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posted by martyb on Thursday September 22 2016, @01:39AM   Printer-friendly
from the powerful-story dept.

A "smart energy" revolution could help ensure that the UK does not suffer blackouts, according to National Grid's new UK chief.

Nicola Shaw, its executive director, said technological advances will reduce the need to build new conventional power stations in the UK.

An "internet of energy" will allow fridges, washers and dishwashers to help balance energy demand.

Some commentators say the UK needs more gas-fired power to prevent blackouts.

Ms Shaw agreed that more investment in gas-fired power was needed, but argued that between 30% and 50% of fluctuations on the electricity grid could be smoothed by households and businesses adjusting their demand at peak times.

The gas company executive says more gas-fired power is necessary to prevent blackouts in the future. Also, smart appliances could help balance energy demand across a smart grid.


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  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by ledow on Thursday September 22 2016, @09:50AM

    by ledow (5567) on Thursday September 22 2016, @09:50AM (#405070) Homepage

    You cannot "balance demand".

    Demand is a figure of how much people are asking for AT THAT MOMENT.

    You can try to reduce demand. That requires those people's co-operation.
    You can try to balance the network to meet demand. That's your problem.
    But you cannot balance demand.

    What you're saying is "When we haven't got enough electricity, we turn your things off so we don't have to invest in our networks. We turn them back on when we have spare."

    Which everyone knows, everyone reads-between-the-lines and nobody wants.
    You CAN NOT KNOW whether my dishwasher or washing machine has to be on at a certain time, unless I tell you and you abide by that. That's "demand" for you.

    You can't know that I'm going away on a trip and desperately need my clothes washed and dried NOW, to be ready for a certain time. You have no way to know that unless I tell you.
    Or that my electric car must be charged ready to take me to the airport this afternoon.

    The only way to KNOW is to put it under my control, so I have to press a button on the device or the meter that says "No, I want to turn this on now" and overrides your desires. And another button that says "I don't care about this, you can turn it on or off at any time".

    Guess what happens if you give people that kind of control? Your smart network is rendered singularly useless in seconds.

    That's your problem in a nutshell. People want your product. You don't have the infrastructure to supply it. So what you're doing is telling people they can't have it. Guess what happens when you do that to people willing to pay for your service? It vastly devalues your service, and makes them want to find other methods that don't involve giving you money.

    "Smart" meters in the UK are nothing more than smartphone-connected ammeters at the moment. That's to encourage people to lessen usage, and save you costs of a meter reader visiting the property. It PROVABLY doesn't work to reduce usage. Those who care already do that, those who don't won't.

    Proper smart meters, that can adjust the electric supply in the house, will turn people's stuff off for them. You've yet to go down that route but when you do, you'll find everything stopping using your service. Solar installers are ten-a-penny nowadays. People will re-route their fuse boxes so the "critical" lighting circuit includes the washing machine or whatever. They will bypass the meter. Or they will just turn it off and go elsewhere.

    Why you, as an electric network, would want that, I can't fathom.

    P.S. The reason you can't meet demand? Pissing about with windmills and solar in the UK where neither are ideal. And blocking nuclear until literally last week when a new one was approved. Years of underinvestment. And billions spent on putting silly ammeters into people's homes.

    When real smart meters arrive, they will do their job. They will reduce demand. By making the electrical companies bankrupt within a matter of years. I'm not sure that's a win-win at all.

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  • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday September 22 2016, @04:07PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday September 22 2016, @04:07PM (#405169)

    I think you are being a bit too literal and missing the forest for the trees. The concept of balancing demand is smoothing the demand curve to make it more uniform. Let me give an example which may make it more clear.

    I need gas/petrol for my car. I need to fill my tank about once a week or I'll run empty, but I can fill it pretty much any time. Now due to reasons, everybody tends to fill on Monday morning so there are huge lines. You can solve this by building more gas stations (which will be empty most of the week), or if you can coordinate things you can balance the demand so 1/7 of the people fill their cars on each day of the week.

    To the point of energy, there tend to be spikes of power usage at specific times (business hours are high, 3:00 AM is low). You can build more power plants, or you can figure out a way balance demand to flatten out the peaks.

    I can see this turning into big-brother, or "your dishwasher doesn't do what you tell it," or other very bad things (hackers take over your house). I would agree that at this time this is a "do not want!" However, in theory, I could imagine loading a dishwasher and pushing a button saying "wash whenever is convenient" and then walking away, for it to run overnight. It wouldn't be that obnoxious.