, one must ask: at what cost? How many people know that modern cars collect this kind of data? I certainly didn't.
I have to wonder if this data collection is compliant with the GDPR, which certainly does (well, did) apply to the UK.
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:46PM (4 children)
I'd love to hear an explanation as to why all this data was being collected by default in the first place. It's one thing if location data gets sent back in response to a car being reported as stolen or a warrant, but in this case, it appears that the data is being sent constantly without cause.
Some of it could be legitimate data that's needed to ensure that the model of car is functioning properly, but why on earth would they need to know about the location of the car if it's not stolen or subject to a warrant of some sort?
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:22PM (1 child)
And when doors and the trunk are opened? Jesus Christ WTF
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @10:06PM
Welcome to the new age.
Most people don't realise Windows10 is spying on them to send data back to Microsoft.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Friday February 28 2020, @03:28AM (1 child)
Any well-designed piece of technology is going to log every little damn event that occurs. Makes it easy to troubleshoot and identify trends for failure analysis.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 28 2020, @04:56AM
Perhaps, but that's no excuse for uploading it to the internet. If there's a legitimate need for that information, then they should need the car in their possession. Situations where cars just burst into flames randomly are more or less non-existent and even when that happens, the fire marshal usually knows how to find the cause of the fire.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:47AM (3 children)
What the fuck is the point of this spy tech anyway?
Because Land Rover hopes to somehow monetize your data?
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:51PM (1 child)
> Because Land Rover hopes to somehow monetize your data?
Are you a stupid white man? Yes you are.
Ever heard of dual use technologies? Stupid fuck.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @05:11PM
Sarcasm and rhetorical questions: look them up. You would make YOURSELF just a little less stupid if you did.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:19PM
Not just Landrover. I went to a car show recently and every single car had GPS and a telescreen. From the lowliest shitbox up.
The manufacturers will monetize everyone. Can the systems be torn out and the cars still run? Looks like I'll have to keep my car running for as long as I can.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:34PM (1 child)
It can also tell when a car's engine is started or stopped and even when a window, door or boot is opened and closed.
Webster says ": a large rigid piece of luggage used usually for transporting clothing and personal effects
(2) : the luggage compartment of an automobile".
OED says "[countable] the space at the back of a car that you put bags, cases, etc. in", which is not how Englishmen use the word. I can't understand why the word "boot" is used. Why "boot"?
On the other hand, I don't understand why we Americans call a lift an "elevator". Why are we using a three syllable word when there's a one syllable word that is an exact synonym? Especially when we so often shorten longer words, like "temperature" or "progressive"?
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:04PM
You're right. I'd have called them Chazzwazzas.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:50PM (4 children)
They don't even pay attention to what they are buying, and the change in tech.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:07PM
One white boi vs. an army of tyrants.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:19PM (2 children)
why specifically men? why specifically whitey?
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @10:08PM (1 child)
He did say. They are idiots.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday February 28 2020, @06:48AM
This is demonstrably false. White men will not become idiots until sometime around 2505 when President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Herbert Camacho takes office.
Right now the title of idiots-in-chief is held by workers at a certain Level 4 bioweapons lab in a certain city who sell discarded lab animals for meat in their city to make extra cash. Those are not just idiots, they are fucking idiots.
Washington DC delenda est.