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posted by CoolHand on Wednesday November 11 2015, @02:50AM   Printer-friendly
from the rise-of-the-proletariat dept.

Hundreds of fast food workers are striking nationwide Tuesday, joining other workers in pressing for a more livable wage. But while some say $15 is a minimum needed to survive, some business owners say dishing out more pay would leave them struggling to keep their doors open.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/fast-food-workers-strike-again-nationwide-for-15-an-hour

In New York City, rallies are being held in Harlem, the Financial District and Brooklyn in support of efforts to raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour, reports CBS New York.

In Los Angeles, the local protests are organized by Service Employees International Union, and include fast-food, home-care and child-care workers, along with other "underpaid" employees, reports CBS Los Angeles.

"Is this the America we believe in? When someone works all day long and they still can't get by," New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio said during an early-morning rally in Downtown Brooklyn. "Does anyone believe that it's easy to get by in New York City on less than $15 an hour?"

Critics say a $15 minimum wage would obliterate opportunity and usher in higher taxes, but de Blasio said the opposite is true -- with more money to spend, low wage workers contribute more to the economy.


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  • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @02:58AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @02:58AM (#261550)

    "In Los Angeles, the local protests are organized by Service Employees International Union"

    You betcha. Make sure you pay your union dues, slaves.

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  • (Score: 2, Disagree) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:21AM

    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:21AM (#261559) Journal

    Someone told me that's a communist front. I haven't checked it out for myself. Hmmm - http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/printgroupProfile.asp?grpid=6535 [discoverthenetworks.org]

    Whatever - skilled craftsmen in much of the country can't get fifteen bucks. Sorry, people, but if a journeyman carpenter can't get that much, WTF makes you think some kid bagging up hamburgers and fries should get that much?

    If the minimum wage goes up to $15, a couple things are going to happen. The purchasing power of the dollar is going to go down, just as it always does after a minimum wage increase. Your $15 may or may not remain equal to the purchasing power that you now have - probably not though.

    Companies are going to look at decreasing labor costs by reducing the labor force. Maybe McDonald's can't do much outsourcing, but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5NvgOjRuVw [youtube.com]

    • (Score: 1) by ataradov on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:36AM

      by ataradov (4776) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:36AM (#261571) Homepage

      That's a cool machine and I'd rather deal with it than with McD employee. If they could also make an app for this, no machine will be needed.

      • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:50AM

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:50AM (#261580) Journal

        Interesting. I'm an asocial person. I can take or leave the employee, but I generally put up with him/her because he's got to make a living somehow.

        Having a preference for the machine seems anti-social to me. That is, you want your wants and needs met, but to hell with the wants and needs of anyoen else.

        Social people, on the other hand, would much rather deal with a person.

        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by frojack on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:16AM

          by frojack (1554) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:16AM (#261593) Journal

          Agreed.
          The older I get the easier it is to put up with the kid taking my order, having trouble with the cash register, forgetting the ketchup.
          They are only newbies once, and a few kind words gets them past the moment. I got no beef with newbies. I was one many times over my life.

          They are there working. They are trying. Cut them some slack.

          You'll get better service on your next visit.

          --
          No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
        • (Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:24AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:24AM (#261595)

          What do you expect? "I got mine...fuck you!" is the mission statement of the Tea Party specifically and the Right in general.

      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by VLM on Wednesday November 11 2015, @02:21PM

        by VLM (445) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @02:21PM (#261725)

        That's because they treat their employees inhumanely and want them to act like predictable robots saying the same stuff to produce a commodity product. Its a hell of an awful way for a human to live. So replacing them with an app or a robot won't change your interaction, at least from the MBA perspective.

        "Real service providers" know what you want and make it your way. Not like a cheesy commercial. I go to my local flakey granola hippie health food store for the smoothie, not for the witty marxist banter, but because the lady behind the counter knows what I like in a smoothie and she makes it just right. Yes I know smoothies are just a carb punch to the gut but F it if I'm going to eat something unhealthy it will be something that tastes extremely good. This would make a business exec at McDonalds shit a brick because he's in the business of selling identical commodities not custom products. I don't think you can replace the smoothie lady with an app.

        • (Score: 2) by Joe Desertrat on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:03PM

          by Joe Desertrat (2454) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:03PM (#261867)

          I don't think you can replace the smoothie lady with an app.

          Unfortunately, too many people now, if they do not demand, at least expect the convenience and speed of an app. It is going beyond fast food as well, with people even being able to order their food before they get to a restaurant. I suppose the old fashion social interactions are gone anyway, just look at how many people sit in a restaurant staring at their phones...

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:45AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:45AM (#261602)

      not that old myth. yes some mild inflation happens but that is a good thing for growth, especially since more money gets circulated downward

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Tork on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:49AM

      by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:49AM (#261603)

      WTF makes you think some kid bagging up hamburgers and fries should get that much?

      Because people demand burgers in convenient locations nowhere near where that kid can afford to live and having him live on foodstamps means we're paying for it anyway. Oh, and greater local spending power means more customers for these burger joints.

      Companies are looking at decreasing labor costs by reducing the labor force no matter what happens.

      FTFY.

      --
      🏳️‍🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️‍🌈
      • (Score: 3, Informative) by soylentsandor on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:09PM

        by soylentsandor (309) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:09PM (#261897)

        Oh, and greater local spending power means more customers for these burger joints.

        Exactly. This is what Henry Ford understood a century ago [wikipedia.org].

        It worked back then, there's no reason it couldn't work today.

        • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Tork on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:23PM

          by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:23PM (#261904)
          They think the price of hamburgers will suddenly rise, never mind that the price of Ford's cars didn't suddenly rise out of the reach of his employees. At the end of the day the Supply and Demand curve will even itself out, and maybe we will see an increase in price that rises faster than inflation. It could also turn out, as it did in Ford's case, the rise in volume could be preferable. Frankly, this is likely since the perceived value of a burger is not tied to anybody's wage. Notice how often we see "Dollar Menu" specials at most of the joints.
          --
          🏳️‍🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️‍🌈
    • (Score: 5, Informative) by bzipitidoo on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:02AM

      by bzipitidoo (4388) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:02AM (#261637) Journal

      > Companies are going to look at decreasing labor costs by reducing the labor force.

      Until companies look at reducing labor costs by reducing the pay of upper management, I have zero sympathy for their wails that they will go bankrupt if minimum wage is raised, or that they are taxed too heavily. CEO pay is so outrageous that, yes, it is enough money to give a big raise to everyone working for minimum pay. They will never convince me that they pay people fairly when the CEO makes far more than a mere 12 times or even 40 times the lowest paid worker. It's hundreds of times more, and that's what has to change. A few years back, a company I once worked for pushed their CEO out. They gave him a hell of a big golden parachute. He got $52 million, 16% of the company's net worth!!! Don't know which of the morons on the board went for that scandalously favorable contract, but wow, just wow.

      As for McDonald's, the current CEO, this Steve Easterbrook, will earn $1.1 million, and that's just the base salary, that's not counting bonuses and the like. With all the extras, his compensation is over $10 million. That equates to over $5000/hour. If the lowest rate they pay workers is raised to $15/hour, and CEO pay is not changed, the CEO is still making at least 333 times as much.

      • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:34PM

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:34PM (#261767) Journal

        I agree - CEO's are overpaid, astronomically. That needs to be curbed.

        I wasn't expecting "sympathy" for the corporations, I was just pointing out the facts of life. Mickey D has gotten used to exploiting people at a certain cost, and if those costs go up, Mickey is going to look harder at automation. That's just the way it is.

        • (Score: 4, Informative) by bzipitidoo on Wednesday November 11 2015, @05:30PM

          by bzipitidoo (4388) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @05:30PM (#261831) Journal

          Management uses change and events as pretext for their agendas, which, sadly, are them first. They know very well that they are going to automate more and employ less, regardless. Humans cannot compete with machines at simple, repetitive, automatable tasks. Lowering the minimum wage will not save any of those jobs, and suggesting otherwise is little more than a cynical attempt to manipulate and scare the public into accepting lower minimum wages.

          The money saved by beating down pay tends to go to upper management in the form of even bigger bonuses, for reducing labor costs of course. That's what Crandall, CEO of American Airlines, did many years ago. He persuaded the unions to accept lower pay. Argued eloquently that the survival of the airline (and their jobs) depended on getting costs down, and they agreed. Then he was awarded a huge bonus, that was pretty close to the amount of money saved. The employees and unions were furious when they found out, as they did shortly after. There was even a political cartoon about it, showing Crandall at a podium giving a speech about labor costs, while reaching into a cookie jar he was holding behind his back. "Watch what we do, not what we say." But that's so typical. Could hardly have better demonstrated the routine greed, selfishness, and hypocrisy of upper management. They need keepers or something, to stop them from behaving so foolishly. They're like Icarus, flying too close to the sun.

      • (Score: 2) by Gaaark on Wednesday November 11 2015, @06:58PM

        by Gaaark (41) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @06:58PM (#261862) Journal

        The CEO of Target Canada did an EPIC FAIL, face palmed out of Canada and got $61 million U.S. for his troubles!

        Fail = $61 million.

        (Whereas for me, i'm sure Fail = fired).

        Things are WAY OUT OF WHACK... this is the kind of thing that makes the world a horrible place. Hard-working people with families can't get by vs. People fail utterly and get a huge payoff.

        --
        --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
        • (Score: 2) by Joe Desertrat on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:07PM

          by Joe Desertrat (2454) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:07PM (#261872)

          The CEO of Target Canada did an EPIC FAIL, face palmed out of Canada and got $61 million U.S. for his troubles!

          But, but, CEO's need to be paid that much because they face all the risk!

          • (Score: 2) by Gaaark on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:04PM

            by Gaaark (41) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:04PM (#261894) Journal

            Wish i could face risk like that...

            --
            --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
            • (Score: 2) by Joe Desertrat on Friday November 13 2015, @02:56AM

              by Joe Desertrat (2454) on Friday November 13 2015, @02:56AM (#262474)

              You and me both. Knowing that no matter how badly you screw up short of ending up in jail, you are set for life. I guess the risk involves become insane with arrogance.

    • (Score: 5, Interesting) by aristarchus on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:19AM

      by aristarchus (2645) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @07:19AM (#261641) Journal

      Someone told me that's a communist front. I haven't checked it out for myself. Hmmm -

      Wow! Communist Front! Kinda hard to be that anymore, since there is no Communist Back? Why not just say "Communist", or "Economic Democracy", or working class. Sometimes, Mr. Runaway1956, I bethinks meself that thou are in the 1956, with your pal Congressman Joe McCarthy.

      Whatever - skilled craftsmen in much of the country can't get fifteen bucks. Sorry, people, but if a journeyman carpenter can't get that much, WTF makes you think some kid bagging up hamburgers and fries should get that much?

      Pounding nails and using a cut-off saw is that much more skilled than flipping burgers and practicing proper food hygiene? Come back to talk to us when you are a master carpenter, or a master chef, or, of course, a master baiter, you troller! Had me going! Thought it actually was a minnow!

      If the minimum wage goes up to $15, a couple things are going to happen. The purchasing power of the dollar is going to go down, just as it always does after a minimum wage increase. Your $15 may or may not remain equal to the purchasing power that you now have - probably not though.

      Actual facts do not agree with your sucking up to capitalists and Paul Ryan presumptions. Purchasing power goes down when the Fed increases the interest rate on T-Bills. You ought to know that. And besides, it is not at all about "minimum wage", it is about a "liveable wage". Why should the rest of us subsidize companies who underpay their workers, just because government will pick up the costs of food, shelter, and medical care? I say, cut them off. Minimun wage, $25/hour, and if you do not pay this, your employees will be ineligible for any government assistance, and I mean any. Work for Walmart? No Social Security for you, gramps! Work for MickyD's? No medicare, even under your parents plan, and definitely no Obama care. Of course, if you quit these slaver jobs, then we will support you. But not your employer. If a company cannot afford for its workers to live, it deserves to die. With extreme, and communist, prejudice.

      • (Score: 2) by SubiculumHammer on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:36AM

        by SubiculumHammer (5191) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:36AM (#261655)

        What about the poor unemployed corps?

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @11:39AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @11:39AM (#261692)
          what about them corpses?
      • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:30PM

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:30PM (#261763) Journal

        "Pounding nails and using a cut-off saw is that much more skilled than flipping burgers and practicing proper food hygiene? Come back to talk to us when you are a master carpenter, or a master chef, or, of course, a master baiter, you troller! Had me going! Thought it actually was a minnow!"

        You are describing a third class carpenter's HELPER. I specifically said "journeyman carpenter". Despite the fact that you are being a wise guy, I'm here to inform you that a MASTER carpenter doesn't get $20 around these parts, unless he owns his own business. We don't all live in the big cities on the left or right coast.

    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:58AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 11 2015, @08:58AM (#261662)

      If the minimum wage goes up to $15, a couple things are going to happen. The purchasing power of the dollar is going to go down

      If increasing minimum wage is what causes purchasing power to go down, then why has my purchasing power gone down so much without any minimum wage increases to cause it?

      • (Score: 2) by Tork on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:37PM

        by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday November 11 2015, @04:37PM (#261807)

        He's assuming minimum wage caused inflation but ignored the fact that it happened right around the time wives started joining the workforce. Suddenly lots of households became two-income and not long after the price of houses shot upwards.

        --
        🏳️‍🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️‍🌈
  • (Score: 4, Touché) by K_benzoate on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:30AM

    by K_benzoate (5036) on Wednesday November 11 2015, @03:30AM (#261563)

    Exactly. What a bunch of retarded sheep. I'm an enlightened rugged individualist so I wisely chose not to join the liberty-crushing union. Now excuse me, I have to go spend my Wal-Mart scrip at the company store before it expires!

    --
    Climate change is real and primarily caused by human activity.