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The Trump administration has frozen grants and contracts by the Environmental Protection Agency, according to ProPublica, and blocked employees from providing updates on this change via social media. This could have big effects on the agency's budget and severely undercut its efforts.
In an email obtained by ProPublica, one EPA contractor writes that: "The new EPA administration has asked that all contract and grant awards be temporarily suspended, effective immediately. Until we receive further clarification, this includes task orders and work assignments."
Also, employees have been banned from providing updates to reporters or on social media. The internal memo specifies that no press releases will go out to external audiences, there will be "no blog messages" and media requests will be carefully screened. (Interestingly, the Department of Energy, a fellow federal agency, recently released new guidelines that specifically protects contractors and ensures that they can state their personal opinions.)
Source: The Verge
takyon: Here are some related stories happening at the same time:
USDA scrambles to ease concerns after researchers were ordered to stop publishing news releases, other documents
USDA disavows gag-order emailed to scientific research unit
Commerce nominee Ross promises to protect "peer-reviewed research" at NOAA
CDC postpones climate conference ahead of Trump takeover
Badlands National Park goes rogue with climate-change tweets
(Score: 5, Informative) by Scruffy Beard 2 on Wednesday January 25 2017, @06:53AM
FAQ: The issues around muzzling government scientists [www.cbc.ca]
Then after a few years, they started erasing history (when the scientists are not longer allowed to object):
What's Driving Chaotic Dismantling of Canada's Science Libraries? [thetyee.ca]
(Score: -1, Troll) by khallow on Wednesday January 25 2017, @08:14AM
(Score: 2) by takyon on Wednesday January 25 2017, @09:38AM
You got double troll modded before I could even figure out WTF you are talking about. Want to give a citation for that claim? Does it have to do with moon tapes sitting in a box in the basement?
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Wednesday January 25 2017, @10:21AM
You know, your reply to him got me wondering as I had heard that rumor (or is it now an alternative fact?) before. Seems NASA is actually doing the opposite. And trying to preserve as much of the research as possible.
https://www.sti.nasa.gov/ [nasa.gov]
We've all heard the stories of misplaced samples and tapes. Something that isn't unusual in any large business, much less a government institution. But happily, I could find nothing suggesting they were destroying old research.
We can all sleep a little better tonight....
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Wednesday January 25 2017, @10:55AM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11_missing_tapes [wikipedia.org]
Moon landing tapes got erased, NASA admits [reuters.com]
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Thursday January 26 2017, @01:21AM
Yeah, I remember those.
At least they're not actually destroying old research intentionally like the original poster suggested. As I recall they lost some Moon rocks during that era as well.
I remember being 10 years old, watching the first Moon landing. Sigh, such greatness seems beyond the world in this era.
Back to Kerbal Space Program for a tiny taste of those distant memories......
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.
(Score: 2) by FatPhil on Wednesday January 25 2017, @02:27PM
He apparently is unaware that you can only cull that which is live, and research is only live when it's being done. So you can cull the verb research, but not cull the noun research (the completed output of prior research the verb). Not having the budget to maintain full extensive libraries of prior completed research (which has only rarely happened, and that was way back) is *utterly* unrelated to the termination of active research, which is what the old fart appears to be instigating.
But I guess that's just the typical gibberish to be expected from khallow.
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
(Score: 2) by takyon on Wednesday January 25 2017, @02:39PM
I don't play those games, don't have a foe list. I'd rather judge each post as it is presented. Sorry.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 4, Funny) by jdavidb on Wednesday January 25 2017, @04:07PM
I don't play those games, don't have a foe list
Somebody, somewhere just said "Sounds like a challenge."
ⓋⒶ☮✝🕊 Secession is the right of all sentient beings
(Score: 1, Troll) by http on Wednesday January 25 2017, @06:41PM
Challenge? Fuck you, you fucking fuck. It's effortless to get hodads like you to wish for better filters. Like the "Foe: -6" preference that's available. Not that you could find it in the SN settings.
I browse at -1 when I have mod points. It's unsettling.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 25 2017, @06:55PM
One of khallow's better efforts, really. Reminded my more of classic frojack: understated, misdirection, surface appearance of rationality, denies climate change, than it did of
just the typical gibberish to be expected from khallow.
But that is just my opinion, since we live in a post-factual world.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Wednesday January 25 2017, @08:59PM
But that is just my opinion, since we live in a post-factual world.
I think this post demonstrates the bankruptcy of the term, "post-factual". Opinions remain opinions no matter what sort of world we live in.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 25 2017, @11:11PM
the bankruptcy of the term, "post-factual". Opinions remain opinions no matter what sort of world we live in.
Ah, yes, if forgot about the khallow reading disability! "Post-factual" means there are no facts, and since there are no facts, opinions are as good as facts, since facts no longer exist and an opinion is better than nothing. khallow's opinions, on the other hand, are not better than nothing, since even as non-facts they are not true.
But I guess that's just the typical gibberish to be expected from khallow.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday January 26 2017, @12:15AM
Ah, yes, if forgot about the khallow reading disability!
Too bad, you posted anonymously. We could use the opportunity to be reminded who posts pure shit around here.
The obvious rebuttal here is that words have meaning. "post-factual" consists of two works. "Post" meaning to come after. And "factual" meaning concerned with what is actually the case. Neither which is relevant here. You presented an opinion which would remain an opinion should you have cared about what actually is the case (a "factual" world rather than your "post-factual" world).
Further, the term implies a past which was more factual. Such a world has never existed.
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Thursday January 26 2017, @04:41AM
Too bad, you posted anonymously.
Funny you should say this, my dear and fluffy khallow! Did you think it was me? Or AntonK? Or turgid? Or the infamous g_weg? No, it matters little who is posting anonymously, since the point is made regardless. Post-factual is code for ideology dominating reality, for the Trump admin silencing scientists who are publishing actual facts. Post-factual is fascist speak for Newspeak. Words no longer mean what they once meant, since we are dealing with a "new" reality, an "alternative" reality.
And yes, the world before Trump was not so Huge, the Inauguration crowds did not have to be the biggest ever, the Golden Showers were just a way to get back at people who did not show the proper respect to The Donald, nothing pervy about that at all. We had real, actual facts. In other words, my tingly and slightly dis-combuberated khallow, you are stuck with yet another tarbaby. I suggest that you IMMEDIATELY swear that you do not have loyalty to President Trump! Swear, khallow, or no Soylentil other than jmorris and Runaway1234 will ever be able to respect you again.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by khallow on Thursday January 26 2017, @10:39AM
Funny you should say this, my dear and fluffy khallow! Did you think it was me? Or AntonK? Or turgid? Or the infamous g_weg? No, it matters little who is posting anonymously, since the point is made regardless.
Well, I don't place great weight on vague, unsupported, anonymous accusations. One also needs some sort of history as well in order to have conversations. So no, the point is not made regardless. And since the rest of your post was a waste of my time, I instead want to address why I dipped my toes in this discussion in the first place.
There are two key observations. First, this is a temporary situation. We just had a change of leadership at the EPA with the new leadership wanting to make radical changes to the organization. So it's not a surprise that relevant spending is now under review. This is also a bit of showboating. One of the rules of taking over is to make changes, even if they are superficial in order to demonstrate that things have changed. Let's give Trump some rope first before we hang him.
And sorry, I'm not a big fan of the EPA. There's too much weird and vicious crap that the EPA does, such as: an institutional hostility to business that has been setting back the US for forty years, a significant contributor to the bulk and complexity of all US law (I'd have to look, but I recall the EPA contributing a page count of somewhere over 10% of all US regulation ever), and recent legal adventurism such as claiming [wikipedia.org] that one doesn't have standing to contest in court the imposition of massive fines until one pays the fines.
Second, the speech side is not a new policy. The previous two administrations have been similarly obsessed about controlling the flow of information through these same venues and there's never been a time in US history when public employees were free to say in public whatever they felt like without potential negative consequences from their bosses and administrations.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by aristarchus on Thursday January 26 2017, @06:20PM
So no, the point is not made regardless.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man!
And since the rest of your post was a waste of my time,
You are quite welcome! Read me again in the future for more searing insight!
I instead want to address why I dipped my toes in this discussion in the first place.
Sorry, khallow, but no one really cares. Your intervention is sadly expected well before you made it.
But two points:
And sorry, I'm not a big fan of the EPA. There's too much weird and vicious crap that the EPA does,
OK, you are a Republican, not just a conservative or libertariantard, so you hate regulations, and so you hate Nixon's Environmental Protection Agency. Nothing new or surprising here.
Second, the speech side is not a new policy. The previous two administrations have been similarly obsessed about controlling the flow of information through these same venues
Really? Is this "alternative history"? Don't recall any climate change deniers in the USDA or NASA or EPA being muzzled when the last legitimate President of the United States took office. We need citations for this one.
And the switch to NASA was real clever! Old sleight of hand stuff, right there! As another AC said, almost up to frojack levels! On SoylentNews, we like our Herring Red, because only dead fish go with the flow (thanks, Sarah), and a Trump supporter rots from the head down.
But I guess that's just the typical gibberish to be expected from khallow.
--
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday January 26 2017, @08:46PM
Really? Is this "alternative history"? Don't recall any climate change deniers in the USDA or NASA or EPA being muzzled when the last legitimate President of the United States took office. We need citations for this one.
From here [nytimes.com]:
Longtime employees at three of the agencies — including some career environmental regulators who conceded that they remained worried about what President Trump might do on policy matters — said such orders were not much different from those delivered by the Obama administration as it shifted policies from the departing White House of George W. Bush. They called reactions to the agency memos overblown. On Wednesday, Douglas Ericksen, a spokesman for the E.P.A., said that grants had been only briefly frozen for review, and that they would be restarted by Friday.
“I’ve lived through many transitions, and I don’t think this is a story,” said a senior E.P.A. career official who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the news media on the matter. “I don’t think it’s fair to call it a gag order. This is standard practice. And the move with regard to the grants, when a new administration comes in, you run things by them before you update the website.”
There you go. I think it's nice that the press is actually watching this time, but we need to remember the synergy of confirmation and observation bias that you display. Because you didn't know of the time Obama did this and did know of the time Trump did this, it became "muzzling".
And the switch to NASA was real clever! Old sleight of hand stuff, right there! As another AC said, almost up to frojack levels! On SoylentNews, we like our Herring Red, because only dead fish go with the flow (thanks, Sarah), and a Trump supporter rots from the head down.
Going from a pretty innocuous transition of power procedure to shutting down of some Canadian libraries and then extrapolating from that shut down to "erasing history" is overblown rhetoric. Did NASA intend to "erase history" when it reduced the holdings and size of its institutional libraries over the decades? Or the many libraries of colleges? There's plenty of cases where people close or reduce libraries with the usual consequences of doing so. We don't hyperventilate over it as intentional erasing of history in those cases.
And the bizarre thing is that this isn't a red herring. It's merely an observation which several posters, including you, dear aristarchus, choose to misinterpret as actions of Trump and even Harper were misinterpreted in this very thread. It's a pattern (to use the vernacular of coding, an "anti-pattern") of irrationality.
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Friday January 27 2017, @07:28AM
including you, dear aristarchus, choose to misinterpret. . .
Did you see that? khallow finally called me "dear"! Be still my beating heart!
Louis, I think this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship.
Rick, in Casablanca [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by requerdanos on Wednesday January 25 2017, @11:11PM
Plus, asserting that we live in a "post-factual world" implies that truth, falsehood, lies, facts don't have meaning. However, true things are still true and false things are still false. Whether anyone agrees with them or not. Whether anyone *knows about* them or not.
Even saying that we live in a "post-factual world" as a criticism of those so confused as to not recognize the difference between things which exist in reality and things that do not does a disservice to the relative importance of information and its value.
It would be possible to have a world in which facts were much much less important, but not to "live" in such a world, because it would be unpopulated.
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by khallow on Wednesday January 25 2017, @08:54PM
He apparently is unaware that you can only cull that which is live, and research is only live when it's being done.
You had no trouble understanding me. I doubt anyone else did either.
Can you please include some terminal "but I guess that's just the typical gibberish to be expected from you, khallow" in your responses, so that those of us who have him foed down by -5 don't feel tempted to pull up your post's parent in case it might have some useful content.
Let us recall why FatPhil is so butthurt here. He "foed" me as a result of this thread [soylentnews.org]. At one point, I pulled out my usual retort to chicken littles who insist the sky is falling economically.
I'll just note here that global income [voxeu.org] is increasing above inflation at a substantial rate (two thirds of humanity grew their income by 30% or more over a recent 20 year period, the median global income rose by more than 60%). The world is nothing like your narrative.
After a back and forth, we had this insightful reply:
Thus spake someone with absolutely no understanding of Simpson's Paradox.
"Simpson's paradox" is just a fancy label for the observation that what happens to a whole can be very different than what happens to parts of the whole. FatPhil from now on stone-walls, refusing to explain that even a little while I pointed out that we were speaking of everyone all along and my above link was an observation about everyone.
You're looking at aggregate data rather than the individual components. *Textbook* Simpsons.
I've shown you your mistake several times, please stop digging.
and finally
NO, BECAUSE OF SIMPSON'S PARADOX.
I SAID YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND IT RIGHT AT THE OUTSET, DIDN'T I, AND YOU'VE PROVED THAT BEYOND ANY SHADOW OF A DOUBT.
YOU ARE STUPID, AND YOU REFUSE TO LEARN.
*PLONK*
He officially surrendered at this point and "foed" me. I hope this dose of internet drama makes your day.
Now, he's complaining because I might have posted something interesting? Not my problem. SoylentNews provides us with the tools [soylentnews.org] to avoid reading posts from me. Use the tools.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Wednesday January 25 2017, @08:11PM
And from my undergraduate college, 30 years ago, I've hopped around a bunch of universities and colleges over the years. Most have undertaken some sort of reduction of their library collections (particularly of expensive research journals) due to spiraling costs.
The point here is that a lot of institutions, including government institutions, have been cutting back on their libraries for a long time. Just because libraries are being cut back in Canada doesn't mean that it's an intentional effort to destroy politically inconvenient research. Note the following from the "What's Driving Chaotic Dismantling of Canada's Science Libraries?":
Many collections such as the Maurice Lamontagne Institute Library in Mont-Joli, Quebec ended up in dumpsters while others such as Winnipeg's historic Freshwater Institute library were scavenged by citizens, scientists and local environmental consultants. Others were burned or went to landfills, say scientists.
and
In a private email originally sent to a colleague and then shared with The Tyee, one scientist compared the dismemberment of the Freshwater Institute library last week to a rummage sale: "I did manage to salvage a few bits and pieces, one of which was a three volume print version of the data that went into the now extinct DFO toxins database."
The scientist suggested "that interested individuals should drop-in and loot [the] library before the bonfires begin."
My reason for the emphasis on these parts is that data was tossed not destroyed, and various parties had an opportunity to pick over what was discarded. If they were intending to destroy knowledge, I don't believe that would have happened, particularly since salvaging is likely to preserve some of the most inconvenient materials that were being tossed.
Instead, I think it's a fairly obvious thing. The Harper government was downsizing government, particularly, the parts that they don't value. These libraries were part of that.
(Score: 4, Informative) by aristarchus on Wednesday January 25 2017, @09:34AM
Um, Soylentils, isn't this where it is customary to say: "It's not censorship unless the government is doing it!" Oh, wait, it is the government? The Administration of tiny crowds, tiny hands, and tiny brains, it would seem. Post-factual "alternative science", here we go!
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 25 2017, @01:55PM
According to unnamed sources in the CIA, Kim Jong Un has a bigger penis than Donald Trump.
(Score: 2) by Alphatool on Wednesday January 25 2017, @12:01PM
Government suppression of science is a real problem throughout the world. It isn't a new phenomenon, it even happened under the Obama administration, for example when a Department of Energy researcher was fired for not following the party line [house.gov]. In that case it was politically useful for congress to intervene, it is truly chilling to think what might happen to scientists now that one party controls the house, the senate and the executive.
(Score: 3, Informative) by mcgrew on Wednesday January 25 2017, @02:40PM
People are noticing how Orwellian [washingtonpost.com] this administration is.
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Thexalon on Wednesday January 25 2017, @03:59PM
And finally somebody is using that word correctly.
What makes the Trump administration "Orwellian" is that it is very clear about using language to confuse rather than inform. George Orwell was most heavily interested in the science of spin doctoring before that was a formal idea, and there's little question that Trump and his organization are very good at it.
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 2) by linkdude64 on Thursday January 26 2017, @01:40AM
"George Orwell was most heavily interested in the science of spin doctoring before that was a formal idea, and there's little question that Trump and his organization are very good at it."
Well, at least we have a President whois good at something.
Remember Hillary Clinton's "Correct the Record"? That cost hundreds of millions of dollars to operate - she spent over a billion dollars in other people's money on a campaign that failed. Looking at those numbers alone and the final result of the election, it is clear who is the superior tactician in all things political AND financial. The only question is whether or not Trump actually cares about America.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Thursday January 26 2017, @10:02PM
I've seen no evidence that he cares about nothing but wealth and power. The ultimate plutocrat for our plutocracy.
It was never a democracy or Bush and Trump would not have been President. Since it's now legal to buy politicians, it isn't even a real republic any more.
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 2, Disagree) by linkdude64 on Friday January 27 2017, @09:53PM
"I've seen no evidence that he cares about nothing but wealth and power. "
The cognitive dissonance you must be experiencing regarding his executive order that killed the TPP must be truly daunting.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Saturday January 28 2017, @02:27PM
I said I've seen no indication of patriotism from him. Show me some if you've seen it.
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 2) by linkdude64 on Saturday January 28 2017, @05:24PM
"I said I've seen no indication of patriotism from him. "
You are intellectually dishonest; A severe insult, if you are a person who considers themselves informed.
"From this day forward, it's America First" - proceeds to sign executive order preventing TPP's passage. Though you may be one of the Bernie supporters who suddenly changed their position on TPP, vowing to disagree with Trump on every subject whether it is what is good for American workers, or what color the sky is.
"We will no longer surrender our people's jobs and security for other countries" - proceeds to begin negotiations with Mexico's government - a country that has long taken advantage of US gullibility.
Sure, TPP would have been charitable to other countries - giving them slave-wage jobs, but jobs nonetheless. Sure, planned parenthood and like international organizations do good work. Is cutting their American Federal funding a little cold-hearted? Sure, let's say it is. Here's the real question: Is that cost-savings beneficial to the United States of America? Absolutely. He is being true to his word, when he said he would put America first.
If you had a mother who took away your food and gave it to other people's children, especially those living in a foreign country, and let you go hungry, that would not be an example of a family-oriented mother who put her children first.
Likewise, having a President and Congress who throw our money away to complete strangers, and let people in the very country who pay their salaries go hungry, that would not be an example of a patriotic politician.
If you would like to make the argument that prioritizing the financial, political, and societal stability of your country is un-patriotic, I would like to hear that argument - and please, do make sure it is actually an argument.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Sunday January 29 2017, @06:52PM
Almost all of the things on your list benefit him and his family far more than the country. Saying we need to make America great again is not the words of a patriot, it's the words of someone who thinks they live in a shit country.
Patriots don't insult war heros who now serve the Senate, nor do they insult gold star parents. Especially when they weren't patriotic enough to serve their country ever in his seven decades. He claims a high draft number, mine was the highest. He claims he was going to college. So was I when I enlisted in the USAF. He claimed medical problems, I declined an invitation to a medical discharge after two years and finished my hitch before going back to school.
Show me ONE thing Trump ever did for our country before running for President, and I will agree that he's a patriot.
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 2) by linkdude64 on Sunday January 29 2017, @09:32PM
"Show me ONE thing Trump ever did for our country before running for President, and I will agree that he's a patriot."
Create jobs? Bring money into the country? I'm assuming you will disqualify those, because "he also benefits," but then let me ask you - did you accept payment for your service in the USAF?
I just want to ensure that this discussion will remain somewhat objective and unhindered by double-standards or other such fallacies.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Wednesday February 01 2017, @08:28PM
"Create jobs?"
He didn't create jobs out of a sense of patriotism, he needed the workers' help to enrich himself. No one hires people out of the goodness of their hearts or because it's good for the country.
If he were patriotic, his goods wouldn't have all been produced overseas. Same goes for his unpatriotic daughter, who still has her junk made in Asia.
Bring money into the country? No, he didn't. A rich man who was truly a patriot certainly would.
"did you accept payment for your service in the USAF?"
Yes, far less than a comparable civilian job would pay, and forfeited all freedom for four years. But I'm not claiming I'm a great patriot, just that Trump is far less patriotic. A real patriot is someone like Senator McCain, I have a lot of respect for that man. Now THAT'S a patriot.
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 2) by linkdude64 on Thursday February 02 2017, @03:28PM
"He didn't create jobs out of a sense of patriotism"
I will now consider the goal-post moved! Now it is not "Did Trump do something for America?" it's "Did he do something for America - under my personally specific definition of patriotism?"
Am I not a patriot because I've never done something within the military? What if I said I spent dozens of hours last year at Habitat for Humanity Veterans' Housing construction projects, digging trenches and pouring concrete?
Is what Trump is going to do for the military and the VA not Patriotism? Is giving them a General to lead not the greatest gift he could give the Military - A true Leader? Rather than a defense industry consultant as Shillary would have done?
Do you find, "Buy American, Hire American" an Anti-Patriotic, triggering, and "problematic" sentiment to promote? What about, "America First?" Does a wave of guilt and political correctness wash over you when you hear people chanting, "USA! USA!"?
McCain is a flamin' RINO. He is 110% a part of the establishment that would sacrifice this country's young men and women in exchange for campaign donations and politicking. He is a very eager cog in that terrible machine which has utterly abused veterans and this country's people time and time again.
Trump is a true Leader - love him or hate him - and he is turning this country in a very different direction for better or for worse. His stated aim is one that seeks to help our vets and our own people before we blow up buildings and rebuild them in other countries - fighting wars, funding both sides of conflicts, all to satisfy some Oil Baron. McCain may be a vet, but only Trump had the *balls* to stand up to the establishment during his campaign, where McCain fully supplicated himself. Patriot or not, I will respect personal competence and strength where I see it.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Saturday February 04 2017, @05:56PM
"What if I said I spent dozens of hours last year at Habitat for Humanity Veterans' Housing construction projects, digging trenches and pouring concrete?"
Then you are a patriot. Has trump done that? No, he hasn't.
"Is what Trump is going to do for the military and the VA not Patriotism?"
I don't believe he'll do it. If he does, I'll change my mind.
"Do you find, "Buy American, Hire American" an Anti-Patriotic?"
Saying it isn't. Doing it is. Note that Trump had all his goods manufactured overseas, and his family still does.
"What about, 'America First?' "
Ever hear what happened to America in 1928? It was caused in large part by protectionism, "America First". America has always done better when cooperating and always done worse when warring, whether a trade war or a shooting war.
"McCain is a flamin' RINO. He is 110% a part of the establishment that would sacrifice this country's young men and women in exchange for campaign donations and politicking."
I don;t believe that. Also, now someone's a RINO if he isn't a wingnut?
"Trump is a true Leader."
Trump is a true LIAR. Leaders don't throw their workers under the bus to make money for his greedy self.
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 2) by linkdude64 on Sunday February 05 2017, @08:08PM
"Has trump done that? No, he hasn't."
Has the goal post been moved again? I haven't done anything for "America" either - I was just helping American veterans, i.e., American citizens. Trump has *also* helped American Citizens by increasing international demand for his products and taking money from other countries, bringing it into the United States. I would hope you are not so blinded by your bias that you will not forgo basic economic theory.
"If he does, I'll change my mind."
That is fair. He has already signed an executive action regarding this, but we will see if that also gets blocked by Democrats.
"Note that Trump had all his goods manufactured overseas, and his family still does."
"Trump Tower was built overseas" is literally what you sound like right now. That is how separated from reality your MSM-fed brain-diet has taken you. Trump is a *real estate tycoon.* When he takes an apartment, hires people in this country to rebuild it, and sells it for $20 mil to a Japanese client, that is taking $20 mil out of Japan and into the pockets of Americans.
"I don;t believe that."
Dunno if you are aware of who George Soros is, but he has donated to McCain's campaigns repeatedly. A small donation from only one of his Fund Management groups in 2016 (along with bigger donations to Paul Ryan)
https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/recips.php?id=D000000306&type=P&state=&sort=A&cycle=2016 [opensecrets.org]
but about $300,000 to groups that were defending McCain's finance law back in 2002,
https://investmentwatchblog.com/report-john-mccain-paul-ryan-funded-by-george-soros/ [investmentwatchblog.com]
One thing Ryan, McCain, and Rubio have in common? They're anti-Trump. What is Soros' endgame? A "world without borders."
"Leaders don't throw their workers under the bus to make money for his greedy self."
How many people do you think Eisenhower was responsible for the deaths of? Was he not a leader? Think before you opine. This is not a world where everyone will always win, and will always be happy, and will always share, and will always be perfect. You probably wear clothes and use gadgets that were made by slaves - do you REALLY care? Here's a hint: No, you fucking don't, because you still get your end result - cheap bullshit, and a better life for you and the people around you, that you care about. That is what Trump wants to do for America - what he has done for himself. Welcome to Planet Earth: A ceaselessly violent ball of rock where competition for limited resources is a reality.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Monday February 06 2017, @03:36PM
Trump has *also* helped American Citizens by increasing international demand for his products
All of which he had made OVERSEAS. That is NOT patriotism, and it did NOT help America. Oh, you're talking about hotels and casinos? No, those were for his own enrichment, or he wouldn't have stiffed his workers--his fellow Americans.
I'm not reading any farther, you've obviously swallowed the fraudster's kool-aid.
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(Score: 2) by linkdude64 on Wednesday February 08 2017, @04:59PM
"All of which he had made OVERSEAS. "
You believe that Trump Tower, who has sold apartments for MILLIONS of dollars - bringing that money into the US for further construction projects - is increasing FOREIGN economic strength?!
You are out of your gourd.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Friday February 10 2017, @02:31AM
Building materials imported. Clothing, jewelry, all that other crap he sells is made overseas. Trump's hotels don't benefit ordinary Americans. Especially the ones in places like Dubai or Scotland.
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