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posted by cmn32480 on Monday March 12 2018, @10:43AM   Printer-friendly
from the would-you-like-fries-with-that dept.

Burger-flipper has job safety from the AI automation robots. Test runs of Flippy the Burger Flipping robot apparently didn't last more than a day, before Flippy was let go. Apparently he wasn't fast enough, lacked social skills and other workers had to work around him and his giant burger flipping arm. Flippy 2.0 (or whatever) will probably return one day with new burger flipping artificial intelligence, an improved arm and one of them funny Hawkings-like voice boxes so he can chit-chat with the other co-workers.

"Mostly it's the timing," he said. "When you're in the back, working with people, you talk to each other. With Flippy, you kind of need to work around his schedule. Choreographing the movements of what you do, when and how you do it."

(1) https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/talkingtech/2018/03/07/flippy-burger-flipping-robot-break-already/405580002/

Previously: Burger-Flipping Robot Will Grill Meat in 50 Fast Food Restaurants


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  • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday March 12 2018, @02:23PM (7 children)

    by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday March 12 2018, @02:23PM (#651340)

    Agreed - we've been making robots for 100+ years, they just usually don't have arms and fingers, etc. and usually go by the name "machine."

    Having experienced a few months of fast food service many decades ago, I want to know when they'll have "robots" that can autonomously:

    - change the fry vat oil
    - mop the kitchen floors
    - take out the garbage
    - scrub the dumpster

    and worst of all: handle an irate customer.

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  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by bob_super on Monday March 12 2018, @04:52PM (6 children)

    by bob_super (1357) on Monday March 12 2018, @04:52PM (#651418)

    "Take out the garbage" could be done by a conveyor belt.
    Changing the oil just doesn't seem to need to happen, according to my experience (yuck), but a drain and a dispenser aren't exactly advanced tech, according to my home washers.
    Mopping the kitchen floors is a roomba-like Job, which becomes less necessary when you automate everything
    Scrub the dumspter? Let's just rinse it with a bleach nozzle.

    "Handle an irate customer" is the easiest, in theory: Give them a screen to order, and deliver exactly what they order, without the errors that naturally creep in when humans handle twenty things at once. Sure, my dad will still get angry at the shitty unreliable touchscreen interface, but that's not the same level of personally irate as you implied.

    • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday March 12 2018, @06:18PM (4 children)

      by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday March 12 2018, @06:18PM (#651459)

      Seems like you might have less fast food employment experience than me - which, to be less would basically be none, but....

      Garbage comes in plastic bags - tying a cheap plastic garbage bag is the first useful skill I learned in Fast Food. To convert that to a conveyor belt would be even messier than the current process and just give you a conveyor belt to clean (inside the wheels, etc.) - remember: most garbage actually comes from the consumer-public side of the operation, so anything wet and messy that can be spilled, will be spilled in the least convenient places possible.

      Fry oil surely does not get changed as often as it should in many placed, but if it NEVER gets changed, oh my - that's going to require a new fry vat in a short time. Now, plumbing the drain to the outside oil disposal tank would require oil piping and pumps - which might come close to the cost of a humanoid robot to build and maintain. Remember, shoestring doesn't just describe the fries, it's also the budget the owners give the managers to work with: stop-cock valve drains hot used oil into a heavy-ass bucket which gets clumsily carried across the messy/slippery kitchen floor out to the oil reclamation tank outside. At least today the replacement oil doesn't come in big white chunks labeled LARD.

      Roombas can barely handle pet-hair, we tried a Scooba (mopper) in 2004 - it wasn't worth the effort to maintain, trying a new one that is supposed to arrive this week, but it's more of a swiffer wet-jet damp mop thing. Fast food kitchen floor mopping involves a big hot bucket with strong grease cutting soap - the roomba-like robot that could do that would be too big to fit under the sink, or reach many of the places that need reaching. Maybe the robots could be neater while they make the food, but spill happens, and food-prep spill can need some serious mop.

      Bleach nozzle - now I know you're trolling, is the robot going to operate this nozzle? Unless it's a pressure-washer, stuff is going to stay stuck to the surfaces. If it is a pressure washer, you're going to need a pretty skilled maintenance tech to keep it operational.

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      • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Monday March 12 2018, @06:26PM (3 children)

        by bob_super (1357) on Monday March 12 2018, @06:26PM (#651463)

        Not trolling, just pointing out that those are menial tasks with technical solutions.
        Many of those solutions haven't been cost-effective enough to replace a no-benefits minimum-wage job in most of the US. That's more a judgment on the ability to get an endless supply of desperate no-benefits minimum-wage workers, than an inability to automate those tasks.

        • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday March 12 2018, @07:39PM (2 children)

          by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday March 12 2018, @07:39PM (#651488)

          Well, for once, I'll side with the "how much are you willing to pay for that burger?" crew...

          Sure, we could fully automate McDonald's today, we have the technology, but it would more than triple the capital cost of the restaurant, in exchange for reduced (not zero) labor rates - and the labor you need will be more technically skilled and harder to boss around - not a very attractive proposition for most franchise owners who are used to being able to be the smartest guy in their operation - not that they are the smartest guy, just that they don't _need_ anybody smarter than them to keep the money flowing.

          Once you've invested all this money in your Robo kitchen, there's little liklihood that it will help you sell significantly more burgers (even a risk of less), so now you are looking at a 3x+ ROI period for your initial investment (because labor costs, while important, are not the bulk of the issue...), and with 3x ROI time, it doesn't take a genius to see how that's going to slow down expansion and growth of your empire. We had neighbors in their mid 20s whose parents "gave them" a Baskin Robbins/Dunkin Donuts store to operate, with the expectation that after they got that one in good shape, they'd be expanding to an additional 3-5 stores in the next few years... that's a pretty typical pattern, store owners are no longer content to own and operate one good location - as owners they want continuous expansion. You would think that robot workers would be welcomed as a predictable labor pool, but they're just too expensive right now.

          The answer to "how much are you willing to pay for that burger" is answered by the majority of the burger buying market with "as little as possible." We're not going to get significant automation until automation can make the burgers for less, instead of more.

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          • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Monday March 12 2018, @09:10PM (1 child)

            by bob_super (1357) on Monday March 12 2018, @09:10PM (#651525)

            Agree with you, but you side-stepped my point:

            > not going to get significant automation until automation can make the burgers for less, instead of more.

            or ... run out of people willing to work for peanuts. Unskilled immigrants and teenagers take jobs that don't pay a living wage nor benefits, allowing owners to cash in.
            In places where the minimum wage is rising, and in those states debating single-payer (tiny CA), storefronts using the "labor is not the bulk of the issue" business model may soon have another look at partial automation, if they want to keep the Dollar Menu.

            • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday March 12 2018, @11:17PM

              by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday March 12 2018, @11:17PM (#651575)

              run out of people willing to work for peanuts.

              Oh, are you in the U.S.? In the U.S. we squeeze the social programs until cheap labor drips out. These namby pamby minimum wage increasing states can play their utopian pipe dream games, in good 'old Arkansas, Texas, Mississippi - you won't be runnin' out of cheap labor before doooomseday. When the locals get too rich to be bothered, they'll just let in a few more illegal Mexicans and have 'em work off the books. Trump won't be president forever.

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    • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday March 12 2018, @07:48PM

      by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday March 12 2018, @07:48PM (#651492)

      Sure, my dad will still get angry at the shitty unreliable touchscreen interface, but that's not the same level of personally irate as you implied.

      My first irate customer ordered "peg legs" (Long John Silver's) at 9:30pm. Peg legs take 5:30 to cook, so about 7 minutes from order to bag out the window. During this time, Mr. Rate informs me that he's left his kids home, alone, and he needs his food now. I explain that peg legs take a long time to cook because of the bones in them, and they're almost ready. When he gets the bag, he looks inside and comes back with a "I can't give these to my kids, they've got BONES in them." I offer the boneless planks, but they will take another 4 minutes to cook... Mr. Rate leaves mumbling something about never coming back. So, as a human operator, the next time a customer ordered Peg Legs, I had a mini-conversation "the ones with the bones?" "yes, those." confirming the decision, which is something that a robot _could_ learn from a company trainer, but not likely self-taught OJT.

      Most irate customers will be taking out their self-inconsistency on the machines, calling the machines misleading or even faulty, making extra messes for the machines to clean up, even vandalizing the place. Decades of "the customer is always right" service policies have trained them that they get free and reduced price stuff when they get pouty, and some places will even reward them for apparent dementia.

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