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A gunman fired upon thousands of people attending a music festival on the Las Vegas Strip Sunday night, in a brutal attack that is blamed for at least 58 deaths, police say. In the mass shooting and panic that ensued, 515 people were injured. At least one of the dead is an off-duty police officer who was attending the concert.
Editorializing: Interesting how media always emphasize ISLAMIC terrorists, but downplay domestic terrorism as psychologically disturbed individual lone-wolfs.
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Over 50 dead in mass shooting in Las Vegas
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Life is to you a dashing and bold adventure.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Gaaark on Monday October 02 2017, @05:42PM (20 children)
Guns don't kill people:
but how many could he have killed with only a plastic spoon?
If gun shops could only sell plastic spoons, would this 'mass killing' have been able to happen?
How about bananas: could he have killed anyone with a banana? (Not if i had a gun, he couldn't!)
:)
:(
You can almost Godwin-Monty-Python any subject, lol.
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2) by takyon on Monday October 02 2017, @05:56PM (16 children)
I wonder what frequency of mass shootings would lead to widespread gun control. 1 per week? 1 per day?
If it ever does happen, we will see an unreal level of stockpiling of weapons before the deadline(s).
While it's not plastic spoons, an impressive [wikipedia.org] amount [wikipedia.org] of killings can be done with knives.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 5, Insightful) by bob_super on Monday October 02 2017, @06:10PM (11 children)
273 mass shootings this year. About one per day. No reaction.
While you can kill a lot of people with knives, it's a hell of a lot harder, requires someone who's an order of magnitude more nuts and healthy, and you can't do it from the other side of the street.
Listen to the videos. I don't know if he was shooting full auto or just pulling the trigger really fast, but it's physically impossible to injure as many people as fast as with a modern "centuries of improvements in tech" firearm. And it's impossible to protect all crowds from a high remote shooter (even closed arenas have to fill and empty).
Stockpiling issue? Yep, that horse has bolted already. But you can limit the inflow of new weapons, as not everyone is motivated enough to make their own replacement barrels.
It's like suicide: you can't prevent them all, but you should reduce the impact of a someone having a crazy moment.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 02 2017, @06:27PM
since he was shooting at a big crowd, it's possible that he was shooting two guns at once. it's not like he needed to aim...
(Score: 2) by takyon on Monday October 02 2017, @06:32PM (2 children)
Could the 273 include shootings where nobody died? If not, what is the death threshold, 3?Maybe it was my fault and I should specify 10+ dead in 1 shooting daily. But the amount of killings needed to force change = arbitrary hypothetical speculation anyway.Nevermind, I found the definition [abc15.com]:
I think you are probably right that a blanket ban (to include a repeal of the 2nd Amendment) would reduce the amount of people who can engage in these attacks. Kind of like that Soylentil AC who can't get cannabis because he's not cool enough and entirely antisocial. Remove the legitimate avenues to buy guns, and these peoples' actions will look much more suspicious as they are fumbling around trying to get machine guns from people who are FBI snitches. And going the 3D print/CNC mill route is either expensive, takes some skill, or produces an inferior weapon.
That said, it could be offset by permanent war with militia types who have plenty of stockpiled guns and the skill to make some of their own. I think there are tens of thousands of people who are not committing violence but would start to do so if something as momentous as a 2nd Amendment repeal happened. Kind of like how Waco inspired the Oklahoma City bombing.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday October 02 2017, @07:08PM (1 child)
Probably hundreds of thousands. Possibly a million or two. I know I'd be one of them for certain.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 02 2017, @07:50PM
Ditto that. I may not be much use out in the field at my age, but I'd find some way to make myself useful.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday October 02 2017, @07:06PM (1 child)
Check the audio in the videos. He was most definitely full auto.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 03 2017, @08:36AM
While it could have been due to echoing sound reaching the recording cameras, I perceived a change in fire rate several times.
It reminded me of what often happens when someone is using a "bump-fire" stock to turn a semi-automatic firearm into a kinda-sorta full-auto firearm. Example [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by Arik on Tuesday October 03 2017, @05:17AM (4 children)
It would be work to get to the same death toll as this one, for sure, but it wouldn't be that hard to match some of the earlier shooters, nor would it require the perpetrator be particularly healthy. Or even possess an actual knife for that matter. Knives can be improvised quite easily, and they're frightfully effective against a thin-skinned animal like a human. What actually makes them hard to use is psychology. There's no separation, there's no distance, they're used close-up where the perpetrator can see, and feel, and smell, the person he's slicing apart. This is no barrier to a sociopath and may even excite them, but for a normal person this provokes strong feelings of revulsion and aversion.
The rifle makes it psychologically easier by allowing one to kill from a distance, to kill someone that is only a human-shaped blob of color in the distance, that has no facial expressions, no deeper reality.
That's a fair point, but it needs to be set in context. The rifle allows one man to kill another from a few hundred yards, by carefully lining up the shot then easing the trigger over while controlling ones breathing precisely. ICBMs allow one man to kill millions, from the other side of the planet with the push of a button, all details taken care of for him. Which one should we be most concerned about?
"Stockpiling issue? Yep, that horse has bolted already. But you can limit the inflow of new weapons, as not everyone is motivated enough to make their own replacement barrels."
Big problem with that is that regulations disproportionately affect the law-abiding citizen, and are disproportionately ineffective at changing the armament of the criminal who acts with premeditation. Sure, you give them an increased risk that in isolation might result in some deterrence - the draconian gun law they now risk conviction under - but the decreased risk of a victim turning out to be armed means that, on net, you are actually encouraging them.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 3, Funny) by bob_super on Tuesday October 03 2017, @07:59AM (3 children)
> the decreased risk of a victim turning out to be armed means that, on net, you are actually encouraging them.
Which is why you'll get mugged by a guy with a knife in Europe, give him your wallet, and stay alive to bitch about the inconvenience and the lack of a guild receipt.
Short of extremely extremely rare wackos, people with a clear upper hand will just move on in a peaceful way, a civilized no-injuries situation. Worrying about the other party pulling out a hero move is what gets people shot.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Tuesday October 03 2017, @10:53AM
You're full of shit but +1 Funny for the Guild receipt quip.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 03 2017, @11:27AM
Did this make more sense inside your head? Or do you really perceived armed criminals as "civilized"?
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Arik on Tuesday October 03 2017, @05:35PM
The difference between a society where people can leave their doors unlocked without worry and one where people are afraid to walk down the street is a few percentage of 'rare wackos' who are willing to do their duty for society even when that means accepting personal risk. After the events of the 20th century, european men tend to be extremely averse to accepting personal risk, which leaves their societies easy prey to parasites. Rather the reverse of the US problem, yet hardly a virtue nonetheless.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 3, Interesting) by edIII on Monday October 02 2017, @07:40PM (3 children)
That's why it's always more intelligent to treat the cause and not the symptom. Get rid of all guns, and it will be knives. Make sure all knives are gone, and that kitchens somehow function with it out them, and it will be bombs. Get rid of the explosives and it will be poison. At some point, you will need to heavily, heavily, heavily, lock down the 3D maker crowds with their printers. What about CNC mills and all those people with skills to just make a gun?
I'm more interested in the cause. Society is fracturing and tearing itself apart as we speak. From reading different articles about it, this guy had no money problems, no religious or political affiliations, and was retired with multiple private aircraft while being a high stakes gambler. What the fuck was his motivation to bring that much firepower and rain it down on a concert? ISIS is taking responsibility, but that isn't credible given the other evidence.
Whatever motivated this guy to do what he did, would motivate him to do something beyond guns and rifles. That may have actually had for more impact, meaning something other than a gun. What would an explosive vest have done? Some hover drones with 1KG of simtex? What would ricin do sprayed above the crowd for a few minutes via drone?
That's why I'm more interested in the cause. Life is really just one big fucking toolbox, and if you have the skills, time, and motivation, you can get shit done.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 02 2017, @07:54PM (2 children)
I've been waiting for a conspiracy theorist to point the finger at the FBI/CIA/other alphabet soup agency. Projecting voices into the man's head, forcing him to take action. Alas, none have stepped forward to suggest it, so I'll have to bring it up. *big grin*
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 03 2017, @12:16AM
I brought it up in at least one comment, but I guess I didn't specify any specific group.
Runaway not original as usual ;)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 03 2017, @05:19AM
https://soylentnews.org/breakingnews/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=21860&page=3&cid=576089#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by turgid on Monday October 02 2017, @07:28PM
And what about a pointed stick?
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 02 2017, @07:28PM (1 child)
Yes, it would have still happened. The hardware this individual used has been banned for decades. This was a full automatic weapon and drum magazine. No idea where we got his hardware, but it's not something you'll find at any gun shop.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday October 02 2017, @09:29PM
I'm waiting to find out if it was a Fast and Furious gun myself.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.