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posted by martyb on Friday November 18 2016, @01:52AM   Printer-friendly
from the lost-art-of-double-clutching dept.

Visitors to the upcoming Los Angeles Auto Show will see supercars, hoverboards, self-propelling luggage and all manner of new transportation options.

But they'll be hard pressed to find a clutch pedal or a stick shift. Available in nearly half of new models in the U.S. a decade ago, the manual transmission is going the way of the rumble seat, with stick availability falling to about a quarter this year.

Once standard equipment on all motor vehicles, preferred for its dependability, fuel efficiency and sporty characteristics, the four-on-the-floor is disappearing from major car manufacturers' lineups — and subsequently from the sprawling auto show's floors.

Consider, too, that electric vehicles don't even have a transmission.


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  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Arik on Friday November 18 2016, @02:57AM

    by Arik (4543) on Friday November 18 2016, @02:57AM (#428596) Journal
    The population has just become so effeminate no one cares.

    I joke. A real man uses the best tool for the job. Modern automatic transmissions are really quite excellent tech, they work very very well, and have relatively few drawbacks. I would *still* demand a manual on a work truck, but the days when you had to choose between stick shift and shitty performance in a passenger car are definitely gone.
    --
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  • (Score: 2) by AthanasiusKircher on Friday November 18 2016, @03:26AM

    by AthanasiusKircher (5291) on Friday November 18 2016, @03:26AM (#428616) Journal

    Not only are automatics excellent these days, but they continue to evolve. I know it's controversial among some, but I find CVTs to be pretty awesome. Super smooth ride and acceleration, relatively quiet, great fuel economy, and they've definitely worked out the kinks from the early years (which weren't so long ago). They also seem to maximize acceleration from even a small engine -- I was frankly astounded at the power when I first tried one given the specs. Perhaps not as "fun" to drive as a manual, but after driving a CVT for a few months, I really grew to like it.

    • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 18 2016, @05:24AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 18 2016, @05:24AM (#428678)

      A standard front or rear wheel transmission or a locker style 4/awd would be far easier to repair/replace/maintain.

      If you start getting into modern manual AWD transmissions, or automatics or any number of variations, the reliability and maintainability go out the window.

      One of the things people often overlook is the fluid used in automatics versus that used in true manual transmissions. The former use highly refined low viscosity oils which are fouled easily. The latter use either motor oil or gear oil, just like that used in your transmission or industrial equipment. In the latter's case it will last without fouling pretty much indefinitely (unless you are grinding gears) and while expected to be replaced every 30-60k miles, will probably outlast the life of the transmission. That automatic on the other hand (excepting some modern automatics, notable double-clutched sequentials which are actually computer controlled manuals acting as automatics.) is going to require periodic fluid topoffs (often loses some small amount between the seals.) and full fluid flushes somewhere between 30-100k miles (I'm not sure what the very latest numbers are. Old autos you go 30k and that fluid is BURNT, newer ones often last longer but still fry out, unlike motor oil.)

      All-wheel drive systems are even more complicated, since many contain viscious coupling units, which have their own non-user servicable fluid and high temperatures which can break down the surrounding lubricant, oil or atf.)

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 18 2016, @05:31AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 18 2016, @05:31AM (#428680)

      People don't like CVTs because of the unnatural-seeming (really just different) behavior. If you accelerate, the engine goes straight to its power peak and stays there while the gear ratio slowly gets taller as the car accelerates. Even though this is the most effective way to accelerate, for whatever reason, people don't like it. I guess they like to listen to the engine sound to tell how fast they are accelerating. Of course, the early CVTs weren't very reliable either, and that has improved quite a bit.

      The issue with CVTs now is that they are still quite limited in the amount of power they can handle. With basically every midsize and larger car now having over 200HP, they are relegated to the smallest cars.

      • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday November 18 2016, @05:47AM

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday November 18 2016, @05:47AM (#428690) Journal

        "I guess they like to listen to the engine sound"

        Yep. I'm a dinosaur who learned to drive in a six cylinder chevy pickup, three on the tree. The pickup wasn't noisy, but I could hear it. You could hear when it was time to shift. Big trucks, ditto, whether they were 5-speed or 18-speed. Listen to the engine, and you know when to up-shift or down-shift. I like the sound of the engine, it tells you everything you really need to know about how the truck is running. If the engine is sick, you can hear it, and either fix it, or find someone who can fix it. I don't like excessively noisy engines or motors, but I don't like them to quiet, either. (Excessive noise is the sign of a bad exhaust system, which is bad for the engine and/or the driver in a number of ways.)

      • (Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Friday November 18 2016, @03:16PM

        by tangomargarine (667) on Friday November 18 2016, @03:16PM (#428860)

        I guess they like to listen to the engine sound to tell how fast they are accelerating. Of course, the early CVTs weren't very reliable either, and that has improved quite a bit.

        Heh. That's actually the reason I didn't buy one car the last time I was in the market. I wanted a manual, just for fun really, having spent the early years after getting my license mostly driving one, and one of the 4 manuals on an entire bigass used car lot had an engine that was so quiet I could barely hear it even with no music on.

        Yeah, you should be able to drive manuals just by feel, but the audio cues help, too.

        --
        "Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
        • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Friday November 18 2016, @05:15PM

          by bob_super (1357) on Friday November 18 2016, @05:15PM (#428931)

          Whether it's on the highway in 5th (I badly need a sixth), or in the canyon in 3rd, the noise of the engine tells me how fast I'm going, so I don't need to look down at the tach.
          I also have actual physical (cheap-plastic) controls, so I can set anything while keeping my eyes on the road, even when it's bumpy or twisty.
          Unlike most, I have a friendly commute where I can play with the limited capabilities of my car (having a fancy powerful car would cost me my license in a matter of days).

          • (Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Friday November 18 2016, @06:05PM

            by tangomargarine (667) on Friday November 18 2016, @06:05PM (#428976)

            Whether it's on the highway in 5th (I badly need a sixth)

            Isn't top gear just overdrive? So you're saying you'd like an extra gear from 50-60 that isn't overdrive? I'm afraid I don't follow.

            --
            "Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
            • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Friday November 18 2016, @06:33PM

              by bob_super (1357) on Friday November 18 2016, @06:33PM (#428993)

              I drive a subcompact (nissan Versa). The gear ratio in 5th is about 20MPH per thousand RPM. For long distance, having a longer 6th to let the engine run around 2500rpm would be a lot less noisy than my current 3500rpm, and would reduce wear and tear and gas mileage (not complaining about almost 40, but I'll take any improvement). I would have to drop back to 5th on hills, given the torque, but that's not a major sacrifice.
              Quite a few recent econoboxes got a 6-gear box so they can feel peppy despite small engines, and still have decent mileage/comfort on the highway. Mine isn't one of those.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 18 2016, @07:02PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 18 2016, @07:02PM (#429017)

                If you ever wear out a set of tires on your Versa, switch to somewhat larger diameter tires. Will move all your gears up a little bit. Every little bit helps...and there are a lot of choices in tire size.

                Years ago with a chain drive motorcycle, I installed a larger front sprocket. The result was that 4th became an overdrive. Thus it went about the same top speed in both 3rd and 4th gears (about 110 mph), but much more relaxed cruising in 4th/high gear. I sacrificed some acceleration in 1st gear, but there was still plenty so that wasn't a problem for me.

                • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Friday November 18 2016, @08:41PM

                  by bob_super (1357) on Friday November 18 2016, @08:41PM (#429097)

                  I tried when I finally got rid of the original tires (don't expect to need new ones for a while). Even figured out the right tires to not have to buy new rims.
                  The problem is that legitimate shops in California all told me that they are not supposed to put tires over 3% bigger than stock, and actually did the math to be sure. I would guess it's for tachometer calibration reasons. So I still have tiny 14" ones and just try to ignore the engine noise.