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posted by janrinok on Monday August 01 2016, @11:51PM   Printer-friendly
from the did-you-just-assume-my-gender? dept.

In The Guardian there is a discussion on the participation of transgender people in the Olympic Games, primarily looking at Caster Semenya. Semenya, a South African middle-distance runner, was subjected to gender testing in 2009, but has been cleared to participate in the Olympic Games beginning in a few days time.

"It's a ticking timebomb," Daniel Mothowagae says quietly on a winter's night in Johannesburg as he anticipates the furore that is likely to explode when Caster Semenya runs in the Olympic Games. Apart from being described by many athletics specialists as an almost certain winner of the women's 800m in Rio, Semenya will suffer again as she is made to personify the complex issues surrounding sex verification in sport."

"The debate around hyperandrogenism is as poignant as it is thorny. In simplistic summary it asks us to decide whose rights need to be protected most. Is it the small minority of women whose exceedingly high testosterone levels, which their bodies produce naturally, categorise them as intersex athletes? Should their human rights be ring-fenced so that, as is the case now following an overturned legal ruling, they are free to compete as women without being forced to take medication that suppresses their testosterone? Or should the overwhelming majority of female athletes be protected – so they are not disadvantaged unfairly against faster and stronger intersex competitors?"

""She is proof of the benefit of testosterone to intersex athletes," Tucker argues. "Having had the restriction removed she is now about six seconds faster than she had been the last two years.""

"The Cas panel defined the crucial factor as being whether intersex athletes would have sufficient advantages to outweigh any female characteristics and make them comparable to male-performance levels. "

"Three months ago Tucker conducted a fascinating interview with Joanna Harper – who describes herself as "a scientist first, an athlete second and a transgender person third." Harper made the startling claim that we might see "an all-intersex podium in the 800 in Rio and I wouldn't be surprised to see as many as five intersex women in the eight-person final.""


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  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Gravis on Tuesday August 02 2016, @12:40AM

    by Gravis (4596) on Tuesday August 02 2016, @12:40AM (#382899)

    it seems more logical to me that genetic profiles of what constitutes men, women and an intersex person. the deciding factor should be the ability for someone to reproduce and give birth multiple times. the basic idea is that if you match a the genetic profile of someone that is unable to continue the human race under normal conditions (without supplementary hormones or a c-section) that you be relegated to the intersex class... unless you already have a child born normally. the point of this being that it would identify what humanity could become versus anomalous human mutations that have no hope of having a lineage without third-party intervention.

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  • (Score: 2) by Scruffy Beard 2 on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:03AM

    by Scruffy Beard 2 (6030) on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:03AM (#382912)

    Many women can not reproduce for one reason or another. They may not even know it until they try.

    In fact, women lose the ability to reproduce as they age. According to your criteria, women become intersex when they hit menopause.

    I suppose what you really meant is that you want to exclude women with a 'y' chromosome.

    • (Score: 2, Disagree) by The Mighty Buzzard on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:29AM

      by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:29AM (#382924) Homepage Journal

      Y, yes. XX = female, XY = male, anything else = a mutant and not eligible to compete.

      --
      My rights don't end where your fear begins.
      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by wisnoskij on Tuesday August 02 2016, @02:08AM

        by wisnoskij (5149) <{jonathonwisnoski} {at} {gmail.com}> on Tuesday August 02 2016, @02:08AM (#382941)

        You can be a mutant and still have the right number and arraignment of chromosomes.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 02 2016, @02:47AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 02 2016, @02:47AM (#382963)

          Buddy, we're all mutants on this planet.

        • (Score: 3, Funny) by Azuma Hazuki on Tuesday August 02 2016, @05:10PM

          by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Tuesday August 02 2016, @05:10PM (#383207) Journal

          Uzzard here stopped his studies in biology at the point in the textbook where two of every animal got on the big boat...

          --
          I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
      • (Score: 3, Interesting) by frojack on Tuesday August 02 2016, @04:18AM

        by frojack (1554) on Tuesday August 02 2016, @04:18AM (#382991) Journal

        No, they should be able to compete. Against members of their own "intersex" gender.
        A league of their own, so to speak.

        I submitted a story about this issue a couple months ago, and got nothing but flame for it. And here the issue is back on the big stage, with actual scientists weighing in.

        Its going to get harder and harder to sweep under the rug to assuage the feelings of the 2% at the expense of all women's sports. The only rational thing is a third gender for competition purposes.

        --
        No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
        • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Tuesday August 02 2016, @10:21AM

          by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Tuesday August 02 2016, @10:21AM (#383050) Homepage Journal

          Okay, you do realize you're essentially arguing in favor of creating an old fashioned freak show though, yes?

          --
          My rights don't end where your fear begins.
          • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:46PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:46PM (#383125)

            Yes but compared to what it seems is going to happen (turning women's events into a old fashion freak show) it is probably better.

          • (Score: 2) by frojack on Tuesday August 02 2016, @09:48PM

            by frojack (1554) on Tuesday August 02 2016, @09:48PM (#383359) Journal

            The alternative is to disenfranchise all women athletes and turn their sports participation over to transgenders.

            Those who choose to join the freak show should not be denied.

            --
            No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:27AM

    by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Tuesday August 02 2016, @01:27AM (#382923) Homepage Journal

    Nothing wrong with having abnormal physical ability for your gender. All olympic athletes have that. What you're born you should compete as though, without hopping yourself up on tons of hormones even if you take them in your non-athletic daily life.

    --
    My rights don't end where your fear begins.
    • (Score: 2) by dry on Wednesday August 03 2016, @03:33AM

      by dry (223) on Wednesday August 03 2016, @03:33AM (#383480) Journal

      The problem is that the Doctors are really quick to jump in and use surgery to decide an infants sex. Born with a vagina and large phallus, they'll cut out the middle to make it "normal". Born with a vagina and testes but a small phallus, they'll construct a phallus for you and do away with the vagina. Probably flip a coin if you're born with a testicle and an ovary.
      Sex is determined by the hormones at certain periods of development. Usually the hormones are determined by genetics, but not always. Having exposure to both testosterone and estrogen at the right (actually wrong) point in development causes physical confusion and people that you can't clearly say are male or female.