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posted by martyb on Friday August 26 2016, @10:37PM   Printer-friendly
from the beware-Roy-Rogers'-horse? dept.

Recent reporting and discussions here about "trolls" and the "culture of hate" (both con and pro) have repeatedly broached the topic of what appropriate limits to free expression might be.

Dean of Students John Ellison at the University of Chicago has taken a stand on the issue in a letter welcoming new students. He writes:

Once here you will discover that one of the University of Chicago's defining characteristics is our commitment to freedom of inquiry and expression. [...] Members of our community are encouraged to speak, write, listen, challenge, and learn, without fear of censorship. Civility and mutual respect are vital to all of us, and freedom of expression does not mean the freedom to harass or threaten others. You will find that we expect members of our community to be engaged in rigorous debate, discussion, and even disagreement. At times this may challenge you and even cause discomfort.

Our commitment to academic freedom means that we do not support so called 'trigger warnings,' we do not cancel invited speakers because their topics might prove controversial, and we do not condone the creation of intellectual 'safe spaces' where individuals can retreat from ideas and perspectives at odds with their own.

While some have voiced support for Ellison's commitment to free expression (with Robby Soave at Reason encouraging readers to give the dean "a round of applause"), others are concerned about the implications of his message. L.V. Anderson at Slate agrees with much of the letter's content promoting "civility and mutual respect," but finds the last paragraph quoted above to be "weird" and unsettling:

By deriding "safe spaces" and "trigger warnings" before students arrive on campus, the University of Chicago is inadvertently sending a message that certain students—the ones who have never been traumatized, and the ones who have historically felt welcome on college campuses (i.e., white men)—are more welcome than others, and that students who feel marginalized are unlikely to have their claims taken seriously. Adults who decry "the coddling of the American mind" will likely celebrate U. Chicago's preemptive strike against political correctness, but students who have experienced violence, LGBTQ students, and students of color likely will not.


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  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Gravis on Friday August 26 2016, @11:37PM

    by Gravis (4596) on Friday August 26 2016, @11:37PM (#393748)

    the ones who have historically felt welcome on college campuses (i.e., white men)—are more welcome than others, and that students who feel marginalized are unlikely to have their claims taken seriously.

    there is literally nothing to support this claim. i can tell you with great certainty that campus administrations detest all students (that cause them additional paperwork) equally. if you don't believe me, just look at how they treated member of the "occupy" protests. a bunch of students "who have historically felt welcome" got a face full of mace.

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  • (Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 26 2016, @11:49PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 26 2016, @11:49PM (#393756)

    Mace is the best your pussified generation can think of? At Kent State the National Guard just murdered the protesters. No safe space there was.

    • (Score: 2) by dingus on Saturday August 27 2016, @07:45PM

      by dingus (5224) on Saturday August 27 2016, @07:45PM (#394016)

      I expect if things keep heating up we'll get back to the days of the army firing on its own civilians.

  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Francis on Saturday August 27 2016, @12:38AM

    by Francis (5544) on Saturday August 27 2016, @12:38AM (#393779)

    As a white man, I can tell you that there were plenty of times when I didn't feel welcome on college campuses and I didn't get to whine about not getting a safe space.

    The reality is that if you go to college, you're probably going to be exposed to ideas that aren't comfortable. All those safe spaces do is skew it towards the "majority" folks. It was hugely uncomfortable sitting through those feminist and diversity propaganda where cherry picked statistic after cherry picked statistic was presented with no context as a way of making white men feel like shit.

    The strategy isn't useful, helpful or effective. I don't think that making up lies about the frequency of rape and the wage gap are helpful to anybody. And in truth, men have more of a reason to be cautious about walking alone at night than women do. Perhaps back before everybody and their cousin had firearms that wasn't the case, but in the modern era men are the ones that are generally violently assaulted, not women. And women that are raped are rarely raped by somebody they don't know in a back alley.

    Making up lies does nobody any good, if there isn't a reliable statistic on the subject, then perhaps a bit of time spent considering why and the implications are in order. It's bullshit to claim that only a few percents of the number of rapes that occur are reported as nobody has anyway of knowing how many unreported crimes are being committed.

    • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 27 2016, @01:53AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 27 2016, @01:53AM (#393823)

      As a white man,

      Shut up, Francis!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OnpkDWbeJs [youtube.com]

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 27 2016, @07:02AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 27 2016, @07:02AM (#393871)

      in the modern era men are the ones that are generally violently assaulted, not women

      The truth might be more of this:

      There's a large minority of violent men, they stay in about the same areas and they go about assaulting each other (gang wars, arguments etc). And they raise the statistics for men vs men.

      But outside that scenario that large minority is more likely to assault some random woman than some random guy (who is also more likely to be able to get away/defend himself). Or some random guy is more likely to assault some random woman.

      So if you aren't a regular in those areas/situations, your risk of getting violently assaulted is higher if you're a woman.

      It's like including warzones in the stats- in warzones there are lots of guys violently assaulting guys. Many guys like "war" and fighting - many seem to treat sport as a form of duelling or symbolic warfare (by the way there's a big difference between duelling and fighting - lots of martial arts teachers teach duelling and not fighting, while that can be useful it can be dangerous if you don't know the distinction). Males of other species often duel - they charge at each other at high speed and butt heads in a precise way. If they did it differently there's a much higher chance of killing but that's just not done, kills do still happen but there are rules. Oops gone off-topic but :).

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 27 2016, @08:57AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 27 2016, @08:57AM (#393888)

        Large majority?
        You have any proof of that or are you just making shit up as you go along?
        Men are 11 times more likely to be attacked.
        Are all men 11 times more likely to live in gang infested areas?
        How is it that no women live near these places?
        When did we start to segregating living areas by gender?
        You are full of shit.