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CBS premiered its new Star Trek series "Discovery" on Sunday. The first episode was made available on OTA (over-the-air) CBS stations — but it and all subsequent episodes are available strictly on CBS's All Access streaming service. Cost is $6/month with ads, $10/month ad-free. (NOTE: The second episode was made available immediately after episode 1 aired. Episodes 3-7 will be released weekly, there will be a break, and then the remaining episodes will again be released weekly early in 2018.)
Ars Technica has a review that mostly praised the new show. (There were at least two technical inaccuracies in the review concerning the first episode.)
For those who may not yet have seen it, I kindly ask folks who comment on this story to make liberal use of the <spoiler>don't show this unless they click here</spoiler> tags.
What did you think? Was it entertaining? Did it hold closely [enough] to existing Star Trek canon? Was any 'ideology' change you saw sufficiently warranted?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @05:34PM (28 children)
I read a headline the other day that this new show is better embracing the purpose of Starfleet: diversity.
Well, that ain't the purpose of Starfleet, especially back in the day before Kirk; Star Trek: Enterprise did a pretty damn good job of showing Starfleet to be very human-centric orbganization, whose goal was to move Humanity out into space.
Even then, what did Starfleet turn into? It turned into a very libertarian organization based around voluntary association and meritocracy—diversity may occur, but it's neither sought nor forbidden. You had to work your way up, and could leave at any time (so long as nobody was put in immediate peril by that decision), and Starfleet was meant to stay the fuck out of the way of people who didn't want to associate.
And, who maintained the central role in the Federation? Humans. Why? Well, because the show is made for humans, but the larger view is that it's because Humans have a very strange and unique ability among the species of the galaxy to eschew collectivism in favor of a celebration of the individual, even at the expense of oneself.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @05:39PM (13 children)
So how did that Wezlee fellow end up in Star Fleet? How did Kneelix end up in Star Fleet? Are you saying they achieved their Star Fleet ranks based on merit?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @05:52PM (7 children)
With Netflix, I've been able to watch these series one-show-after-the-other in a single sitting, plowing through entire series. I recall seeing these characters work their way up, and thereby become respected members of the team. Neelix was a non-Starfleet member.
In the case of Wesley, he was ultimately treated as a very gifted individual; it's not surprising that his path was different from "normal" people.
With Neelix, he did indeed face a lot of prejudice, and had to prove himself by arduously learning things on his own, and taking on tasks that people didn't want to do.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @05:58PM (6 children)
Wrong! WRONG! WRONG!
"Captain Janeway bestows on Neelix the title of Official Starfleet Ambassador to the Delta Quadrant." [wikipedia.org]
He holds a higher rank than most of the crew on the Voyager ship. Starfleet Ambassadors reportedly have a rank that's considered equivalent to that of captains, and they can be ranked higher than captains at the discretion of the admiralty.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:01PM (5 children)
Holy selective quoting, Batman!
So he was given an honorary position RIGHT BEFORE he left.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:06PM (4 children)
Goddamn it, it's not an "honorary position"! Neelix is the Official Starfleet Ambassador to the Delta Quadrant! Show him some respect, damn it!
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:10PM (3 children)
Considering the nearest Starfleet presence to him is a couple decades away at warp speed, I might as well declare myself King of Proxima Centauri, for all the good it'll do.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:16PM (2 children)
What part of Official Starfleet Ambassador to the Delta Quadrant do you not understand?
(Score: 2, Touché) by tangomargarine on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:42PM
How it means anything
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @07:00PM
*sigh*
And what right does a Captain have to make an ambassador.
(Score: 3, Informative) by tangomargarine on Tuesday September 26 2017, @05:59PM (4 children)
Neelix was a special case, as they were stuck in the middle of nowhere and needed a guide. Also I don't think he was ever officially part of Starfleet, either. He was a cook, counselor, and ambassador of sorts.
Tom Paris was given a field commission in that show, too, and it sounded pretty doubtful he would've been given that second chance normally, as he was a felon.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by dry on Wednesday September 27 2017, @03:57AM (3 children)
Do you really think that they'll have feudal things like felons? Even in the 21st (and at least a good chunk of the 20th) only 2 countries still have felons.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Wednesday September 27 2017, @02:20PM (2 children)
What? I'm confused what you're talking about.
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Crime/Punishment/Maximum-length-of-sentence [nationmaster.com]
From that link it looks like only about a bazillion countries have prison sentences longer than a year for *some* crime.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by dry on Saturday September 30 2017, @02:56AM (1 child)
Sorry for not replying sooner.
I'm thinking more of the legal definition, basically a class of people who have their rights permanently, or close enough, curtailed. Not its use in culture, which is mostly American culture where it is used.
eg, being a felon in America means,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony [wikipedia.org]
In most of the free world, serving your sentence means that you are once again a regular citizen and most of those rights have to be removed by a Judge as part of sentencing rather then as a letter of attainment passed by the legislature. Here, restrictions on firearms, only happens if a Judge says, usually due to being stupid with a firearm. Put on a sex list, only if a Judge considers the crime deserving of it. Most of those others seem barbaric though deportation is pretty usual for non-citizens.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Monday October 02 2017, @02:56PM
Aha. Okay that makes more sense.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @05:47PM (3 children)
The same people who mock religion always find all sorts of "hidden meaning" in their favorite Hollywood-produced commercial fiction.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @05:58PM
Multiple interpretations are what define a classic.
One time, a pair of Jehovah's Witnesses stopped by, and were telling me how amazing the Bible is, how the stories are so good that they could be Hollywood movies.
I said: "Yeah. The Jews are known for being able to spin a good fiction."
There was a moment of understanding in their eyes.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:20PM
The same people who mock religion always find all sorts of "hidden meaning" in their favorite Hollywood-produced commercial fiction.
Thinking a human writer might be implying something with his words is a pretty reasonable hypothesis.
Thinking some text on planet earth wasn't written by a human at all is a pretty mock-worthy hypothesis.
(Score: 2) by Immerman on Tuesday September 26 2017, @07:07PM
There's "hidden meanings" in almost everything
- those things the author intentionally hid as "Easter eggs" for the attentive reader
- those things the author themselves didn't realize they were inserting (generally threads of their own assumptions and prejudices)
- and those things the reader inserts into their own interpretation (as reading is inherently a collaborative act)
Where mocking religion comes in is assuming that the work, and thus the hidden meanings, are the work of a divine being and thus reveal a higher truth. "Higher truths" in a fictional universe are fair game precisely because everyone recognizes that they are threads inserted by that universe's undisputed Creator(s). A lot of people take offense when you give the same treatment to holy texts.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:08PM (4 children)
Are there any transgender characters in this series? If not, why not?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:28PM (1 child)
As for transgenderism in particular, there were these shows:
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Tuesday September 26 2017, @07:03PM
"The Outcast" isn't about transgenderism; it's pretty clearly a thinly-veiled metaphor about homosexuality and conversion therapy.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by rts008 on Tuesday September 26 2017, @08:39PM
I don't have the answer you are looking for, but I imagine Dax would have an interesting answer, if asked. ;-)
(Score: 3, Interesting) by TheRaven on Wednesday September 27 2017, @10:29AM
sudo mod me up
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Grishnakh on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:15PM (3 children)
Well, that ain't the purpose of Starfleet, especially back in the day before Kirk; Star Trek: Enterprise did a pretty damn good job of showing Starfleet to be very human-centric orbganization, whose goal was to move Humanity out into space.
Wrong. Starfleet's purpose is to be the military and exploration arm of the United Federation of Planets. UFP is basically a confederation of sorts and deals with trade issues and diplomacy among its members; Starfleet deals with things that require starships: defense from outside threats (Klingons, Romulans), humanitarian missions (a bunch of ST episodes have something about transporting rescue supplies to some planet or assisting in an evacuation), transporting diplomats, establishing contact with new worlds, exploring the frontier, etc.
ST: Enterprise ("ENT") didn't show Starfleet: it took place before the UFP existed, and showed the creation of the UFP at the very end of the show. ENT was about a period of time where Earth, alone, was venturing much farther out into space than it had before, as up to that time they were basically just living under the protection of the Vulcans and doing some very limited trading with some very slow vessels. There was diversity, but it was only humans, except for the one Vulcan assigned to be their minder. So yes, the organization that the Enterprise in that show was part of explicitly had the purpose of moving humanity out into space, but that's different from the goals of the later UFP.
Even then, what did Starfleet turn into? It turned into a very libertarian organization based around voluntary association and meritocracy
And, who maintained the central role in the Federation? Humans. Why? Well, because the show is made for humans, but the larger view is that it's because Humans have a very strange and unique ability among the species of the galaxy to eschew collectivism in favor of a celebration of the individual, even at the expense of oneself.
You're projecting your own present-day ideals into a fictional show, started in the 1960s, about a future post-scarcity society. It shows humans in a central role because it's a TV show made for humans. To attempt to explain it, they basically claim that humans have a unique combination of both a sense of exploration, and an ability to forge alliances. Many ST episodes show other societies, many within the UFP, which simply have little interest in exploration, and of ones that do, they're depicted as being incompetent at making peaceful alliances (hence the Andorran/Tellarite/Vulcan warring in ENT). So we wind up with almost-all-human crews on starships, with a handful of aliens to play the diversity card. Some episodes (particularly TNG that I remember) make mentions of Starfleet ships with all-alien crews of some species, usually Vulcan, but these aren't shown or mentioned often, and for some reason seem to be a severe minority even though ENT shows Vulcans excelling both in shipbuilding and exploration before the UFP was started, though somehow also completely inept at establishing friendly diplomatic relations with their nearby neighbors the Tellarites and Andorrans, and needing the humans to do this for them. It has nothing to do with collectivism vs. individualism, and the Federation is very obviously an extremely socialistic organization. Notice also that in the Star Trek universe, the alien cultures are almost always completely homogeneous, with occasionally one minority culture (this was shown on ENT with the Andorrans in one episode), and that somehow Earth is unique in having dozens of different major cultures and languages. In short, take the show with a grain of salt. It's not an endorsement of libertarianism in any way; that's just ridiculous. The show is really a vehicle to explore social issues among humans. You could perhaps make a case about a post-scarcity society enabling a certain amount of libertarianism, but that'd be a long and involved discussion, which I'm sure many others have argued elsewhere.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:31PM (1 child)
They always could use more dilithium crystals. Always.
With more resources comes greater ambition.
(Score: 0, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:57PM
Ugh, you're an example of the WORST kind of nerd.
(Score: 2) by acid andy on Wednesday September 27 2017, @08:18PM
"Human rights. Why the very name is racist. The Federation is no more than a homo sapiens only club."
- Azetbur, at dinner
If a cat has kittens, does a rat have rittens, a bat bittens and a mat mittens?
(Score: 2) by jdavidb on Tuesday September 26 2017, @06:27PM
The Star Trek novel "The IDIC Epidemic" pretty much caused me to become a lifelong believer in diversity. It came out in 1988. I'm also a libertarian.
Basically people are biased to think that their tribe believes in freedom and others do not. State enemies in wartime are depicted as inhuman unfeeling beings who do crazy things like fight to the death.
ⓋⒶ☮✝🕊 Secession is the right of all sentient beings