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Basic Income is a subject that regularly surfaces in Soylent discussions, so here's a story about Finland's impending experiment with it:
Finland has become the first country in Europe to pay its unemployed citizens a basic monthly income, amounting to 560 euros ($587 US), in a unique social experiment which is hoped to cut government red tape, reduce poverty and boost employment.
Olli Kangas from the Finnish government agency KELA, which is responsible for the country's social benefits, said Monday that the two-year trial with the 2,000 randomly picked citizens who receive unemployment benefits kicked off Jan. 1.
Those chosen will receive 560 euros every month, with no reporting requirements on how they spend it. The amount will be deducted from any benefits they already receive.
The average private sector income in Finland is 3,500 euros per month, according to official data.
Also at The Guardian and swissinfo.ch.
(Score: 2) by curunir_wolf on Wednesday January 04 2017, @08:39PM
It won't push up the cost of production much for anything where labour is not a significant part of the cost.
This assumption makes no sense. Labor costs will absolutely increase, because you will have a smaller labor force, with people opting out of work because they are receiving a UBI, and others refusing certain jobs because they are receiving a UBI. Businesses would HAVE to offer higher wages in order to attract the same labor force.
I am a crackpot
(Score: 2) by Immerman on Wednesday January 04 2017, @10:12PM
The point is, that labor costs are already only a small fraction of the production cost of most goods and many services. Even if you double the cost of labor, if that was only 10% of the cost of making a widget, the cost to buy a widget will only increase 10%.
(Score: 2) by curunir_wolf on Thursday January 05 2017, @12:30AM
Sure, but you still have to INSTALL the widget, so it's still going to cost you 110% more unless you can somehow install it yourself. That kills the service industry, which is pretty much ALL labor costs, and is also where the labor costs will increase the most. And that's where most of the jobs have been created lately. Uber won't be finding drivers when the government has just provided the extra incoming they were getting driving for nothing.
I am a crackpot
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Immerman on Thursday January 05 2017, @03:38AM
Nothing will cost you 110% more. The widget costs 10% more, and the installation costs twice as much. But if your widget needs installing, installation is almost certainly only a fraction of the cost of the widget itself, so the overall cost is still only increased by that fraction.
(Score: 2) by curunir_wolf on Thursday January 05 2017, @05:06AM
Are you trying to do math? You may need some help.
Widget costs $5. Assume (for the sake of argument), that to make it costs $4, and 10% is labor costs of $0.40. Installation is all labor, and that's $2.50 (pretty common, for something simple, labor is about 1/2 the cost of the part, on average, can be a lot more, but this is a generic widget, so that's a good rule of thumb).
So the UBI comes in, wages go up. Company ends up paying double in labor costs to attract enough workers (they're making more widgets, too, because more people can afford them).
So now labor is $0.80 to make one widget, and company passes on the increase and it now costs $5.50.
Installation labor also doubles, to $5.
Now you're paying $11 for something that used to cost $7.50. So it's really only around 70%, not 110%, but you get the point.
Also, you haircut went from $20 to $40, your maid is charging $200 a week instead of $100, that Uber ride (if there are any left) went from $15 to $30, and cab rides have increased even more, because the cab company is paying double for not just drivers, but also for the mechanics and the dispatchers. If you think those increases are bad, wait until you see how much your hospital and doctors bills go up when nurses and orderlies are demanding more pay. Grocery stores operate on very TINY margins, so, yes, food will increase a lot more than just farmer labor costs, because they also have to pay for cashier, stock boys, cleaning crews, and that goes for pretty much all the retail stores and all those little service industry shops sharing the same strip mall where your grocery store is.
So, yes, there is a LOT more to labor costs that you're thinking about.
I am a crackpot
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 05 2017, @06:19AM
Good! I kinda like the idea of people being paid fair wages and costs rising higher so that it becomes cost effective to fix things instead of buying new ones.
(Score: 2) by TheRaven on Thursday January 05 2017, @10:50AM
sudo mod me up