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posted by martyb on Thursday July 16 2020, @05:57PM   Printer-friendly
from the worth-a-shot dept.

Common FDA-approved drug may effectively neutralize virus that causes COVID-19:

A common drug, already approved by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), may also be a powerful tool in fighting COVID-19, according to research published this week in Antiviral Research.

SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, uses a surface spike protein to latch onto human cells and initiate infection. But heparin, a blood thinner also available in non-anticoagulant varieties, binds tightly with the surface spike protein, potentially blocking the infection from happening. This makes it a decoy, which might be introduced into the body using a nasal spray or nebulizer and run interference to lower the odds of infection. Similar decoy strategies have already shown promise in curbing other viruses, including influenza A, Zika, and dengue.

"This approach could be used as an early intervention to reduce the infection among people who have tested positive, but aren't yet suffering symptoms. But we also see this as part of a larger antiviral strategy," said Robert Linhardt, lead author and a professor of chemistry and chemical biology at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute. "Ultimately, we want a vaccine, but there are many ways to combat a virus, and as we've seen with HIV, with the right combination of therapies, we can control the disease until a vaccine is found."

To infect a cell, a virus must first latch onto a specific target on the cell surface, slice through the cell membrane, and insert its own genetic instructions, hijacking the cellular machinery within to produce replicas of the virus. But the virus could just as easily be persuaded to lock onto a decoy molecule, provided that molecule offers the same fit as the cellular target. Once bound to a decoy, the virus would be neutralized, unable to infect a cell or free itself, and would eventually degrade.

[...] "That's exceptional, extremely tight binding," said Jonathan Dordick, a chemical and biological engineering professor at Rensselaer who is collaborating with Linhardt to develop the decoy strategy. "It's hundreds of thousands of times tighter than a typical antibody antigen. Once it binds, it's not going to come off."

Journal Reference:
So Young Kima, Weihua Jin, Amika Sood, et al. Characterization of heparin and severe acute respiratory syndrome-related coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) spike glycoprotein binding interactions [$], (DOI: 10.1016/j.antiviral.2020.104873)


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  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by fustakrakich on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:12PM (14 children)

    by fustakrakich (6150) on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:12PM (#1022502) Journal

    The patent is expired

    --
    La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by DannyB on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:40PM (4 children)

      by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:40PM (#1022507) Journal

      Can they not simply add a new coloring or coating or some trivial modification to enable them to re-patent it?

      Without patents, we could be facing the danger a drug being made by many manufacturers, with low prices and easy availability.

      --
      Universal health care is so complex that only 32 of 33 developed nations have found a way to make it work.
      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Opportunist on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:10PM (2 children)

        by Opportunist (5545) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:10PM (#1022552)

        We can't have that, affordable medication, that sounds like communism!

        • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:17PM (1 child)

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:17PM (#1022557)

          I didn't force a bunch of lab techs to work overtime just to sell drugs at reasonable prices! Does no one care about freedom anymore?

          • (Score: 2) by Opportunist on Friday July 17 2020, @10:03AM

            by Opportunist (5545) on Friday July 17 2020, @10:03AM (#1022818)

            Careful there, a friend of mine and hobby chemist got into trouble because he was working overtime and manufactured affordable drugs.

      • (Score: 3, Informative) by istartedi on Thursday July 16 2020, @11:19PM

        by istartedi (123) on Thursday July 16 2020, @11:19PM (#1022627) Journal

        Can they not simply add a new coloring or coating or some trivial modification to enable them to re-patent it?

        Maybe not, but they can Do a few clinical trials, re-name it, and mark it up astronomically [wikipedia.org]

        --
        Appended to the end of comments you post. Max: 120 chars.
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:00PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:00PM (#1022518)

      It's interesting this was discovered with no help from patents. Patents aren't always necessary.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @10:05PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @10:05PM (#1023093)

        That's commie talk. If you don't restrict yourself to patented technology, how do you prevent other people from profiting off your work? Only commies do things that benefit humanity without getting their beaks adequately whetted.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:19PM (4 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:19PM (#1022524)

      Is the patient is expired?

      • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:47PM (3 children)

        by fustakrakich (6150) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:47PM (#1022539) Journal

        Yes, it still is

        --
        La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
        • (Score: 2) by HiThere on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:56PM (2 children)

          by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:56PM (#1022590) Journal

          Even on the modified heparin that doesn't thin the blood?

          --
          Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
          • (Score: 3, Funny) by fustakrakich on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:04PM (1 child)

            by fustakrakich (6150) on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:04PM (#1022595) Journal

            Don't know. I only looked up heparin patent date on Google and took the answer with the biggest font

            --
            La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @10:07PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @10:07PM (#1023094)

              Careful there. That technique might be patented.

    • (Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Friday July 17 2020, @03:19AM (1 child)

      by hendrikboom (1125) on Friday July 17 2020, @03:19AM (#1022729) Homepage Journal

      They just need to patent a new way of using for heparin.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @11:44AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @11:44AM (#1022855)

        Just add "on a computer" and they're good for another 20 years.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:33PM (2 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:33PM (#1022504)

    "It's hundreds of thousands of times tighter than a typical antibody antigen. Once it binds, it's not going to come off."

    Que the FlexSeal guy and a demo of a microscopic boat treated with FlexSeal getting covered with Covid-19 viruses...

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:55PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:55PM (#1022516)
    • (Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:20PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:20PM (#1022558)

      So... Should I snort the White or Black FlexSeal® to prevent covid?
      Or is it the Master or Slave FlexSeal®?
      Maybe I'll just get the clear FlexSeal®. Don't want to offend some dumbfuck.

  • (Score: 3, Informative) by fadrian on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:42PM (10 children)

    by fadrian (3194) on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:42PM (#1022508) Homepage

    ... because Heparin is so benign... Try internal bleeding and lack of clotting for starters (I mean, that's what it's designed to do) - probably increases BP and chance of stroke, as well.

    --
    That is all.
    • (Score: 2, Insightful) by taylormc on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:49PM

      by taylormc (5751) on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:49PM (#1022513)

      Lack of clotting could be a plus for some patients in whom Covid-19 causes excess clotting.

    • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Thexalon on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:57PM

      by Thexalon (636) on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:57PM (#1022517)

      Also, we should not change our activities based on the assumption that the supply is sufficient, or that this study was released for any purpose other than to increase the sales of heparin.

      At this point, as best as I can tell: Doctors currently have a pretty good treatment regimen for Covid-19 that works well enough that you probably won't die from it. That doesn't mean that their capacity to provide that treatment is sufficient to handle the approximately 3 million cases that will occur if we all start pretending that we don't need to worry about the pandemic anymore. It also doesn't mean that you won't have a bunch of organ damage that will continue to cause problems for you the rest of your life.

      --
      The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
    • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Freeman on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:15PM (1 child)

      by Freeman (732) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:15PM (#1022523) Journal

      From the summary:

      But heparin, a blood thinner also available in non-anticoagulant varieties

      So, I assume, they'd be using the non-anticoagulant variety.

      --
      Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
      • (Score: 4, Interesting) by RS3 on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:00PM

        by RS3 (6367) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:00PM (#1022546)

        Thank you, I was just about to post that.

        I'll add: if you're already having blood clots due to COVID, you might need some anti-coagulant heparin.

    • (Score: 2) by chewbacon on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:22PM

      by chewbacon (1032) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:22PM (#1022525)

      Heparin is fine when used safely. It also has contraindications, like other drugs. If bleeding to death concerns you, heparin can also be reversed with protamine.

    • (Score: 3, Funny) by EvilSS on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:24PM (1 child)

      by EvilSS (1456) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:24PM (#1022526)
      I hear it even prevents some patients from reading the entire summary for an article!
      • (Score: 2) by RS3 on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:03PM

        by RS3 (6367) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:03PM (#1022548)

        Or maybe it's the lack thereof? :)

    • (Score: 1) by ncc74656 on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:34PM

      by ncc74656 (4917) on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:34PM (#1022585) Homepage

      because Heparin is so benign... Try internal bleeding and lack of clotting for starters

      TFA refers to "non-anticoagulant varieties" of heparin, which are apparently a thing.

    • (Score: 2) by HiThere on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:59PM

      by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:59PM (#1022593) Journal

      The summary stated that there were multiple variants of heparin that all worked, and that some of them were not blood thinners.

      --
      Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
    • (Score: 2) by sjames on Friday July 17 2020, @09:33AM

      by sjames (2882) on Friday July 17 2020, @09:33AM (#1022814) Journal

      Heparin is given to practically all hospital patients these days. A nurse goes room to room with a cart loaded with single use pre-loaded injectors every day.

      No reason why it would increase BP.

  • (Score: 2) by Bot on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:47PM (5 children)

    by Bot (3902) on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:47PM (#1022510) Journal

    >"Ultimately, we want a vaccine, but (...) with the right combination of therapies, we can control the disease until a vaccine is found."

    Ah the good ol' time when medicine was about finding the CURE. Here we want the vaccine and in the meantime the treatment. Kudos for the honesty. Maybe in a couple decades they will talk about getting people in a state of constant need of therapy and profiting from it.

    --
    Account abandoned.
    • (Score: 2) by RS3 on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:08PM

      by RS3 (6367) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:08PM (#1022551)

      What, and let the genie out of the bottle? (it's an English expression- might not be known world-wide...)

    • (Score: 2) by Opportunist on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:12PM (1 child)

      by Opportunist (5545) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:12PM (#1022554)

      Don't let perfect be the enemy of good. Just because we have a way to control it doesn't mean that there ain't a LOT more money to be made with a cure, especially considering that the stopgap we have here isn't under patent anymore and anyone can manufacture it.

      • (Score: 2) by Bot on Monday July 20 2020, @04:19AM

        by Bot (3902) on Monday July 20 2020, @04:19AM (#1023977) Journal

        I underline what I quoted: ULTIMATELY we want a vaccine....

        --
        Account abandoned.
    • (Score: 2) by ChrisMaple on Friday July 17 2020, @01:23AM

      by ChrisMaple (6964) on Friday July 17 2020, @01:23AM (#1022685)

      Heparin is a drug that is administered by injection; a brief look suggests that it costs about $30/day.

      It's unfortunate that heparin is only given by injection. Heparin is a natural product, so there is a good chance that supplement manufacturers could legally supply the stuff. That could cause the price, already not bad, to become more affordable.

      Humans and many other animals make their own heparin. Perhaps there is some way to stimulate its production.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @01:39AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @01:39AM (#1022694)

      You don't need a vaccine. If you eat the feces of a covid patient you will safely gain immunity.

  • (Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:48PM (38 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @06:48PM (#1022512)

    "Ultimately, we want a vaccine, but there are many ways to combat a virus, and as we've seen with HIV, with the right combination of therapies, we can control the disease until a vaccine is found."

    After 40 years of trying, there still is no vaccine for HIV.

    • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Thexalon on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:05PM (36 children)

      by Thexalon (636) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:05PM (#1022520)

      It's true that there's no vaccine for HIV. On the other hand, because of the treatments currently available, a friend of mine has lived for decades with HIV, instead of dying like he would have had he caught it about 5 years earlier.

      Oh, and HIV, like Covid-19, would have been far less of a problem had government officials not ignored scientific recommendations and tried to suppress the spread of accurate information for political reasons, and also skimped on testing and prevention because they didn't want to spend the money to do it.

      --
      The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
      • (Score: 2) by Freeman on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:28PM (32 children)

        by Freeman (732) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:28PM (#1022527) Journal

        Still, the #1 protection against HIV is don't swap bodily fluids with random people. One would assume, that wouldn't be too much of a problem. Until you factor all of the people in who just don't care. Druggies who share needles, people who frequently change sex partners and have unprotected sex. As far as I can tell, those are the two main sources of infection. Most people aren't swapping bodily fluids in other ways and infection via Hospitals aren't terribly high. So, HIV is something we should be able to eradicate in the USA, but won't. Since people like their sex and drugs. We're not as bad off as essentially the entire continent of Africa with regards to HIV, because we have the means to combat it.

        --
        Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
        • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:49PM

          by DeathMonkey (1380) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:49PM (#1022541) Journal

          Still, the #1 protection against HIV is don't swap bodily fluids with random people.

          Same with COVID, it's just you need a lot less fluid!

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:11PM (24 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:11PM (#1022553)

          Drug needles and sex.

          You are right about the transmission modes, but only partially correct about the sex mode because it is not sex in general that is a vector, but (in the USA) having anal sex with a man who sometimes indulges in taking it up the ass ending in a rectum full of HIV laden semen -or- who enjoys shooting up drugs that is the problem. Don't take it up the ass from a man who is not in a monogamous relationship with you, but if you must, take PREP prophylactic drug and convince him to wear a condom. Don't have sex with druggies.

          As for the bisexual men who have sex with women and don't tell them that they are also screwing other men, those men are overwhelmingly black. The community term for them is "downlow brother." Most insist they are not gay, and they are not in a hurry to announce their side action. Sucks to be the female victim (usually black) in this.

          After all, we have had HIV in America since the 80s. If it were sexually transmitted easily outside of those groups, we would ALL have it, but instead infections fall on only particular small groups of people--always the same groups.

          HIV/AIDS is not remotely a problem for the majority of Americans and never will be.

          Now, Africa is another story. It is rampant in Southern Africa (maybe elsewhere in the continent too).
          They have different sexual practices than Americans. I read they like "dry sex" so the women put astringent herbs in their pussy to dry it up some. This could lead to easier transmission due to microtears in the vaginal mucosa during sex. They could also sleep around more and never get treated for diseases. They might have more anal sex. For whatever reason, in Southern Africa at least, it is a widespread problem along with rape.

          • (Score: 2, Informative) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:41PM (23 children)

            by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:41PM (#1022612) Journal

            Public service announcement that gay women are cleaner than anyone else by every single measure of STDs except, if i remember right, an almost insignificant measure of one mild strain of chlamydia :) The problem is male biology, not gays in general. Men are filthy.

            --
            I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
            • (Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:53PM (7 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:53PM (#1022619)

              Says the menstruator.

              • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Friday July 17 2020, @01:30AM (3 children)

                by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Friday July 17 2020, @01:30AM (#1022689) Journal

                Menstruation isn't a disease, honey :) And we have these wonderful inventions called pads, tampons, and even the moon cup for the crunchier granola types out there than I.

                --
                I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @01:34PM (2 children)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @01:34PM (#1022883)

                  You said women were cleaner than men.
                  Menstruation with its bloody, fishy mess is not clean. Who denies that?
                  I accept both sexes as they are, but being lesbian, penises gross you out. Penises are as vital to life as menstruation. Nothing "wrong" with them.

                  • (Score: 3, Informative) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:24AM (1 child)

                    by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:24AM (#1023142) Journal

                    Believe it or not, it's not dicks that gross me out, it's who and what they're attached to. I think they're pretty silly-looking, but not outright gross. Would be kind of hypocritical for someone who owns a strapon otherwise, right?

                    --
                    I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
                    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 18 2020, @02:08AM

                      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 18 2020, @02:08AM (#1023186)

                      <3

              • (Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Friday July 17 2020, @03:26AM (2 children)

                by hendrikboom (1125) on Friday July 17 2020, @03:26AM (#1022731) Homepage Journal

                It's been said before: If HIV is God's punishment, then nonbisexual lesbians are God's chosen.

                -- hendrik

                • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @01:37PM (1 child)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @01:37PM (#1022884)

                  Normal people and people who aren't IV druggies have nothing to fear from HIV. It remains a disease of deviants to this day. Other STDs may be a threat, but not HIV. Sorry.

                  • (Score: 2) by meustrus on Friday July 17 2020, @03:26PM

                    by meustrus (4961) on Friday July 17 2020, @03:26PM (#1022920)

                    Normal people these days sleep around. Maybe it's a smaller problem in Utah, but it's still a problem for anyone who doesn't exclusively start having sex with virgins.

                    --
                    If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @02:41AM (8 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @02:41AM (#1022706)

              The problem is male biology, not gays in general.

              I see no problem with male biology, so that remark is likely an expression of opinion.
              Presenting it as a fact is disingenuous and potentially offensive.

              • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Friday July 17 2020, @02:53AM (7 children)

                by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Friday July 17 2020, @02:53AM (#1022713) Journal

                The numbers say what they say. Gay women are cleanest, followed by straights of both sexes (I forget the order), trailed by gay men. The common factor is men. We can speculate as to why this is so (relative levels of promiscuity, relative risks of any given sexual behavior, etc.) but those risk factors have their roots in biology too. Having multiple partners is dangerous, penetrative sex is dangerous, semen carries disease, and damage to the rectal and colonic mucosa is a disease vector.

                This is not to say all men without exception are STD carriers, just that due to the above reasons they are statistically more likely to be, and certain men more than others. Of course a monogamous gay man is likely to be much cleaner than a promiscuous straight man, and a lesbian with a lot of partners is going to be more of a risk than a monogamous one.

                --
                I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
                • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday July 17 2020, @03:17AM (5 children)

                  by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Friday July 17 2020, @03:17AM (#1022726) Journal

                  Gay women are cleanest, followed by straights of both sexes (I forget the order), trailed by gay men.

                  Careful with that Nirvana [wikipedia.org] of yours, keep it under control; you're balancing on the brink of saying sexual reproduction is a problem.

                  Do you really-really feel the need of publicly demonstrating your life-style superiority, or maybe your superiority, to the point of indulging in fallacies?

                  --
                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @05:18AM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @05:18AM (#1022779)

                    You wrote "fallacies" and I read "phalluses".

                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @08:36AM (1 child)

                    by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @08:36AM (#1022806)

                    As a straight male I read those comments as factual observations. Not feeling attacked in any way, you must have some insecurities about your sexual proclivities ;)

                    • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday July 17 2020, @09:28AM

                      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Friday July 17 2020, @09:28AM (#1022812) Journal

                      As a straight male I read those comments as factual observations

                      I'm not objecting to the factual observations, I'm objecting to the conclusions derived from them ("The problem is is male biology, " followed by "Gay women are cleanest, followed by straights of both sexes (I forget the order), trailed by gay men.")

                      I'm quite sure STD-es aren't the most critical things when considering the various compromises leading to the evolution of procreation by penetrative sex for a significant enough part of the animal regnum. Were it to be such a big problem, all the species relying on this mode would simply have gone extinct after such a long time [wikipedia.org] (or evolve into something not using it).

                      --
                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
                  • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:21AM (1 child)

                    by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:21AM (#1023138) Journal

                    No, I just find it 1) hilarious and 2) a useful counterpoint to the conservative wharrgarbl about "hurr hurr duh homer-sexshuls are pits of plague and filth!!11111one"

                    --
                    I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
                    • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday July 18 2020, @01:27AM

                      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Saturday July 18 2020, @01:27AM (#1023166) Journal

                      Got it. Now. I mean only now.
                      (maybe you can work it next time in the first post, causes for the Poe's law and whatnot? Anyway, fridays are just not my days lately)

                      --
                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:11AM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:11AM (#1023129)

                  Not really, there's a very good reason why gay men wound up with highest rate of infection, there's no actual sex ed being provided for them and asking a doctor tends to lead to responses between "I don't know" and "Get the hell out of this office faggot." Back during the height of the AIDS epidemic before people knew much about what was really going on, it was even worse.

            • (Score: 2) by RS3 on Friday July 17 2020, @05:13AM (1 child)

              by RS3 (6367) on Friday July 17 2020, @05:13AM (#1022775)

              > Men are filthy.

              Inherently, or by bad habits?

              • (Score: 3, Informative) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:22AM

                by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:22AM (#1023139) Journal

                Mostly bad habits, though some of it is down to basic biology unfortunately.

                --
                I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
            • (Score: 2) by RS3 on Friday July 17 2020, @06:25AM (1 child)

              by RS3 (6367) on Friday July 17 2020, @06:25AM (#1022798)

              BTW, that's a very interesting perspective. I've thought of women as being more vulnerable to disease than men, but I see your point that men are more the disease carriers and spreaders.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:14AM

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 18 2020, @12:14AM (#1023130)

                It's more a byproduct of the worst STI of all, pregnancy. Women have gotten more sexually active in recent years due to effective birth control methods and less risky abortion options, but ultimately, there's much more incentive for women to be careful than there is for me.

            • (Score: 0, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @06:14PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 17 2020, @06:14PM (#1022993)

              Men are filthy.

              And ugly! Especially the pastel colored ones! That why they hate black people, you know. The black man is pretty. Just ask Mohamed Ali. The white man is jealous

            • (Score: 2) by Bot on Monday July 20 2020, @05:05AM

              by Bot (3902) on Monday July 20 2020, @05:05AM (#1023984) Journal

              Best way to avoid STD is continence. You're welcome.

              --
              Account abandoned.
        • (Score: 5, Touché) by Opportunist on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:14PM

          by Opportunist (5545) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:14PM (#1022555)

          You try to control a disease that spreads via something that depends on someone's sex drive or someone's drive to get pleasure, in a country where "muh freedumz" trumps sense and logic already?

          Good luck.

        • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Thexalon on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:21PM (4 children)

          by Thexalon (636) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:21PM (#1022559)

          Something that I think is very relevant here: Once the science became clear, here in the US there were campaigns to inform people how to avoid sharing needles and use condoms, and for the most part people who are able to do so follow that guidance which has substantially reduced the number of people needing treatment. Meanwhile, in Africa, there are a lot of people that still firmly believe complete falsehoods about the disease, and that has made the disease a lot less controllable.

          When it comes to disease, listen to science, not politicians!

          --
          The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:10PM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:10PM (#1022574)

            When it comes to disease, listen to science, not politicians!

            Aren't politicians THE disease?

            And remember; when politicians are controlling science's purse strings, you ARE listening to them no matter what mouthpiece is uttering the sounds.

            • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday July 17 2020, @02:45AM (1 child)

              by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Friday July 17 2020, @02:45AM (#1022707) Journal

              Aren't politicians THE disease?

              Nope, they are A disease.

              --
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
              • (Score: 2, Interesting) by fustakrakich on Friday July 17 2020, @06:21PM

                by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday July 17 2020, @06:21PM (#1022996) Journal

                No, they are a symptom

                --
                La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:37PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:37PM (#1022610)

            Politicians in South Africa don't tell black men that having sex with a baby will cure you of AIDS. Those men are acting on their own tribal knowledge.

      • (Score: 3, Funny) by JoeMerchant on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:44PM (2 children)

        by JoeMerchant (3937) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:44PM (#1022537)

        skimped on testing and prevention because they didn't want to spend the money to do it.

        It's not the quantity of money that was a problem, it's being seen - politically - as giving any money whatsoever to "those people" in this case gay drug abusers, but same goes for the poor, or pot smokers, etc.

        --
        🌻🌻 [google.com]
        • (Score: 2) by Thexalon on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:23PM (1 child)

          by Thexalon (636) on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:23PM (#1022564)

          I was thinking more about the refusal of blood banks to test their supplies until they were forced to do so, and that refusal killing people who had received transfusions, especially hemophiliacs.

          --
          The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
          • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday July 18 2020, @01:53AM

            by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday July 18 2020, @01:53AM (#1023176)

            the refusal of blood banks to test their supplies until they were forced to do so

            For some reason this instantly reminded me of the Georgia funeral home that was throwing corpses out in the field instead of cremating them "to save on the gas costs..."

            --
            🌻🌻 [google.com]
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @11:44PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @11:44PM (#1022642)

      There's no vaccine but there's pre-exposure prophylaxis [wikipedia.org]. I'm given to understand that if you take it soon enough after exposure (e.g., a nurse who accidentally gets stuck with a dirty needle) that even post-exposure prophylaxis is worth a shot. You're still rolling the dice if you engage in risky behavior. I suspect the biggest hurdles now are convincing people that they need to take these drugs, and paying for them. Given that they're already engaging in risk behavior, they're probably not going to "ask their doctor" about the drug advertised on TV. Also, as difficult as contract tracing is for Covid it's got to be even worse for HIV because it involves sex, frequently taboo sex. These factors are probably why we still have 10s of thousands of new HIV infections each year in the USA and Europe.

  • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:31PM (5 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:31PM (#1022531)

    A lot of people in nursing homes are on Daily heparin.
    So nobody noticed a connection?

    • (Score: 2) by epitaxial on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:48PM (2 children)

      by epitaxial (3165) on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:48PM (#1022540)

      Do I even have to say this around here? Correlation does not equal causation.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:05PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:05PM (#1022597)

        Correlation does not equal causation. But heparin is a wide spread drug. And given the ample supply of covid infected population, is it really that hard to pull out a correlated sample of patients and draw some conclusions?

        Maybe I'm just incredibly naive, but given the scope and urgency of this "emergency" I would think we could have pretty clear answers as to heparin's effectiveness by the end of the weekend and either start using it or move on to something new.

      • (Score: 2) by sjames on Friday July 17 2020, @09:45AM

        by sjames (2882) on Friday July 17 2020, @09:45AM (#1022816) Journal

        Correlation is not causation, but it often points at causation and waggles it's eyebrows meaningfully.

    • (Score: 2) by HiThere on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:04PM

      by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 16 2020, @10:04PM (#1022594) Journal

      You can't notice that kind of effect unless you collect and handle the data in such a way as to preserve the signal. And when you don't know what signal you're looking for, that can be difficult. I'm sure that if the effect is strong, and if the cases taking heparin are separated from those that aren't, the effect will be discernible. But that probably means collecting the data in a different way based on this new hypothesis.

      --
      Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
    • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Friday July 17 2020, @06:28PM

      by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday July 17 2020, @06:28PM (#1023004) Journal

      So nobody noticed a connection?

      Hard to tell. We allow too much secrecy to get an accurate numbers

      I also find it amusing that the Russians are being accused of "hacking" into some vaccine database. Well, the fucking database should be wide open! The theory is we are supposed to work together for a cure. Obviously the practice is quite different. So, the band plays on...

      --
      La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
  • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:33PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:33PM (#1022532)

    Find it out first before hyperventilating.

  • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:54PM (1 child)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @07:54PM (#1022544)

    heparin can be found in many animals. even star"fish" have it ... and sanddollars.
    wikipedia suggests that the real reason why animals make and have heparin is not 100 percent confirmed.
    it is suggested that blood thinning is just a "side effect" of heparin.
    if you really want to kill them rats use warfarin.
    anyways, it might be that heparin does play a big roll in keeping "dusty" particles (viruses) from generating more dust (by infecting cells)?

    • (Score: 2) by sjames on Friday July 17 2020, @10:34AM

      by sjames (2882) on Friday July 17 2020, @10:34AM (#1022827) Journal

      Warfarin isn't that useful in rats anymore. They've evolved to store massive amounts of vitamin K in their livers. These days it takes various "super warfarins" to kill rats.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:21PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @08:21PM (#1022560)

    "may effectively neutralize virus"

    I forgot how nice it was to have properly phrased medical advice, and not a single mention of showing lightbulbs up our butts!

  • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:20PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 16 2020, @09:20PM (#1022580)

    Should you read this, please don't mention heparin in public. Otherwise the media will declare it fake outright, and Democrat run states will pressure doctors to not prescribe it.

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