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As the two hackers remotely toyed with the air-conditioning, radio, and windshield wipers, I mentally congratulated myself on my courage under pressure. That’s when they cut the transmission.
Immediately my accelerator stopped working. As I frantically pressed the pedal and watched the RPMs climb, the Jeep lost half its speed, then slowed to a crawl. This occurred just as I reached a long overpass, with no shoulder to offer an escape. The experiment had ceased to be fun.
At that point, the interstate began to slope upward, so the Jeep lost more momentum and barely crept forward. Cars lined up behind my bumper before passing me, honking. I could see an 18-wheeler approaching in my rearview mirror. I hoped its driver saw me, too, and could tell I was paralyzed on the highway.
[Ed. addition follows]
See also coverage at The Register Jeep drivers: Install this security patch right now – or prepare to DIE:
The full details of the hack are still private, but it relies on the uConnect cellular network; since 2009, Chrysler cars have included hardware to connect to this network to reach the internet. The two researchers have demonstrated that a canny hacker can use the uConnect system to get wireless access to major components of a car's controls, and potentially crash it remotely with no one being any the wiser. The flaw has existed in the system since 2013.
Miller says the hack will work on recent Fiat Chrysler motors – such as Ram, Durango, and Jeep models. The pair disclosed the flaws to the manufacturer so that a patch could be prepared and distributed before their Black Hat tell-all. The fix is supposed to stop miscreants from accessing critical systems via the cellular network, a protection mechanism you would have expected in place on day one, week one.
Original Submission
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Ethanol-fueled on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:33AM
Why the hell do auto manufacturers not air-gap the control mechanisms from the wireless and cellular bullshit? If they're concerned about theft they could simply track the car with GPS or cellular means and call law enforcement to handle it. Disabling a car on the road is just batshit insane, even if it was stolen, disabling it can have unpredictable effects on not only the vehicle but the motorists around it.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by gnuman on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:45AM
Even worse, they don't do that on *airplanes* either!
I completely agree with you - this is completely asinine design. Connecting entertainment system with the car (or plane) vitals - WTF is with that?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:15AM
> Why the hell do auto manufacturers not air-gap the control mechanisms from the wireless and cellular bullshit?
Because security is an after thought and computer engineers are second-class engineers in the automotive world. Too much ingrained history there. Tesla is probably different, but all the other manufacturers have too many decades of thinking software is a necessary evil rather than a central component.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @05:11AM
Automotive engineers are third class engineers (said as a one-time aerospace engineer - yes, those guys are little more than grease monkeys). The automobile is about marketing, not engineering.
Computer engineers are a fiction. I've never met a programmer that knows anything meaningful about engineering. Many of them know little about computers, for that matter.
It is utter nonsense to consider the car to be an extension of the home or office instead of a means of transportation. They shouldn't be connected to the Internet. Drive, don't play.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @09:09AM
Truth.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @09:57AM
> Automotive engineers are third class engineers (said as a one-time aerospace engineer
So, said as someone who has never actually worked for an automotive company.
> Computer engineers are a fiction. I've never met a programmer that knows anything meaningful about engineering.
You worked in aerospace and you never a computer engineer? Seriously? Where do you think Ada came from? If anything, defense work is over-engineered.
(Score: 3, Informative) by VLM on Wednesday July 22 2015, @11:37AM
Computer engineers are a fiction.
There was a turf war in the 80s over where to put these "computer things" at uni, and the engineering depts attempt was to create the CE which was kind of an EE minus the analog and RF and plus a couple programming classes. The kind of grad more likely to write microcontroller code than web back end code. They did not remove control theory. Basically an engineer who knows ohms law and assembly language and bode stability plots. Note that if you suffer thru an EE you're probably only a year or so away from a CS double major anyway.
I googled it this morning and it turned out not to be as successful as they hoped it would be in the 80s. Looks like the math departments pretty much won after all WRT CS.
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 22 2015, @01:25PM
CE/EE are mostly the same. The only difference is an EE studies more Analog and RF while the CE studies more Digital design. You can easily double major in those two without needed any unnecessary classes.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 22 2015, @01:21PM
I think you confusing computer science with computer Engineering.
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:50PM
Or he confuses software engineering with computer engineering.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 5, Touché) by davester666 on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:12AM
1. An air gap increases the cost of materials slightly, and makes some functionality harder and/or impossible [hey, let's update the firmware of the car wirelessly!].
2. The manufacturers need to be able to upload all the vehicles information to their computers [engine rpm, gear selected, vehicle speed, wheel slippage, ABS is activated, what radio station you are listening to, etc...] It's all on the main bus, so just grab it from there. And remember, they are owed this data, because you aren't paying them enough up front for the vehicle.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @12:38PM
Point 2 could easily be done with a link that's one way by design. That is, the critical circuits can send their data to the general circuits, but not the other way round, enforced by hardware.
Of course that would again cost more, and thus point 1 kicks in again.
(Score: 3, Informative) by skater on Wednesday July 22 2015, @11:29AM
I have one of the affected vehicles. I have an app on my phone that lets me start it, lock it, and unlock it remotely, which I don't use (my key fob works as far away as I'd want to be). My free trial time is about up and they'll want me to start paying for it, but I'm not going to pay for that.
On the other hand, it'd be useful if I could open the app and check fuel level, tire pressure, oil life remaining, fuel filter life remaining, DEF level, and a few other things that are already reported on the dashboard display. I might actually pay for that service, because it would save me some time and effort. (It's a vehicle we don't drive on a daily basis, but we do take it on trips, so it'd be nice to get a status report on my phone while I'm preparing for a trip and have to check whether the vehicle needs fuel or other attention.)
But that can be done securely and smartly.
It was buried in the article, but Chrysler has put out an update that addresses the issues these guys found.
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:44PM
I'm still amazed that OnStar hasn't been hacked. It's such a huge target with extremely broad reach.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:49PM
I'm amazed that you think that On-Star hasn't been hacked.
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Wednesday July 22 2015, @04:03PM
I think I would have heard if a few million vehicles got hit by constant ignition-kill commands.
Hacked to track their GPS is not what I'm talking about. Hacked to cheaply piss off the US by blocking/snarling all traffic nationwide sounds like the kind of stuff most of our many victims must be day-dreaming of.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @04:45PM
Why The Fuck do we need our vehicles to connect to internet/wifi? cheese and crackers!
(Score: 3, Insightful) by el_oscuro on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:42AM
Having all of this computerized, networked shit controlling your car? What could possibly go wrong? My next car will have a stick shift with a real clutch. You remember the Toyota fiasco, where they said it was drivers error or floorboard mats or some such bullshit? Most people don't suddenly start stepping on the gas when they mean the brakes all of a sudden for one car manufacturer, and floor mats have been around for awhile with no apparent issues. The police officer who crashed the Lexus melted his brake disks trying to stop. No, this was a software fuck up. I still remember everyone saying "it is easy to deal with - just push the automatic transmission into neutral". How many of you have ever put an auto into neutral while the car is in motion, much less an emergency situation? And even if you did, doesn't that control just tell the computer what to do now?
All of this automation crap will pwn us. If I can still get it, a card with nothing more than a stick, power assisted steering, and power assisted brakes, nothing with any computer components involved. If they want to pwn my A/C or radio, go for it. But all of the mission critical systems need to be not controlled by software.
Old school mechanical systems can fuck up too, but they can't remotely, and you will usually get some sort of warning before they do.
SoylentNews is Bacon! [nueskes.com]
(Score: 2) by gnuman on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:47AM
My next car will have a stick shift with a real clutch.
And which modern car has this? I have a Pontiac G3 with a stick shift, but AFAIK, that clutch is via actuator anyway. There is no mechanical link to clutch. The only clutch that is actually a clutch is in my motorcycle.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:39AM
Just about every pickup out there. And nearly all the compact Japanese cars. The Europeans are into that automated manual stuff, but it hasn't hit Japanese cars (in a big way) yet.
My Nissan pickup has a hydraulic clutch. My Toyota compact car has a cable clutch. But the Toyota has an encoder substituting for a gas pedal (argh).
(Score: 3, Interesting) by skater on Wednesday July 22 2015, @11:32AM
Someone hasn't shopped for pickups lately. I think Ram is the only that offers a stick shift, and I'm not even sure about that one.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by captain normal on Wednesday July 22 2015, @05:12AM
Have you noticed how much it costs now to get a pre-midseventys car. Lots of people want them now.
Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts"- --Daniel Patrick Moynihan--
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:40AM
What the hell is the point of making it a manual if it's not fully manual? The entire demographic is people who think they want a manual but can't tell the difference when they're driving it?
Of course we all like to think we'd figure it out right away but it'd probably take me a couple times when I should have killed it and it didn't die for me to catch on. (If it's semi-automated and dies when you screw up anyway, what's the point either?)
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 3, Informative) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 22 2015, @01:52PM
That whole post is a big wtf. Dont get me wrong, I'm not trying to insult you. I think there is some confusion about terminology is all.
There is no such thing as a "real clutch" vs some other form of clutch. A clutch is a clutch. Your Pontiac G3 has a hydraulically actuated clutch, the most popular form of actuation. Your motorcycle also has a clutch which depending on the model might be hydraulic or cable actuated. Both of those clutches are the friction disc type. In some vehicles, like my 1961 Mack B61 semi tractor, the clutch linkage is a system of levers and rods. All three of those methods are actuating the same type of clutch. Each of those methods have their drawbacks and advantages.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:04PM
Posting AC, already late for work... Dual clutch transmissions are out now, and are typically automatically shifted by the computer, or done by a paddle style mechanism. It is two real actual clutches, but it is automated - no pedal. (Sorry for nitpicking ;)
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:22PM
Now I get it, automated manual vs an actual manual. When I hear manual transmission I think pure manual. An "automated manual transmission" is a misnomer. I don't care if someone bolted servo motors to a real manual and automated it, it's no longer manual.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:53PM
VW had a stick shift automatic in the 60's-70's. It had a real clutch, no clutch pedal, but also had a torque converter, and a touch-switch on the shifter, as soon as you grab the shifter it would engage the clutch.
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 22 2015, @05:10PM
Yea, they had some weird transmissions out there. I have seen a large Mack LR, an off highway truck converted to a heavy haul tractor, with a torque converter and no clutch. A rocker switch on the floor allowed you to break torque to shift the 10 speed two stick transmission (5 main gears and two compound gears).
Another oddity was the Caterpillar semi automatic used in military trucks. There was a shift lever, like one you would find in a modern automatic car, but it had 16-18 slots. You nudged the stick for each gear and you had no clutch pedal: http://hankstruckforum.com/htforum/index.php?topic=18283.0 [hankstruckforum.com]. You see a pedal where the clutch should be but I believe that is a retarder pedal that uses the converter in the transmission as a retarder to slow the vehicle without using the service brakes.
MAN also used a semi-auto in their KAT1 military truck. From what read a while ago, it has a stick, no clutch pedal and you shift like a manual but never worry about a clutch. From pictures you can make out a stick in the cab but no clutch pedal. The post I read stated that it had a 7 speed in it.
(Score: 2) by el_oscuro on Friday July 24 2015, @11:27PM
When I said "real clutch", I meant one with a traditional hydraulic or mechanical linkage like on my 92 Camaro. Not any of this electronic manual/auto crap that is all the rage in Europe these days.
SoylentNews is Bacon! [nueskes.com]
(Score: 5, Insightful) by physicsmajor on Wednesday July 22 2015, @04:02AM
This is scary, but it isn't what people really should be afraid of. What I want to know is: does the NSA know about this, and will/have they ever use(d) it.
Generally if there's a backdoor or a vulnerability, chances are good the NSA knew about it before it was made public. Even if it flew under their radar somehow, you can bet they'll (ab)use it immediately after they see the potential. And let's be clear: this has potential. The NSA can drop a National Security Letter on any auto manufacturer selling in the USA at any time for significant if not complete remote control over any/all late model vehicles with a cellular connection. Think that's tinfoil hat territory? These guys reverse engineered this stuff; imagine what they could have done with full and complete source code and cooperation of the manufacturer. It won't give me any joy to say "I told you so."
Let that one sink in, though. Drive or get driven in a late-model car with a cellular connection, and the NSA - with the power they possess right now, today - can kill you without repercussions and make it look for all the world like an accident. Oh, you drive older cars? Remember you share the road with vulnerable ones. Yes, by all means, speak your opinion freely...
This is how a free society dies.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @05:11AM
Who do you think this feature was built for?
Who do you think VPro/VT/AMT backdoor was built for?
Your government, your god and your enemy (if you are male: the prisons are built for you)
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @08:02AM
I'll just leave these here.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jörg_Haider [wikipedia.org]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Hastings_(journalist) [wikipedia.org]
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @12:51PM
And here are the desktop links, for people still using real computers:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jörg_Haider [wikipedia.org]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Hastings_%28journalist%29 [wikipedia.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @07:40PM
Just like the police officer and his Lexus. Full speed and full break simultaneously.
(Score: 2) by t-3 on Wednesday July 22 2015, @08:11AM
Why just the NSA? Pretty much all of law enforcement is going to be hacking cars and stopping whatever they want to stop.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Wednesday July 22 2015, @12:08PM
Not just NSA, also every foreign country in the world. Maybe not afghanistan, because thats not exactly a high tech hub, but I could see some Admiral, General, corporate exec, or journalist offending North Korean or China or Russia or possibly Iran getting mysteriously run over in a crosswalk by some little old lady in a brand new car who swears she had her foot on the (computer controlled drive by wire) brakes the whole time.
Also consider both sides of gamergate or any other distraction from TPP negotiations. Extremists are willing to destroy people's lives right now, and when they do it they glory in it, all self congratulations. Think about that for a second. Now those same uncivilized people have the power to remotely kill. On both sides.
Finally think of pranks, not necessarily intentionally kill, although it'll surely happen. Next Packers-Bears football game at Lambeau Field, F the bears and the FIBs in general, get a 12-pack or two (or three?) in the right people and suddenly every illinois plated car in Wisconsin shuts down on the highway after the game. Might kill a few people unintentionally, but it would be a hell of a prank. Imagine the PR fun of trying to convince car buyers to pay extra to be the inconvenienced butt of jokes like that.
On the bright side if you think this is Fed up, what till we have self driving cars, the hacked death toll will be quite impressive I'm sure. It'll be like living in the movie "Maximum Overdrive" from '86 or so.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @08:16AM
The NSA scares you? Doesn't it seem more likely some company will do so out of profit motive? Oh, you invented *new tech X*. And talked about it with a friend. That friend posted something on facebook. Next thing you know, you're dead, your friend is dead, the post never happened, and it turns out Mark Zuckerburg invented something similar in his garage, adn doesn't have to give anyone 65 million this time.
Or Google, or Microsoft or Apple.
Companies listed in the order I think it's likely they would do that. FB and Google just have so much more opportunity to do so...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:58PM
This. The NSA isn't going to hack your car, except maybe to listen to your conversations via the OnStar-equivalent microphone. The guys who are going to kill you will be CIA, Mossad, or someone of that ilk.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:36AM
My last car was an automatic, and shifting it into neutral I could do without even looking at it (N being one notch below D; you don't even need to depress the button on the shifter, actually). The trick is having the presence of mind to do that in a pressure situation like that.
(I drive a manual now, but that's more because I find it enjoyable than any particular logical reason.)
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @11:57AM
Lot of people forget that one, and at least on the 'common' cars a lot of companies have replaced the cable assembly for the rear parking drum brakes with an electrically controlled emergency brake. No real biggie y'know if you HAVE ELECTRICAL POWER, which you probably won't any time you are really panicking and need that brake NOW.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @07:46PM
This is my worst fears about self-driving cars coming true a decade or two early.
Imagine how easy it would be to get control or just spoof an update server just as so many have done before. Some exceptionally evil person could easily push a firmware update to all automated cars and tell them to turn left and switch to "UK" mode or some such at a specific time, say during rush hour. Imagine tens of millions of automated cars driving into oncoming traffic simultaneously. With just one update a single person could cause more death in seconds than any war has ever been able to accomplish.
This is not some far off fantasy. All the tools to do this are available right now and are waiting for an opportunity.
(Score: 1) by Bogsnoticus on Wednesday July 22 2015, @02:43AM
The Jeep killing itself and bursting on fire without any outside intervention.
I mean, American workmanship with French leadership. That just screams quality to me. </sarcasm>
Genius by birth. Evil by choice.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:33AM
Fiat is Italian
(Score: 1) by Bogsnoticus on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:54AM
My mistake. I was also chatting to a colleague about his Citroen 2CV whilst I was reading the article. Got the brand nationalities mixed up.
Comment still stands, just substitute "Italian Leadership" with "French Leadership".
Genius by birth. Evil by choice.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @08:23PM
Sounds like you are an equal-opportunity bigot.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:31AM
(just remember to dump the stock before fuels will no longer be available at "petrol" stations)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Geezer on Wednesday July 22 2015, @09:40AM
Much less vulnerable to EMP too, and far easier to do DIY repairs. The main here is oxidation. Rustoleum and WD-40 work wonders on a 1968 Ford.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @07:39PM
You'll need something older than that--something with a generator (think: alternator diodes).
Of course, as WOPR's simulation[1] showed us, there are no winners in a nuclear exchange.
If it comes to that, kiss your ass goodbye.
[1] ...and "On the Beach", decades before that.
-- gewg_
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @08:11PM
On the Beach is a great book, you should read it.
(Score: 2) by MostCynical on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:44AM
If SCADA suppliers and installers can't get it right, what hope an automotive manufacturer?
https://www.tofinosecurity.com/blog/project-shine-1000000-internet-connected-scada-and-ics-systems-and-counting [tofinosecurity.com]
Also note, many of the components in cars are from third party suppliers, who often sell to more than one car company. Inteconnectivity and ease of installation over-rides security every time. ($$)
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @04:21AM
Now you've got your bloody IoT, fucktards.
(Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Wednesday July 22 2015, @04:35AM
Back in the day, some poor hapless sailor entered a zero into an entry field that was used as the denominator in a division. This crashed the ship's entire Windows NT system, with the result that it had to be towed back to port for repair.
The official Naval Board of Inquiry concluded that it was that sailor's fault. See he should not have entered that zero.
So whether you are a Soviet spy or you just get cold feet about charging into battle, enter zeros into NT database entry fields.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @04:55AM
The journalist who wrote the article that led to the removal of General McChrystal met with an unfortunate accident a bit later when his car went out of control. In his case it was a Mercedes. I'd guess the vulnerabilities have been known in certain communities for a while.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @07:13AM
Aware of something odd with the car; dead coroner. [googleusercontent.com] (orig) [alternet.org]
Mercedes' reputation [googleusercontent.com] (orig) [thenewamerican.com]
Bad Physics; official stonewalling [googleusercontent.com] (orig) [examiner.com]
The original site (San Diego TV6) has dutifully(?) taken down the page.
-- gewg_
(Score: 3, Interesting) by anubi on Wednesday July 22 2015, @08:56AM
Those are some scary links, gewg_.
I have been looking for a plain white business van... like one of those Chevrolet 2500 express vans. But the thought of it going out of control on me in the manner of those links you put up makes me think very seriously to get the fuel pump power and run it to an emergency kill switch in the cab.
If all else goes bad, at least I can override anything the computer can do to accelerate me out of control.
This makes me think of the fate of the HAL 9000 computer in 2001: A Space Odyssey.
I sure miss those days of the simpler mechanical cars. I am so tempted to buy a really old van and spend whatever it takes to restore it... not as a collectable, but something to be put back in service. Technology has made such improvements in vehicles over the past 30 years, but unfortunately, not all of that technology was an improvement.
The later cars can be taken off the road by "smog" inspections... so that means removing existing technology is not allowed.
In California, older cars, grandfathered in, could be retrofitted with desirable technology only. I do prefer port fuel injection to carburetion by a long shot, but I want my van's engine controller having nothing to do with the internet. I want a MegaSquirt or similar. Something open source where its troubleshootable and fixable.
Its not the exhaust specs I have a beef with on smog testing... its the ability of one little test twerp to take my car offline not because I am polluting but because I failed some visual inspection. Because I tampered with something. Or removed something. Its my car and I feel justified in tampering with anything I feel like tampering with. If my tampering comes out my tailpipe, then its a social problem, and I see nothing wrong with them limiting my "right to pollute" on that basis.
I do not mind them "sniffing my car's ass", but I think they have no rights to pop the hood. Or grope my girlfriend. Look if they want, but do not touch. Their ability to take cars offline for "tampering" just invites manufacturers to include all sorts of unremoveable crapware.
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @07:20PM
scary
Makes you think that fiction writers aren't so much imaginative but instead have an inside view of what's really going on.
I sure miss those days of the simpler mechanical cars
Yeah.
The newest stuff makes you long for the days when the biggest problem was on the level of the On-Board Diagnostics readout codes being proprietary.
port fuel injection [...] a MegaSquirt or similar
I was wondering how long it would take before someone mentioned aftermarket stuff.
Somebody riffed on that in the previous story about closed-source farm equipment.
Something open source
There we get to the core of the issue.
The analogy about the hood being welded shut; the pig in a poke problem.
In California [...] the ability of one little test twerp to take my car offline not because I am polluting but because I failed some visual inspection
You get the pitchforks, I'll get the torches.
I remember all the ridiculous tubing in cars from decades back.
That a guy could spot something out of bounds in that plumber's nightmare (different for each make and model) was fantasy.
Actually, I'm amazed how well I can get along these days without needing a personal vehicle.
-- gewg_
(Score: 1) by anubi on Thursday July 23 2015, @06:09AM
I hardly ever use personal transportation anymore, which explains why I would want something so big.
After much contemplation, I believe the most important possessions I have are my tools.
I am getting more and more of the belief that significant social unrest is on the horizon.
If I am forced to leave my home, I would like to have a place to sleep and transport my tools, so wherever I end up, at least I can offer my services and have the ability to perform same on the spot.
Slowly but surely, I am migrating everything I have to run from 12 volts. All of my test equipment and even my soldering irons now run 12V. I intend to have four or five 100-watt solar panels on the roof of the van to power my little workshop so I can keep the batteries in my power tools and test equipment charged without having to run the truck engine.
I believe something nasty is coming my way. After years of watching resource depletion, debt aggregation, and population growth, I get the idea this mess will come to a head in my lifetime. I feel my best way to survive is going to be offering service to others.
If I go around collecting ammo, hoard goods, or try to collect rents, I feel I would most likely be shot just to get me out of the way. Either my own government or the people I am trying to leech off of would be motivated to do such. In a doomsday scenario, I could not much say I would blame them either.
There must be already thousands of bullets hoarded already for every animal that might be shot for food. I believe the only people who are going to have food are our farmers...as they will be growing it. Messing with a farmer - you might as well kill the goose laying the golden egg. The only reason we have made it this far against Malthus is a credit to our farmers.
However, I believe its a mathematical certainty that Malthus will win eventually, as we as a public seem to be going like yeast in a petri dish. It will not be fun. We will quickly discover that it will be much faster to destroy our infrastructure than it is to build it.
I am hoping they will want to keep someone around who fixes broken stuff.
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @05:09AM
This is so that the police / govt can turn off your vehicle at will.
We live in a police state and need to revolt against it, there really needs to be a war.
Remeber: anything a man would ever want to do gives him years in prison.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by VLM on Wednesday July 22 2015, @11:54AM
Just pointing out that you can fight stone age tribesmen all you want, but if we ever attacked a post 1900 era civilization, they'd pown SOME of our cars and shut them down remotely. So its not just the local cops, but if we ever fight North Korea you may as well kiss big brother cars goodbye, they aren't going to work for long.
I know all about GM's big brother phone home crap and specifically bought a toyota that has none of that. Not the only reason but it was one of the reasons.
A friend of mine accidentally bought a big brother car and a mechanic friend of hers simply unplugged the antenna at her request once she got creeped out. There is a long, long tradition in the service industries of people wrapping corporate GPS trackers in aluminum foil and blaming solar flares or WTF.
At this point its very easy to find a car without big brother and disabling big brother is still easy. I'm sure that'll be legally changed in the future, just not yet.
Another interesting thing to think about is government cars. Presidential limos, civvy contractor supply trucks... Could have all kinds of fun.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:18AM
As long as it is a Durango, I don't mind. Seems everyone who drives one of those is a menace. And Ram Trucks? Compensate much? The only appeal of the Hemi these days is that you have very small genitalia and for some reason need to broadcast this fact to the rest of us via exhaust noise! So, shut 'em down, boys, in a safe manner, to protect the rest of us from their Frenchie machismo!!!
(Yes, I know, Fiat is not French. But Chrysler is not American, either. )
(Score: 2) by hemocyanin on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:05PM
Bumper sticker I once read:
"Nice truck. Sorry about the penis."
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Wednesday July 22 2015, @04:08PM
I thought something similar the first time I saw a big truck with one of those "Truck Nuts" [bullsballs.com] things on the trailer hitch. The following Christmas I gave one to my little brother as a joke. He drives a VW Golf. I asked him what response he got and he said funny looks because they hung so low he left a trail of sparks going down the road.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by vux984 on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:08PM
I've never understood those things... I, along with every one I've ever talked to about it, anthropomorphize vehicles as female. Whether they are admiring its sexy curves, or taking "her" out for a spin, or coaxing "her" to start in cold weather after leaving "her" outside unplugged, or taking "her" in to get detailed...or to the track etc. Its always her. From farm tractors to exotic super cars.
Who here thinks of there car or truck as a 'him'? Even my wife thinks of our cars as "her".
So everytime I see a vehicle with truck nuts... I find the effect to be oddly hermaphroditic.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:41AM
Will the "intelligence community" require such "flaw" on all cars? Some journo, if there are any left, should do a scan.
I love my bike more every day...
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @07:39AM
I love my bike more every day...
Huh, it's pretty easy to kill people in biking "accidents".
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 22 2015, @05:20PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Levin#Rob_Levin [wikipedia.org]
Rob Levin
Robert Levin (16 December 1955[citation needed] – 16 September 2006),[30] also known as lilo, was the founder of the freenode IRC network and Executive Director of the PDPC charity that helped fund freenode.[31] A computer programmer since 1968, Levin worked as an administrator and an applications programmer from 1978 until his death.[citation needed]
On 12 September 2006, Levin was struck by a car while riding a bicycle at night in Houston, Texas, in a hit-and-run collision. After the collision, it was reported that Levin was hospitalized for several days. He died on 16 September.[30]
(Score: 2) by srobert on Wednesday July 22 2015, @03:53PM
This is probably related to systemd somehow?
(Score: 1) by Michelle on Wednesday July 22 2015, @06:26PM
All the more reason to keep my old air-cooled VW running.
Interesting times indeed...
"Right now is the only moment you'll ever have; so why be miserable?"
(Score: 2) by soylentsandor on Thursday July 23 2015, @09:36AM
For those who didn't see the video because it needs JS enabled: here it is [youtube.com].
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 23 2015, @07:08PM
Since when doesn't YouTube require Javascript?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 25 2015, @07:00PM
Which is now unavailable (coincidentally?) due to a copyright claim from "ModernWorksPub" (https://duckduckgo.com/?q=modernworkspub&t=ffsb)