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DirecTV is allowing at least some customers to cancel subscriptions to its Sunday Ticket package of NFL games and obtain refunds, if they cite players' national anthem protests as the reason for discontinuing service, customer service representatives said Tuesday.
Under Sunday Ticket's regular policy, refunds are not to be given once the season is underway. But the representatives said they are making exceptions this season -- which began in September -- because of the controversy over the protests, in which players kneel or link arms during the national anthem.
Spokesmen for DirecTV-parent AT&T Inc. (T) and the National Football League declined to comment.
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DirecTV Allows Some NFL Refunds After Anthem Controversy
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The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 29 2017, @03:26PM (26 children)
You confuse patriotism with nationalism.
(Score: 2) by mth on Friday September 29 2017, @03:44PM (25 children)
Nationalism is a subset of patriotism, isn't it?
(Score: 3, Interesting) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday September 29 2017, @03:48PM (21 children)
Only to people who irrationally hate their country in the same way teenagers hate their parents. Anyone else can see the difference between the two.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 5, Informative) by mth on Friday September 29 2017, @04:02PM (20 children)
Both start with "I love my country", but then nationalism adds "It's better than yours". So nationalism is like an extremist version of patriotism and while the distinction between the two is often clear, there isn't any hard line between them.
(Score: 2, Disagree) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday September 29 2017, @04:09PM (19 children)
It's really irrelevant. Neither is any worse a thing than loving your family more than you love random Joe on the street. Degree of separation has always mattered and should always matter to people in regards to empathy. Those down on either patriotism or nationalism really need to go back to school and learn how tribalism helps a species thrive.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by mth on Friday September 29 2017, @04:29PM (15 children)
There is a difference between not caring about Joe as much as about your family and arguing that Joe is objectively inferior because he's not family. The latter is what happens in nationalism.
To me, it seems tribalism is doing more harm than good for our species. In particular, a democracy cannot function if it includes multiple tribes and whoever is in power only cares about their own tribe. Maybe it was useful in an earlier stage of development, but even then I would think that tribalism would benefit a population (the tribe) and not necessarily a species as a whole.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday September 29 2017, @04:38PM (1 child)
Like I said then, you need to speak with an anthropology professor or six. I can see where you'd think that. Most globalists do. They're all objectively wrong though.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 29 2017, @05:32PM
And you're objectively stupid on a daily basis, sooo now its more of a chicken or egg problem. I love your little fanclub that upmods every single post you make. It is usually just a single upboop so either you made a shell account or someone really wants to jump yer bones :P
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Friday September 29 2017, @07:33PM (12 children)
I agree with you--tribalism impedes human progress. Nationalism is tribalism writ large.
It's still acceptable to hew to an ethos without blurring that into a tribalist or nationalist container. The ethos of America remains dear to my heart. Freedom, justice, and equality are motivating values for my life. Courage, grit, and self-reliance are virtues I strive for. I relish that our ancestors threw off the English monarchy and actively do pity Britons, Canadians, Australians, South Africans, New Zealanders who either failed to assert themselves as men, not subjects, or fell short of ending their association with that monarchy with an exclamation mark, an active rejection of royalty and its conceit that some humans are preternaturally more equal than others in the eyes of God. I mean, I love all of you aforementioned guys for every other reason, but I could never consider myself one of you for that reason.
So in all those things it can't be bad to treasure those things. It's when you come to value the container more highly than the content that you cross the line into bigotry and error. The universality of those values is radically diminished and reduced to a pale mockery of the same when you only accord them to people who belong to your tribe, and no one else. 'Freedom,' when only for Americans, is a word that a free man ought to spit out.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday September 30 2017, @03:45AM (10 children)
Support your claim with facts then, please. Keep in mind there are many thousands of years of evidence to the contrary though.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Saturday September 30 2017, @12:14PM (9 children)
I'm not sure what you mean. What part of what i wrote requires factual support, since it was almost entirely about my feelings about differentiating an ethos from a nationalist or tribalist label? Well, i do think those things and i wrote them, and that's a fact. Does that suffice?
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Sunday October 01 2017, @03:24PM (8 children)
That tribalism impedes human progress.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday October 02 2017, @12:34AM (7 children)
The continent of Africa?
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday October 02 2017, @01:53AM (6 children)
That's lack of resources not tribalism. Witness Egypt and the rest of the Nile valley.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday October 02 2017, @10:32AM (5 children)
You mean the continent rich with diamonds, gold, uranium ("yellow cake"), oil (Nigeria), ivory, cobalt, cocoa, palm oil, and all kinds of other valuable minerals is poor and backward because they don't have enough of those things? Those are the definition of "resources."
It is exactly the "beggar thy neighbor" mindset tribalism brings that defeats all their natural advantages.
It would not kill you to concede this point.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday October 02 2017, @10:45AM (4 children)
No, I mean resources useful to emerging societies. Potable water and edible food and the like.
Look, man, tribes working towards mutually exclusive goals at frequent, though not too frequent, intervals is precisely what put the west where it is today. Think of all the technological advances that have come of wars and competitive, international-scale capitalism over the years. "Necessity is the mother of invention" is a phrase you ignore at your own peril.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday October 02 2017, @11:04AM (3 children)
No, it's not. It was transcending tribalism that put the West on the path to where it is today, namely in the formation of the nation-state. Suddenly France stopped being a collection of tribes called Bretons, Burgundians, Provencals, and Parisians and became French. Likewise the Germans became that after having been Hessians and Prussians and Bavarians and what-have-you. Being able to work with people who aren't in your tribe is the hallmark of the First World. Being unable to surmount the narrow confines of tribe is what counfounds the Third World.
I know you're reaching for a justification of White supremacy, but the very fact that you can even conceive of "White" supremacy means you are transcending the second-order tribalism of "Briton," "German," "French," "Dutchman," etc. to gloss them into "White." But you're only re-creating a tertiary tribalism in so doing.
Civilization means pluralism, reaching across lines, and working together under an ethos of productivity, freedom, and acceptance.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday October 02 2017, @03:46PM (2 children)
You're shouting us down for the nation state and saying it's what got us here. At the same time? You confuse me, man.
Aaaand we're done here. You've just gone full on SJW. Have a parting clue though: most people who disagree with you are not racists; they're simply able to recognize that you're wrong.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday October 02 2017, @04:48PM (1 child)
I'm not some newcomer to these parts. We all know the cut of your jib. So spare us the kewpie eyes when I or anyone else calls it for what it is. It's fine by me, really, have your opinions on race, class, and relative superiority or inferiority, but don't get cute and pretend you don't have them.
You're throwing "SJW" at me because I ascribed your motives to a worldview that you often champion and you're mad because I know that and said it. You think that it therefore cancels what I said, but it doesn't. People who disagree with me are not all racist, by any stretch, but you are. I am not saying it in a pejorative way, but a factual one.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday October 02 2017, @10:04PM
I'm throwing SJW at you because you just played their favorite tactic. Someone beating you in an argument? Call them a racist/misogynist/transphobe/etc...
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by dry on Saturday September 30 2017, @03:59AM
Don't worry, I'm proud to be part of a country that has accepted American political refugees seeking freedom for hundreds of years.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 29 2017, @06:01PM
Open your eyes dummy. Human tribalism now needs to be on a planetary scale since that is how impactful human activity is. We all share the planet and subdivided nationalism is the cancer threatening to kill us off.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 29 2017, @06:53PM (1 child)
Actually, it is much, much worse. Fredo. Especially if your not white, but the family is.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday September 30 2017, @03:46AM
Did you know there are less than ten thousand Klan members left in the entire nation? Your cries of racism ring extremely hollow.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2, Informative) by unauthorized on Friday September 29 2017, @04:28PM
Much in the same way that cancer is a subset of living tissue.
(Score: 2) by NotSanguine on Friday September 29 2017, @06:32PM
--Ambrose Bierce
No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 30 2017, @01:52AM
Nationalism is "My country, right or wrong" Patriotism is "My country, right from wrong"