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from the improved-outlook-on-improving-outlooks dept.
New studies zero in on roots of depression and why ketamine reverses it
[There's] been significant progress in unravelling the confusion over ketamine, with researchers identifying a ketamine derivative that tackles depression with far fewer side effects. And this week, a team of researchers at China's Zhejiang University announced that they've figured out where in the brain ketamine acts when it blocks depression, a finding that gives us significant insights into the biology of the disorder.
The new studies rely on the work of a number of other labs, which have identified a specific structure deep in the brain that's associated with depression. Called the lateral habenula, it's been associated with a variety of activities, the most relevant of which seems to be the processing of unpleasant outcomes and punishment. Electrodes implanted there have been used to relieve depression in at least one instance.
To test whether this might be the site of ketamine's activity, one team of researchers infused the drug directly into the lateral habenula of rats with depression-like symptoms; it blocked them. So did a separate chemical that inhibits the same proteins that ketamine acts on. Tracking the activity in the area, the researchers were able to show that there are bursts of activity in rats with symptoms of depression that are absent in healthy rats. The drugs that blocked depression suppressed these bursts.
Ketamine blocks bursting in the lateral habenula to rapidly relieve depression (DOI: 10.1038/nature25509) (DX)
Astroglial Kir4.1 in the lateral habenula drives neuronal bursts in depression (DOI: 10.1038/nature25752) (DX)
Related: FDA Designates MDMA as a "Breakthrough Therapy" for PTSD; Approves Phase 3 Trials
Study Suggests Psilocybin "Resets" the Brains of Depressed People
Ketamine Reduces Suicidal Thoughts in Depressed Patients
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 18 2018, @05:51PM (9 children)
The sad thing is people will see this as an excuse to abuse a drug and self medicate. Instead of good scientific study (like the one here). It will get vilified and end up like all the other drugs out there that could help people in particular cases.
To do a proper study we need control groups. Long term and short term effects. What sort of dosage are we talking here? Milligrams or grams?
I think I may have some sort of mild depression (long term well over 20+ years). But most of the drugs I look into have seriously nasty side effects that are basically worse than what I am going through. Then on top of that most of the drugs seem to cover up the root causes. In some cases it is an imbalance. But it may be something else. But you have basically smoothed it over and still are not finding the root cause. In some cases it is psychological in others a genetic thing in others an environmental thing. Then just to add icing to the cake 'Obamacare' has basically put me personally getting help out of reach due to stupid high deductibles. Looking down the barrel of several thousand dollars of costs with a 'maybe we can help, or maybe not' then a high cost ongoing cost. I miss the 90s this shit would have cost maybe a few hundred bucks, tops.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 18 2018, @06:04PM (7 children)
You can grow lots of shrooms for under $200. Spores can be legally bought by mail order.
If you did turn to non-prescription ketamine, it's only Schedule 3.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 18 2018, @10:35PM (3 children)
I am not touching that shit. Again self medicating is just shooting in the dark. I do not like psychedelic effects. It makes me extremely sick. Sure I may not feel depressed but I feel like total hell. I am not looking to feel geeked out or floaty. I just do not want to be depressed.
I am also not going to 'give ketamine a try'. That sort of thinking is little more than drink a can of 7up and take an aspirin to feel better when you have the flu. It may sooth the side effects a bit but does not fix the root cause.
Dealing with the 'drug scene' is like dealing with extremely inexperienced programmers. They 'try' things with little regard for the science and rigor of doing it correctly. "just try X" well thats nice but it did jack diddly to fix the issue at hand. What is worse there are many out there who have master level experience but never graduated to actually doing things correctly. Just because you have done something for 10k hours does not make you an expert. It just gives you the opportunity to do so.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Ethanol-fueled on Sunday February 18 2018, @11:58PM
Where is your version of this "drug scene" of which you speak?
My version was seeing junkies literally begging to suck dick for heroin, or to try and sucker me into cold-calling their dealers at 3 a.m. and score drugs for them because even their dealers would no longer sell to them. Or how about the tweekers who rent and illegally sublet a Mexicali-slum studio apartment with nothing but a shit-stained mattress in it fire up the glass dick and take turns sitting on their asses on the floor and pacing around like some kind of urban powow gone bad. Or the single mother of two OD'ing and dying after a round of booze and pain medication. Or the other numerous cases of Hep-C and jail time, driving their own girlfriends up to Johns' houses and pimping them out multiple times a night before kissing the mouth that just sucked 5-10 dicks.
Booze is a destructive drug but there is more dignity in being the village drunkard than there is the last paragraph above.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 19 2018, @12:04AM (1 child)
You keep on saying it but it's not true. Nobody should take your pessimism about this to heart.
You can self-medicate safely with shrooms. You can take small amounts and adjust the dose up each time. Doses under about a gram will have few or no psychedelic effects. Microdosers take as little as 0.25 grams.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 19 2018, @02:03AM
IME, it takes about 2-3 grams to get any visual effect, and those usually light until I get into 1/8 oz or above. Shrooms are non-addictive, very safe, and extremely useful both recreationally and for dealing with depression. Pure MDMA has a similar efficacy, but it also has side effects and isn't quite as safe.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Sunday February 18 2018, @11:46PM (2 children)
You can legally buy the spores, but you get on the FBI watch-list for legally buying the pressure-cookers needed to grow. And, as we all have recently discovered if not known for years, the FBI is an organization with its priorities straight.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 18 2018, @11:57PM (1 child)
You're already on multiple watchlists. But you can buy the pressure cooker with cash at some Bed, Bath & Beyond place or a local hardware store.
If you want to be ghetto or avoid a watchlist you can use boiling water only for the BRF method.
(Score: 2) by SanityCheck on Monday February 19 2018, @09:04AM
Would you by chance know whether the watchlist is single or double ply?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 18 2018, @06:43PM
There's a number of things that need to be studied before something like this can be prescribed ethically. Then there's the legal consideration.
I cringe when I hear people boosting things like kratom, marijuana and ketamine without having appropriate research as to the efficacy, side effects and protocol that would be relevant to prescribing them. Sure, they may have unapproved uses that work, but so did morphine and heroine and they've caused all sorts of trouble due to the way they were used.
Drug policy should be based on the best available science.