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posted by janrinok on Thursday December 29 2016, @01:24AM   Printer-friendly
from the but-the-money-is-good dept.

It didn't dawn on me that there might be a few holes in my education until I was about 35. I'd just bought a house, the pipes needed fixing, and the plumber was standing in my kitchen. There he was, a short, beefy guy with a goatee and a Red Sox cap and a thick Boston accent, and I suddenly learned that I didn't have the slightest idea what to say to someone like him. So alien was his experience to me, so unguessable his values, so mysterious his very language, that I couldn't succeed in engaging him in a few minutes of small talk before he got down to work. Fourteen years of higher education and a handful of Ivy League degrees, and there I was, stiff and stupid, struck dumb by my own dumbness. "Ivy retardation," a friend of mine calls this. I could carry on conversations with people from other countries, in other languages, but I couldn't talk to the man who was standing in my own house.

It's not surprising that it took me so long to discover the extent of my miseducation, because the last thing an elite education will teach you is its own inadequacy. As two dozen years at Yale and Columbia have shown me, elite colleges relentlessly encourage their students to flatter themselves for being there, and for what being there can do for them. The advantages of an elite education are indeed undeniable. You learn to think, at least in certain ways, and you make the contacts needed to launch yourself into a life rich in all of society's most cherished rewards. To consider that while some opportunities are being created, others are being cancelled and that while some abilities are being developed, others are being crippled is, within this context, not only outrageous, but inconceivable.


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  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @01:45AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @01:45AM (#446918)

    The op doesn't say when they went to high school. For me, that was around 1970. I had been "college tracked" in earlier grades and eventually took AP classes senior year. But I always had a desire to work with my hands, so somehow I managed to fit metal shop, mechanical drawing and a few other "blue collar" things into my high school schedule. I can remember a meeting with a guidance counselor who helped me juggle my schedule and classes so everything would fit.

    At the time, my academic peers didn't understand why I was "slumming it" with all those "dummies" but even then I could see that there were plenty of smart and artistic people in the shop classes, just not book-smart. Meanwhile, I was subject to some hazing by the tougher guys in the shop class, until I showed that I could match them with various tools.

    I went on to a degree from an Ivy, but the early manual training has served me well. And I usually don't have any trouble talking to plumbers, even if I don't have all the detailed knowledge/experience that lets them do their job effectively.

    From what I've heard, this can be all but impossible to do these days. My old school shut down most/all of the shop classes completely.

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  • (Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @02:53AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @02:53AM (#446941)

    Even in the mountain country out here in California they have been cutting shop classes.

    One of my professors in college was working sundays down in the valley at a JC, but his 9-5 job was as a shop teacher up in the mountain country doing auto shop for the kids up there. He spent 7+ years building this program up, including making the contacts necessary to get them 'cast off' automotive parts for building/modifying a drag car (which in turn they would bring down to the city and get to take runs in at the local raceway.) Long story short, the administration of the high school/district up there changed, and the shop class got axed. All that hard work (which was enough to get a page or two mention in Hot Rod Magazine!) went down the drain in a single short sighted choice by a new school administrator, and years of work went to naught for future children passing through that high school, many of which may have found that their only joy in an otherwise miserable high school experience (I know mine personally was!)

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:13AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:13AM (#446955)

      That shit boils my blood. Teachers sacrifice so much of their lives for the benefit of their students, and it can be undone with the swipe of a pen... Yet another example of why we need to create a post-economic reality where such a simple thing as educating our children is no longer crippled by financial concerns. In such a future the hard part would be finding someone to take over the shop program when that teacher retires.

      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by khallow on Thursday December 29 2016, @05:15AM

        by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Thursday December 29 2016, @05:15AM (#446973) Journal

        Yet another example of why we need to create a post-economic reality where such a simple thing as educating our children is no longer crippled by financial concerns.

        What makes you think it is now? Just because some suit's priorities are screwed up doesn't mean that financial concerns are the reason. There's generally a lot of money to go around.

        • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @10:10AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @10:10AM (#447025)

          Yeah there's lots of money, but I've heard rumours that the administrator-teacher ratio has gone up in many places and some administrators are probably getting too much. Can't be bothered to verify at the moment.

          And the typical US reaction is that means Public Education is broken so instead of fixing it let's partially replace it with other stuff (home school, vouchers etc).

          If you're not the ruling caste and still want Democracy it's in your interest to try to get public education fixed. If you're in the ruling caste, congrats, just make sure Trump doesn't nuke us all (e.g. tell the Secretary of Defense he gets amnesty for shooting Trump dead if he tries to launch the nukes just because of some tweet).

          • (Score: 0, Troll) by khallow on Thursday December 29 2016, @03:23PM

            by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Thursday December 29 2016, @03:23PM (#447094) Journal

            And the typical US reaction is that means Public Education is broken so instead of fixing it let's partially replace it with other stuff (home school, vouchers etc).

            That's my view as well.

            If you're not the ruling caste and still want Democracy it's in your interest to try to get public education fixed.

            Trying isn't working for a considerable portion of public schools. It's yet another place where the US spends a lot of public funds without getting appropriately good results.

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Whoever on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:39PM

              by Whoever (4524) on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:39PM (#447120) Journal

              And, right on schedule, khallow comes up with yet another unsupported Republican talking point.

              If public schools could be selective in the way private schools are, results would match private schools.

              • (Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 29 2016, @05:01PM

                by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Thursday December 29 2016, @05:01PM (#447130) Journal

                And, right on schedule, khallow comes up with yet another unsupported Republican talking point.

                A talking point doesn't become any more or less true just because you call it a talking point. In the US, there are large public school systems which are notoriously bad (and not in the sense of merely having bad students) and overseen by an elected school board. If democratic action were enough to prevent these systems from becoming that bad, then it would have happened by now.

                If public schools could be selective in the way private schools are, results would match private schools.

                And sometimes they do.

                • (Score: 3, Insightful) by aristarchus on Thursday December 29 2016, @10:13PM

                  by aristarchus (2645) on Thursday December 29 2016, @10:13PM (#447207) Journal

                  A talking point doesn't become any more or less true just because you call it a talking point.

                  Unless, of course, the reason it is a talking point is that it is not true, and khallow's Republican masters have put out the word that the talking point is to be repeated enough to create the plausible impression that it might be true. This is a time whonored propaganda technique. Learned it from the Nazis!
                      Besides, we know the US educational system sucks, since khallow cannot read Marx. Even in translation. So sad.

      • (Score: 2) by Ellis D. Tripp on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:04PM

        by Ellis D. Tripp (3416) on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:04PM (#447106)

        became a LOT more difficult once a degree in education became a requirement. This rules out almost all the highly skilled contractors, technicians, mechanics, and tradespeople who went directly into the workforce, and then want to get into teaching later in their careers. There were once "alternative certification" programs in place specifically for this purpose, but they have largely been removed in this age of a college degree becoming the new HS diploma....

        --
        "Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up, you end up with a lot of scum on the top!"--Edward Abbey
      • (Score: 1) by Sumtingwong on Friday December 30 2016, @04:19AM

        by Sumtingwong (3592) on Friday December 30 2016, @04:19AM (#447272)

        The same suit who axed the program did his damnedest to get into the Ivy league, may or may not have succeeded, and is the author of story you just read and posted.

        --
        Things are more like they are today than they ever were before.
    • (Score: 2) by mhajicek on Thursday December 29 2016, @05:25AM

      by mhajicek (51) on Thursday December 29 2016, @05:25AM (#446980)

      And then they wonder why all the jobs went overseas. Most jobs which are not manufacturing exist to support manufacturing in one way or another. A service only economy cannot support itself.

      --
      The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @07:50AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @07:50AM (#447006)

        Even now, it looks like we are living on borrowed time and money... until the financiers call the note.

        We have been warned ( by the Bible ) not to do this, but we have done it anyway. We will pay the price. It won't be cheap.

        • (Score: 2) by mhajicek on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:19PM

          by mhajicek (51) on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:19PM (#447110)

          Curious, what warning in the bible are you referring to?

          --
          The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
          • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @06:14PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @06:14PM (#447151)

            It's the one on the last page that reads "The End".

        • (Score: 2, Informative) by khallow on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:39PM

          by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Thursday December 29 2016, @04:39PM (#447121) Journal

          We have been warned ( by the Bible )

          I'll note here that the vast majority of Earth (including most of the US) doesn't use the Bible as a morality guide. I would recommend instead appealing to something they do use.

        • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday December 29 2016, @06:50PM

          by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Thursday December 29 2016, @06:50PM (#447166) Journal

          We've also been warned by the Bible not to plant two or more kinds of grain in one field, wear mixed fabrics, or let a guy with cataracts into the Temple. How about you appeal to reality as to why this is a bad idea instead of a collection of books written by bloodthirsty Iron-age savages wondering where the sun went at night, huh?

          --
          I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @07:06AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @07:06AM (#446999)

      FFA was that for me. but I lived in a now quasi-rural area for high school.
      if you want a relatively safe way to get your ivy league knuckles dirty, volunteer a few weekends at a Habitat For Humanity build. And be just a bit humble. It can be fun, even if it's just doing schlep work.
      The real crew will be used enough talking to people like you. And chances are any real tradescrew they have, like plumbers, have probably worked for Habitat for Humanity too, so may have some people skills.
      just be willing to listen. and do. It's a work sirte after all.

      • (Score: 1) by theronb on Thursday December 29 2016, @11:09PM

        by theronb (2596) on Thursday December 29 2016, @11:09PM (#447222)

        I'll second that on Habitat, and you might just learn something that you'll find useful and rewarding even if you don't have to make a living at it. Also, "And be just a little bit humble." Ask a few questions, show you're interested in what they think and know. You probably already know to do that with your Ivy League friends and acquaintances; it works with anybody.

  • (Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @03:17AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @03:17AM (#446945)

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/24/magazine/24labor-t.html [nytimes.com]
    "Yet my M.A. obscures a more real stupidification of the work I secured with that credential, and a wage to match. When I first got the degree, I felt as if I had been inducted to a certain order of society. But despite the beautiful ties I wore, it turned out to be a more proletarian existence than I had known as an electrician. In that job I had made quite a bit more money. I also felt free and active, rather than confined and stultified. A good job requires a field of action where you can put your best capacities to work and see an effect in the world. Academic credentials do not guarantee this."

    Also: http://disciplinedminds.tripod.com/ [tripod.com]
    "The hidden root of much career dissatisfaction, argues Schmidt, is the professional's lack of control over the political component of his or her creative work. Many professionals set out to make a contribution to society and add meaning to their lives. Yet our system of professional education and employment abusively inculcates an acceptance of politically subordinate roles in which professionals typically do not make a significant difference, undermining the creative potential of individuals, organizations and even democracy."

    And "Post-Scarcity Princeton": http://pdfernhout.net/reading-between-the-lines.html#Rethinking_the_mythological_scaffolding_of_the_Princeton_community [pdfernhout.net]

  • (Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @03:42AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 29 2016, @03:42AM (#446951)

    In high school I was "college prep" so I had to take Latin and was not permitted to take up space in metal shop or drafting. So as soon as I got to college I was informed that Latin was useless for an engineering degree and I would have to take drafting immediately. On my first job out of college I had to make parts on a lathe (self-taught). Meanwhile my old high school eliminated the metal shop. Based on my experience, the problem with education is educators.