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Fred Reed's mathematical analysis of Trump's Wall proves that Trump is insincere, proves that Trump is mathematically incompetent, and earns Fred Reed an honorary nerd card:
https://fredoneverything.org/the-wall-the-sound-and-the-fury-and-not-much-else/
More math!
~childo
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Trump's Wall Is Mathematically Unlikely
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The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
Oh, that sound of male ego. You travel halfway across the galaxy and
it's still the same song.
-- Eve McHuron, "Mudd's Women", stardate 1330.1
(Score: 5, Interesting) by fishybell on Sunday January 07 2018, @07:37AM (15 children)
Illegal immigrants do cost money, but they're not all created equal. Those with a higher education earn more and pay more taxes than they get out of it (social security, medicare, sales taxes, property taxes, etc.). Those with a lower education earn less and cost more taxes (mostly in public education).
Overall though, they end up costing less than people who have the same education and earnings over their lifetime because of the massive cost of social security and medicare that they don't receive.
They may not be free, but they're a good bargain.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @07:45AM (9 children)
I've seen lots of studies that shows they are a net benefit, lacking fully legal status they actually are less able to get any social benefits.
(Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @07:49AM
Man says "Ughy..." after he finishes raping toddler. Most ethical rapist?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Sunday January 07 2018, @08:08AM (7 children)
Oh, there are lots of studies, on both sides. Left wingers dismiss costs like uninsured aliens making use of emergency rooms and other medical services. Right wingers count all of that kind of stuff - welfare benefits, identity theft, crime, and more. You can cherry pick ten, a hundred, a thousand illegal aliens, and demonstrate that they are a net gain to society. Your cherry picked crowd of illegals will only include those who have never committed a crime, never committed tax fraud, never been to court even for non-criminal offenses. Hell, you can cherry pick from any demographic, to demonstrate that that particular demographic is composed of people who are just FAHbulous!
The fact is, California is awash in illegals who cost the state money - mostly in medical expenses. The taxes paid by the illegals aren't nearly enough to pay for the medical expenses.
Study all you like - but if you're going to be serious, you need to account for all costs.
Now, once the studies are all done, we come around full circle. Illegals are illegal because they have nothing but contempt for the law. They violated immigration laws, they violate labor laws, they violate tax laws routinely, all across the demographic. SOME OF THEM violate much more serious laws. In fact, enough of them violate serious laws that - "In California and other border states, specialists warn that the number of illegal immigrants in jail could jeopardize the local prison system." http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-13201212 [bbc.com]
Go ahead, cite some studies. But, don't cite left wing studies that focus only on those model citizens whose only crimes have been crossing the border illegally. Use nation wide figures, or use a border state, and give us all of the information. No, don't go to someplace like Montana that is basically unaffected by immigration. National or border state figures, please. Or, at the least, use those states that have borders with the border states - Louisiana, Arkansas, Oklahoma, Colorado, Utah, and Nevada.
Fact is, illegals live in a shadow world, that few legal citizens know about. And, crime loves the shadows. Hey, the victims are often detrimental as well. How many crimes go unreported, just because the victim is an illegal? That includes extortion, kidnap, rape, murder, blackmail, child trafficking, sex slavery - the entire gamut of crime. It's all in the shadows, because NO ONE wants to report the crime.
Studies. Want serious studies? Get out there, into the illegal alien communities, and live with them. You'll meet some admirable people - and you'll meet the scum of the earth. And both kinds of people help to perpetuate the shadow culture.
Studies. Go do a real study. Ultimately, the shadow culture is detrimental to a civilized society. It is probably as damaging to society as the military industrial complex is. If not, it runs a pretty close second.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @07:26PM (1 child)
If we're going to do a tally, can we also tally up all the American's who are drains on the system or are criminals?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Sunday January 07 2018, @09:14PM
Tally away, I don't care. But there is a huge difference between illegal aliens, and citizens. That is, we owe nothing to the illegals, and we can boot them anytime we decide we have the balls to do it. Citizens, on the other hand, are our responsibility, for good or bad. We cannot deport a citizen. And, if we were to do so, where in hell would we send them? To Antarctica? Mars? Alpha Centauri? See, Mexico is responsible for their citizens, and we are responsible for our own.
I suspect that if we DID deport our worst citizens to Mexico, those citizens would soon be assuming room temperature. It would all be extrajudicial, of course. Mexico doesn't have a death penalty, so officially, the government could wash their hands of the entire affair. But, those citizens would be dead, dead, dead.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by dry on Monday January 08 2018, @02:29AM (1 child)
What about all the people who facilitate these illegals? My understanding is that Americans encourage them by giving them jobs and that is why they cross the border illegally. Is it legal to hire illegals down there? Perhaps if there were no jobs for them, they wouldn't be crossing the borders in such numbers?
For a country that happily locks up millions of citizens, it shouldn't be a problem to lock up anyone who hires an illegal. Could probably just hang out somewhere like Home Hardware with some fake illegals and start busting these people with no respect for the law and no respect for your country. Seems a worse offence to encourage people to sneak into your country compared to being hungry and responding to job offers.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday January 08 2018, @04:25AM
Your understanding is correct. There is an unfortunate coincidence here, however. Those people who have jobs to offer, also have money. Money talks, and bullshit walks. A little bribe money here - errr, whooops, I meant "campaign contribution" and another "contribution" there, and the SOB's are all but untouchable.
(Score: 1) by rylyeh on Monday January 08 2018, @05:29AM (2 children)
Um, If there were no employers - would the 'illegals' be here? Has it not been the practice of U.S. businesses to seasonally employ these people? Because California? Texas? Washington state?
"a vast crenulate shell wherein rode the grey and awful form of primal Nodens, Lord of the Great Abyss."
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday January 08 2018, @08:09AM (1 child)
Please see my reply to Dry, just above. People who are bribing officials to look the other way get away with it. I'm all for burning the employers. If I put bait out to attract any creature, I can't complain that the creatures are in my yard. Offer enough bait, and I could be persuaded to move into a city. Those illegals are just the same. So, yes, the employers should be going to prison, and the illegals should be headed back to Mexico. Actually, the illegals get the better end of that scheme. I don't want to imprison them - they'll be free men and women, as soon as they step across the border.
(Score: 1) by rylyeh on Tuesday January 09 2018, @05:12AM
I agree completely. 📣
"a vast crenulate shell wherein rode the grey and awful form of primal Nodens, Lord of the Great Abyss."
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @08:03AM (4 children)
We're looking at a net cost (gain minus loss) of about $10,000 per illegal alien per year.
The fact that there might be a few financially beneficial people among these lawbreakers does nothing to change the fact that the average illegal alien is a loss for our country.
They get quite a bit of welfare. Part of this comes via identity theft, which is the norm for illegal aliens. (maybe YOUR identity) Part of it comes via state agencies that don't ask about citizenship or don't require any proof. Part of it comes via children; have a baby and then your whole family gets benefits.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @07:28PM (3 children)
Care to cite some sources?
Again, would love to see your sources
Oh, never mind, I don't need to see your sources anymore, you clearly don't know anything about this subject. Have a nice day!
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday January 07 2018, @09:28PM (2 children)
You're not very bright, are you? The identity theft you scoff at is very real. I see it. I hear it. I was pretty much unaware of what was going on, until one of our guys took two week's vacation, went home to Mexico, and came back with a different name, a different social security number, and demanded that everyone address him by his new name. His new Anglo name. After this one individual made me aware of the process, I've watched several others do the same. One woman, who I was near certain was legal, took her vacation, went home to show off her new baby girl to her relatives, and SHE came back with a new name, new SSN - the works. These are people I work with, people I talk to every day, some of whom I actually LIKE! But, they are identity thieves.
Oh - one of those identity thieves was awfully amusing. His weekly take home pay was normally something over $500. After he came back from vacation, everything was cool, for about five weeks. Then, he got a pay check for about $75. The SSN he was using, belonged to some deadbeat dad in Alabama. Somehow, Alabama found that the SSN was showing an income, so they asked Arkansas to garnish the wages for child support. Of course, the company complied with the request or order. Our Mexican took a week off, and came back with yet another SSN.
Don't even try to play that game. Identity theft is a real thing, and it is pretty much routine for the illegal community. It takes a week or so to get it done, but if you've got the money, you can get it done.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by dry on Monday January 08 2018, @02:36AM
This is happening at your work? And the owners of the business haven't been thrown in jail for knowingly employing people who change their identity regularly? I think your country has bigger problems then illegals.
(Score: 2) by jmorris on Monday January 08 2018, @03:21AM
Document everything (on the downlow of course) and call 1-866-DHS-2ICE from a burner. Report back with whether Trump's ICE is really enforcing the law. Do it for America!