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posted by on Friday April 21 2017, @10:26PM   Printer-friendly
from the weird-sure,-but-extremist? dept.

USA Today reports:

"Russia's Supreme Court formally banned Jehovah's Witnesses as an extremist organization Thursday and ordered the state to seize its property in Russia, according to Russian news media."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/04/20/russian-court-bans-jehovahs-witnesses-extremist-group/100701524/


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  • (Score: 5, Informative) by julian on Friday April 21 2017, @10:35PM (45 children)

    by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 21 2017, @10:35PM (#497633)

    They are an abusive cult that practices psychological and emotional child abuse [patheos.com]. Almost all religions do, to some extent, but this one seems egregious enough to be worth doing something about it.

    But if you just want them to stop ringing your doorbell, you can tell them you *used* to be a JW, but got "disfellowshipped". They're not allowed to talk to people who have been kicked out of the cult--that's one of the things that defines a cult.

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  • (Score: 5, Informative) by deadstick on Friday April 21 2017, @10:56PM (1 child)

    by deadstick (5110) on Friday April 21 2017, @10:56PM (#497642)

    Cult: A small, unpopular religion.

    Religion: A large, popular cult.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @06:15AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @06:15AM (#497818)

      Exactly!

  • (Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 21 2017, @11:12PM (37 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 21 2017, @11:12PM (#497648)

    If you leave the faith, they aren't supposed to speak to you. (same with Scientology) Muslims are supposed to kill you.

    They don't seem to sexually mutilate their children.

    If you are not in the faith, they are supposed to preach to you. (annoyingly, same as the Mormons do) Muslims are supposed to kill you.

    • (Score: 4, Informative) by julian on Friday April 21 2017, @11:25PM (36 children)

      by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 21 2017, @11:25PM (#497651)

      I dunno man, Christians are supposed to kill you for all sorts of reasons. But I've never been stoned for working on the Sabbath.

      And no Muslim has ever rung my doorbell during dinner.

      • (Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:07AM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:07AM (#497710)

        But I've never been stoned for working on the Sabbath.

        I've been stoned while working on the Sabbath ... and just about every other day, too.

        • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:17AM

          by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:17AM (#497736) Journal

          I've been stoned while working on the Sabbath ... and just about every other day, too.

          You may try working on the Black one too.

          (leaves singing "...son, son you've gone too far,/'Cause smokin' an...")

          --
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:15AM (33 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:15AM (#497716)

        Um, you obviously know nothing about Christianity. When asked how many times one should forgive his neighbor, Christ said 70 times 7 times per day. Christ was the one who coined the phrase "let he who is without sin cast the first stone." All that death sentence stuff was from the old testament law. Christ brought grace which to you means forgiveness and loving your enemies. Christians strive for perfection while all the while knowing they can never be perfect. We pray that we are forgiven as we forgive others, knowing that we will be judged as we judge. No one is perfect and every organization has bad actors, but the true leader of the church is our risen saviour. The antics of us imperfect followers often must be forgive.

        • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:20AM (15 children)

          by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:20AM (#497720) Journal

          Sure, and then if you don't kiss his ass he forgives you zero times seventy times and tortures you for eternity. Nice try.

          --
          I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:23AM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:23AM (#497741)

            Your choice.

            • (Score: 1, Flamebait) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday April 22 2017, @04:25AM (1 child)

              by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday April 22 2017, @04:25AM (#497781) Journal

              Having been dead, and dating a woman who has also been dead and remembers between lives...no. Fuck you. You can go to Hell, as she did, and you can stay there a shitload longer than she did. Fuck you, fuck your demonic God-concept, fuck your devil-worshiping religion, and if I didn't say "fuck you" yet, fuck you. The early church fathers were Universalists, you theologically-illiterate moron. Latin doesn't know how to parse Koine's distinctions between aionios and aidios.

              --
              I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:42PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:42PM (#497922)

                Don't mind the hypocrites, they were brainwashed from birth and are just happy to be part of a community. So they follow the little rules everyone e talks about, pretend their virtuous, and pay zero attention to facts and care nothing about their own hypocrisy. Letting them upset you is like letting a 5 year old get to you, sure its annoying but just detach and view them from a more mature viewpoint and pity them. Smile and nod, encourage the good stuff. "Yes forgiveness is a very important thing, so forgive those poor terrorists misled to do such bad things!" Oh wait, that is child-like humor to make them see their hypocrisy, damnit I was so close!

          • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:37AM (11 children)

            by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:37AM (#497750) Journal

            Heh - for once we see things similarly. You get one chance at life. You get twenty, maybe thirty, possibly 60, if you're REALLY LUCKY, you might get 100 years to get life "right". And, if you don't manage to do it right that one time around, you get to burn in fire for eternity?

            Yeah, that is pretty fucked up.

            The Hindus have a more appealing system. If you really suck ass at life, you get to come back as a cockroach or something. If you do things almost perfectly throughout your life, then you're rewarded by becoming a king or emperor in your next life. Karma isn't a bad system. In effect, you punish yourself for being a complete ass.

            But, what am I saying? Next, I'll be touting the benefits of communism!

            Whatever - if there really is an afterlife, I think it's going to shock the shit out of most dogmatic people.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @03:20AM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @03:20AM (#497771)

              Quantum effects seem like the best chance for eternal life:
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_suicide_and_immortality [wikipedia.org]

            • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday April 22 2017, @04:22AM (5 children)

              by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday April 22 2017, @04:22AM (#497780) Journal

              Actually in the Dharmic religions, if you "really fuck up" you spend several quadrillion times the age of the known universe being roasted in a huge metal oven under the earth; look up "Avici" sometime. Hinduism and Buddhism love them some torture porn.

              --
              I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
              • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:36PM (2 children)

                by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:36PM (#497917) Journal

                That's why I liked Dante so much. You might get yourself sent to hell, but even then, there was possible redemption.

                • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:48PM (1 child)

                  by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:48PM (#497924) Journal

                  Hell does not work that way. It's a state, not a place, and it seems to be tied about 1:1 with the pain you caused others, minus the good you did, though that good can only be applied to things you've been well and truly forgiven for by the ones you harmed. And if what my girlfriend says is any indication, even after your actual torture is over, if you haven't forgiven yourself, you're not getting out of that mode of existence.

                  --
                  I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
              • (Score: 2) by driverless on Monday April 24 2017, @10:10AM (1 child)

                by driverless (4770) on Monday April 24 2017, @10:10AM (#498754)

                That's not quite how it works, you end up being reborn in avici until you've burned up your bad karma, then it's back onto the usual cycle. The length of each period in avici varies depending on interpretation, but about 1K years is a common figure. Apparently your occupation for the duration of your stay is something involving an old 486 laptop and a copy of systemd.

                • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Monday April 24 2017, @05:33PM

                  by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Monday April 24 2017, @05:33PM (#498953) Journal

                  I swear I'd heard something like 10^17 years, which is utterly ridiculous and unjust, but I can definitely accept something like 10^3 to 10^4 for someone like Adolf Hitler.

                  --
                  I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
            • (Score: 2) by dry on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:32AM (3 children)

              by dry (223) on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:32AM (#497800) Journal

              Most Christians forget about the only person who was promised heaven was a criminal getting crucified beside Christ.

              • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:32PM (2 children)

                by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:32PM (#497915) Journal

                So - you're going to make a case that we should all be criminals, so that we too can have a chance at paradise? Nahh - ignore that, I'm just being a smart ass.

                But, you certainly can't be doing anything terribly wrong is you're only sending a saved man home to be with his Father in Heaven, can you?

                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:32PM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:32PM (#497984)

                  > you certainly can't be doing anything terribly wrong is you're only sending a saved man home to be with his Father in Heaven, can you?

                  Look at that, derpaway is now justifying murder as being the christian thing to do.
                  Is anyone here actually surprised? Anyone? Bueller?

                • (Score: 2) by dry on Monday April 24 2017, @02:06AM

                  by dry (223) on Monday April 24 2017, @02:06AM (#498620) Journal

                  Well being a criminal does not mean being a bad person, think of the people prosecuted and convicted of helping slaves escape. Recently read about the first woman to be hung in on of the colonies of New England, her crime was preaching Quakerism.
                  The law only aligns with morals some of the time and other times it is at odds with morals.
                  And they were killing the man who became saved before he was saved.

        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by julian on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:21AM (1 child)

          by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:21AM (#497721)

          The Bible is a sprawling, hacked together, sparsly edited, iteratively translated, incomplete, multi-author, self-contradictory, work of fiction that can be used to justify almost any position you want to take.

          But I'm happy you've taken the pacificsm and tolerance message from the Bible. Many Christians don't. And there's no way to adjudicate who is "correct" because it's all absolute nonsense.

          • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:16PM

            by DeathMonkey (1380) on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:16PM (#497975) Journal

            It's kind of like a textual Rorschach test.

            The old testament is suddenly applicable when it comes to the gays.

        • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:50AM (6 children)

          by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:50AM (#497729) Journal

          Wait - who threw that "per day" in there? Did you do that, or do you read a version of the Bible with it in there?

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @03:52AM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @03:52AM (#497776)

            Awwww! Isn't that cute?
            Derpaway is trying to lawyer out the part of Christ's teaching that says to forgive.
            Face it dipshit, you are an old-testament asshole through and through who only claims to be a christian but has no interest in behaving like a christian.

            • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:21PM (1 child)

              by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:21PM (#497912) Journal

              God, you're a dumbass. I'm the one who told you that I'm an asshole. I'm the asocial asshole, remember? Old Testament asshole? Nope - not even close. I've never slaughtered a lamb, or a gay, or my own son, or even a bull on an altar as sacrifice to God. Just how stupid can you possibly be?

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:35PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:35PM (#497988)

                > God, you're a dumbass. I'm the one who told you that I'm an asshole.

                And you don't just talk the talk, you walk the walk too. We see it here every day.

                > Just how stupid can you possibly be?

                I don't know. Your level of delusional stupidity is beyond measure.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:46AM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:46AM (#497807)

            Well, it's Saturday in my timezone now, the 7th day and day of rest, so let's get to know Jesus a little better. Personally, my friends and I believe that Jesus was a buddha who had reached enlightenment and tried his best to explain the dharma to a bunch of sand n... a bunch of filthy Je... to people who were without the dharma. I see I have many more incarnations to go and much work to be done. Until then!

            Matthew 18:21–22 MSG (my preferred translation):

            At that point Peter got up the nerve to ask, “Master, how many times do I forgive a brother or sister who hurts me? Seven?”

            Jesus replied, “Seven! Hardly. Try seventy times seven….”

            Matthew 18:21–22 MSG (if you prefer):

            Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother or sister who sins against me? Up to seven times?”

            Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times….”

            Let us hear the Message that he meant by that, where he goes on to say:

            “The kingdom of God is like a king who decided to square accounts with his servants. As he got under way, one servant was brought before him who had run up a debt of a hundred thousand dollars. He couldn’t pay up, so the king ordered the man, along with his wife, children, and goods, to be auctioned off at the slave market.

            “The poor wretch threw himself at the king’s feet and begged, ‘Give me a chance and I’ll pay it all back.’ Touched by his plea, the king let him off, erasing the debt.

            “The servant was no sooner out of the room when he came upon one of his fellow servants who owed him ten dollars. He seized him by the throat and demanded, ‘Pay up. Now!’

            “The poor wretch threw himself down and begged, ‘Give me a chance and I’ll pay it all back.’ But he wouldn’t do it. He had him arrested and put in jail until the debt was paid. When the other servants saw this going on, they were outraged and brought a detailed report to the king.

            “The king summoned the man and said, ‘You evil servant! I forgave your entire debt when you begged me for mercy. Shouldn’t you be compelled to be merciful to your fellow servant who asked for mercy?’ The king was furious and put the screws to the man until he paid back his entire debt. And that’s exactly what my Father in heaven is going to do to each one of you who doesn’t forgive unconditionally anyone who asks for mercy.”

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:51AM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:51AM (#497809)

              Of course I forget to quote KVJ, which is likely the source of the misapprehension.

              Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?

              Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

              If we were to attempt to be lawyers about the dharma, we might be under the impression that the brother or neighbor sins against him daily, and that the deal is up after only seven days.

              Lawyers will never find the dharma. They'll need to reincarnate and try again.

            • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:38PM

              by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:38PM (#497918) Journal

              Excellent job on that parable. You done great!

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:34AM (5 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:34AM (#497801)

          Oddly, Moslems also worship this Jesus guy.

          Personally I think Mohammed is perfectly in line with the Old Testament.

          I'm still scratching my head wondering how the heck Jesus fits into the Abrahamic religions. He seems more like a buddha.

          Most Christians are not followers of Jesus. I'm not sure why they don't just admit that they like Mohammed better.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @06:07AM (3 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @06:07AM (#497815)

            Personally I think Mohammed is perfectly in line with the Old Testament.

            You may want to educate yourself. Here is a good first step. [prophetofdoom.net]

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @11:25AM (2 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @11:25AM (#497865)

              Going to that site to learn about islam is like reading a pamphlet on democracy written by Putin.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:55PM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:55PM (#497906)

                Judging a book by its cover, eh? Too bad you won't be able to point out any actual errors with the information presented from Prophet of Doom.

                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:49PM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:49PM (#497994)

                  Same reason I don't bother to try rebutting Putin's distortions about democracy.

          • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:27PM

            by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:27PM (#497913) Journal

            Uhhhhh - no. Muslims DO NOT worship Jesus. Christians believe that Jesus is the Son of God, and part of the entire Holy thing. Muslims believe that Jesus was just another prophet, and prophets are unworthy of worship. No Muslim worships Mohammed. They worship God, Allah, but they most certainly do not worship Mohammed.

            Go back and try again. Try reading the Quran.

        • (Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Saturday April 22 2017, @04:57PM (1 child)

          by PiMuNu (3823) on Saturday April 22 2017, @04:57PM (#497962)

          > All that death sentence stuff was from the old testament law.

          I never got how christians square the difference between old testament and new testament. I mean, the concept is that morality change in AD 0? Or that God changed her mind in AD 0? Or what?

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:46PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @05:46PM (#497992)

            It doesn't help that Jesus literally said that the old testament rules are still in force too:

                    “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19

                    “It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17)

                    “Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17)

                    “Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19)

  • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Ethanol-fueled on Friday April 21 2017, @11:27PM

    by Ethanol-fueled (2792) on Friday April 21 2017, @11:27PM (#497652) Homepage

    Yep, we had a few where I grew up, one of them was the drummer of the Metallica cover band I played in. We had to sneak practice times in when he knew his parents wouldn't find out (he had no drum set and learned to play at school, which was impressive since he could play Whiplash and One at full-speed). When the lead guitar player in our band won 4 tickets to a Metallica concert, our drummer asked his parents but was not allowed to go with us.

    They're very weird about music in that they're not allowed to listen to non-Jehovah's Witnesses music. You get one in a school choir and you see them having to step off the bandstand every now and then because it's against their religion, or something, to listen to or participate in unsanctioned music.

  • (Score: 2) by edIII on Saturday April 22 2017, @12:18AM (3 children)

    by edIII (791) on Saturday April 22 2017, @12:18AM (#497689)

    That may not have been a good idea in my case.

    Long time ago I was home in the afternoon lazily sitting on the couch watching TV after eating take out and smoking a joint. I had felt quite pleasant and relaxed, and had muted the commercials to stare at the ceiling. Was forgetting about the TV and becoming absorbed into the folds of plaster in the ceiling, when then the door bell rang.

    No way I was getting up to get it, and nobody I knew would be knocking on my door without calling me. The window that overlooks where they would have absolutely must gone through to enter and leave was within reach, and I peeked out. I was a teeny bit paranoid so it became a waiting game, but after about a minute I started to wonder just who would wait that quietly for that long without ringing again? The suspense built for at least another 5 minutes till it rang again. I ignored it and stood utterly transfixed by the walk way. Where the fuck is this person?

    It took another 5 minutes at least before I saw the biggest biker girls walking down the path away from me. One blonde girl with a punk hair cut and this black girl with a short fro, both dressed all in black leather, spiked boots, chains from their back pockets (I'm not kidding), and spikes on their shoulders.

    That was a bit of a surprise. Waited about a minute and then opened the door to go look around the corner and check them out. That's when the Jehovah's Witness letter fell on the ground. It could not have been there before, and nobody had come up the pathway in the meantime.

    Jehovah's Witness Biker Girls. You can't make that up, and I'm still not sure it happened.

    --
    Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
    • (Score: 1) by Farmer Tim on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:34AM

      by Farmer Tim (6490) on Saturday April 22 2017, @01:34AM (#497725)
      Maybe they were after wild sex and left the pamphlet because you didn't answer, thinking it might be appropriate.
      --
      Came for the news, stayed for the soap opera.
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:53PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @02:53PM (#497925)

      Well being stoned you were more susceptible to tapping into shared consciousness so you saw them as they wished they could be ;)

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @03:31PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @03:31PM (#497943)

      What was the joint laced with?