Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments

SoylentNews is people

posted by on Wednesday March 08 2017, @02:46PM   Printer-friendly
from the freedom-to,-not-freedom-from dept.

Charles Murray, controversial author of The Bell Curve, which promoted links between intelligence and race, was shouted down by protesters at Middlebury College last Thursday. PBS reports:

Murray had been invited by Middlebury's student group affiliated with the American Enterprise Institute, a think tank at which Murray is a scholar. [...] Prior to the point when Murray was introduced, several Middlebury officials reminded students that they were allowed to protest but not to disrupt the talk. The students ignored those reminders and faced no visible consequences for doing so. [...]

After the students chanted for about 20 minutes, college officials announced that the lecture would not take place but that Murray would go to another location, which the college didn't name, and have a discussion with a Middlebury faculty member — livestreamed back to the original lecture site.

According to Middlebury officials, after Murray and the professor who interviewed him for the livestream attempted to leave the location in a car, some protesters surrounded the car, jumped on it, pounded on it and tried to prevent the car from leaving campus.

Other sources note that political science professor Allison Stanger, who agreed to moderate the discussion, was attacked while accompanying Murray to the car, ultimately requiring treatment at a hospital for neck injuries caused by protesters pushing her and pulling her hair.

Murray himself later gave an account of his experience on the AEI blog. He emphasized that Middlebury's administration and staff displayed in exemplary ways their encouragement of free speech:

Middlebury's stance has been exemplary. The administration agreed to host the event. President Patton did not cancel it even after a major protest became inevitable. She appeared at the event, further signaling Middlebury's commitment to academic freedom. The administration arranged an ingenious Plan B that enabled me to present my ideas and discuss them with Professor Stanger even though the crowd had prevented me from speaking in the lecture hall. I wish that every college in the country had the backbone and determination that Middlebury exhibited.

But Murray notes that the outcome was very different from his previous controversial appearances:

Until last Thursday, all of the ones involving me have been as carefully scripted as kabuki: The college administration meets with the organizers of the protest and ground rules are agreed upon. The protesters have so many minutes to do such and such. It is agreed that after the allotted time, they will leave or desist. These negotiated agreements have always worked. At least a couple of dozen times, I have been able to give my lecture to an attentive (or at least quiet) audience despite an organized protest.

Middlebury tried to negotiate such an agreement with the protesters, but, for the first time in my experience, the protesters would not accept any time limits. [...] In the mid-1990s, I could count on students who had wanted to listen to start yelling at the protesters after a certain point, "Sit down and shut up, we want to hear what he has to say." That kind of pushback had an effect. It reminded the protesters that they were a minority. I am assured by people at Middlebury that their protesters are a minority as well. But they are a minority that has intimidated the majority. The people in the audience who wanted to hear me speak were completely cowed.

The form of the protest has been widely condemned even by those who vehemently disagree with Murray, as in the piece by Peter Beinart in The Atlantic that claims "something has gone badly wrong on the campus left." He argues strongly that "Liberals must defend the right of conservative students to invite speakers of their choice, even if they find their views abhorrent."

Meanwhile, student protesters have responded with their own account, disclaiming the hair-pulling incident as unintentional and "irresponsible" but condemning the Middlebury administration for their "support of a platform for white nationalist speech." They further claimed "peaceful protest was met with escalating levels of violence by the administration and Public Safety, who continually asserted their support of a dangerous racist over the well-being of students."

Personal note: My take on all of this is that the actual subject of Murray's Middlebury talk has been lost in the media coverage, namely his 2012 book Coming Apart, which (ironically) is a detailed discussion of the problems created by a division of the intellectual elite from the white working class. He explicitly dilutes his previous connections of social problems with a black underclass by noting that many of the same issues plague poor white communities. While his argument is still based on problematic assertions about intelligence and IQ, the topic of his book seems very relevant given recent political events and issues of class division. There's some sort of profound irony in a bunch of students at an elite school refusing to allow a debate on the causes and results of division between elite intellectuals and the (white) working class. I personally may think Murray's scholarship is shoddy and his use of statistics frequently misleading (or downright wrong), but I don't see how that justifies the kind of threats and intimidation tactics shown at this protest.


Original Submission

 
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Display Options Threshold/Breakthrough Mark All as Read Mark All as Unread
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
  • (Score: 1) by khallow on Wednesday March 08 2017, @07:39PM (13 children)

    by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday March 08 2017, @07:39PM (#476671) Journal
    edIII, I have taken great pains not to talk to you because you stepped over the line to threatening behavior [soylentnews.org]. Control your anger or you will continue to be someone unworthy of my time.
  • (Score: 0, Flamebait) by edIII on Wednesday March 08 2017, @08:17PM

    by edIII (791) on Wednesday March 08 2017, @08:17PM (#476687)

    I don't give a fuck what you find worthy or not. You are a corporate apologist that will deny any reality that doesn't conform with your particular idea of an ideal "society".

    When you want to claim authority over reality, I WILL speak up against you, you loathsome piece of shit.

    Again, as always, burn in hell mother fucker.

    --
    Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
  • (Score: 2) by aristarchus on Thursday March 09 2017, @02:41AM (9 children)

    by aristarchus (2645) on Thursday March 09 2017, @02:41AM (#476833) Journal

    Control your anger or you will continue to be someone unworthy of my time.

    Wow, khallow has been pushed to threatening behavior!!! Please, khallow, do your worst to me first, before you do it to edIII! Please?

    (Of course, it might be more effective to take edIII's advice, and quit being such an apologist for racist rich people. )

    • (Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday March 09 2017, @04:51AM (8 children)

      by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Thursday March 09 2017, @04:51AM (#476871) Journal
      It's none of your business, aristarchus.
      • (Score: 3, Touché) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday March 09 2017, @05:00AM (7 children)

        by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Thursday March 09 2017, @05:00AM (#476877) Journal

        Hey, count me in too, Mr. Hallow :D Maybe if you get enough people giving you shit you'll stop and ask yourself why at some point ...or maybe not, but I always was an idealist.

        --
        I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
        • (Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday March 09 2017, @06:31AM (6 children)

          by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Thursday March 09 2017, @06:31AM (#476894) Journal
          On the other hand, notice that all I did here was comment on a little veiled racism and then get dogpiled for something completely irrelevant to that. Let's keep in mind that the AC's original comment was:

          Furthermore, there is a huge link between intelligence and productivity in society; the lower the intelligence, the worse the productivity—and at a certain threshold across a population, society starts to break down.

          I then replied to that last comment (which slid in a big assertion more than just "links").

          Just like there's a huge link between bald assertions and reality?

          How much you want to bet that the original AC's idea of societies that break down due to "lower intelligence" are societies that have come to have a high ratio of poor blacks in them? Such as Detroit transitioning from 1950 to present, Zimbabwe after Rhodesia fell, etc.

          Was my supposed corporate leanings at all relevant?

          • (Score: 3, Insightful) by aristarchus on Friday March 10 2017, @12:37AM

            by aristarchus (2645) on Friday March 10 2017, @12:37AM (#477203) Journal

            Dogpile on the khallow! Dogpile on the khallow! So sad.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 10 2017, @08:33AM (4 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 10 2017, @08:33AM (#477296)

            You know, it is not so much what Prof. Murray was going to say, as what he did say in the past. That is enough to justifying shutting him down. Likewise, our own khallow says something, and gets hammered, not so much for the content of this particular post, but for what he has said in the past. And he cannot comprehend this? Are all right-wing pretend-intellectuals so utterly clueless? (Don't bother answering, it was meant to be a rhetorical question.)

            • (Score: 1) by khallow on Friday March 10 2017, @03:16PM (3 children)

              by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday March 10 2017, @03:16PM (#477366) Journal

              You know, it is not so much what Prof. Murray was going to say, as what he did say in the past. That is enough to justifying shutting him down.

              Let me introduce you to the ad hominem fallacy [wikipedia.org]. What I find particularly weird about this is how much bleating there has been here without a thing being said. The universal lack of content of the criticisms is bizarre. You have as usual given me zero feedback by which I could correct anything, even if there were a legitimate problem.

              I think we all realize that I'm not going to change my beliefs and opinions merely at the drop of the hat. But it is remarkable how little effort ever goes into trying to persuade me of anything. I think there's a simple explanation here. You are a fucking idiot who couldn't argue their way out of a wet paper bag. These silly games are the best you can do.

              L2P noob.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 11 2017, @08:58AM (2 children)

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 11 2017, @08:58AM (#477693)

                Khallow, you answered a rhetorical question, and you got it wrong! What else could you be wrong about? I have seen Soylentils expend prodigious effort in trying to educate you, going on for days, and it all had absolutely no effect on you. And now you are amazed that no one tries anymore, except aristarchus, who seems to think you might be corrigible? Game over, man!

                • (Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday March 11 2017, @01:00PM (1 child)

                  by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Saturday March 11 2017, @01:00PM (#477732) Journal

                  I have seen Soylentils expend prodigious effort in trying to educate you, going on for days, and it all had absolutely no effect on you.

                  Let's see these alleged efforts then. Just link them.

                  Or will you continue to make empty assertions? I note, for example, that when I complained about certain peoples' dishonesty or abusive behaviors, I linked to their [soylentnews.org] problems [soylentnews.org]. I didn't merely assert something to harass someone in some sort of school yard bullying.

                  Will we have an actual rational conversation? Or will this be days and days of innuendo and false accusations?

                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 14 2017, @10:57PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 14 2017, @10:57PM (#479187)

                    Will we have an actual rational conversation? Or will this be days and days of innuendo and false accusations?

                    You reap what you sow, dude. You reap what you sow.

  • (Score: 1) by AssCork on Thursday March 09 2017, @03:17PM (1 child)

    by AssCork (6255) on Thursday March 09 2017, @03:17PM (#476967) Journal

    I got next. Lemme know who wins.
    /me flexes his namesake

    --
    Just popped-out of a tight spot. Came out mostly clean, too.
    • (Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday March 09 2017, @05:05PM

      by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Thursday March 09 2017, @05:05PM (#477014) Journal
      Eh, if you really want, you can google to see the history of this drama. I definitely didn't win it.