SoylentNews is people
SoylentNews
The Raspberry Pi Blog announces:
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ is now on sale now for $35, featuring:
- 1.4GHz 64-bit quad-core ARM Cortex-A53 CPU
- Dual-band 802.11ac wireless LAN and Bluetooth 4.2
- Faster Ethernet (Gigabit Ethernet over USB 2.0)
- Power-over-Ethernet support (with separate PoE HAT)
- Improved PXE network and USB mass-storage booting
- Improved thermal management
Alongside a 200MHz increase in peak CPU clock frequency we have roughly three times the wired and wireless network throughput, and the ability to sustain high performance for much longer periods.
Video announcement here.
FAQs:
- Not discontinuing earlier Raspberry Pi models
- Raspberry Pi 1A+ continues to be the $20 entry-level "big" Raspberry Pi
- Considering possibility of introducing a Raspberry Pi 3A+
- CM!, CM3 and CM#L compute modules continue to be available.
- Still using VideoCore
Now I am left to wonder how many amps the power supply wall wart needs to be.
This discussion has been archived.
No new comments can be posted.
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ on sale now at $35
|
Log In/Create an Account
| Top
| 56 comments
| Search Discussion
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
Remember Darwin; building a better mousetrap merely results in smarter mice.
(Score: 2) by Justin Case on Wednesday March 14 2018, @11:38PM (31 children)
The Raspberry series has been a wonderful groundbreaker, but I still don't think I can use this to build the firewall I want: three wired ports and NO wireless.
The wired ports would be for Internet, internal, and tap. I'd like to run software that forwards selected packets to the tap port for analysis (e.g. wireshark) or recording. I suppose if the CPU is beefy enough I could record the packets straight to USB attached hard disk and eliminate one wired port.
No wireless, because I'm tried of fighting with hardware trying to lock it down. If the capacity for unauthorized communication simply isn't there, then I don't have to worry about some misconfiguration or malware launching unapproved I/O someday.
I dunno, maybe I could patch in the three wired connections via Ethernet-to-USB adapters? Anyone know if it handles multiple Ethernet over USB 2.0 ports?
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Thursday March 15 2018, @12:03AM (5 children)
> No wireless, because I'm tried of fighting with hardware trying to lock it down. If the capacity for unauthorized communication
> simply isn't there, then I don't have to worry about some misconfiguration or malware launching unapproved I/O someday.
Ever heard of wire cutters, drills, and Faraday cages? Disabling wireless on your own HW isn't rocket surgery.
(Score: 3, Touché) by Justin Case on Thursday March 15 2018, @01:13AM (4 children)
I'm a software guy, not a hardware guy.
Maybe you could pass along a clue and point out which wire(s) in this picture I should cut:
https://www.raspberrypi.org/app/uploads/2018/03/770A4973-1.jpg [raspberrypi.org]
(From TFA.)
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Thursday March 15 2018, @01:31AM
I googled "rasp pi 3 B antenna", and the pictures point to a rectangular component right next to the "made in the UK" silkscreen.
Since your picture isn't exactly the same, but has passives right there to jump a trace towards that shiny rectangle with the engraved raspberry, I'd say you only need to wait a little while to get confirmation from the first guy posting how to add a high-gain antenna.
(Score: 2) by EETech1 on Thursday March 15 2018, @02:20AM
I think modifying the antenna is a bad idea, it'll cause more interference, and probably still work close range.
Trying to modify the PCB is also a bad idea, especially if you have to do more than one, or replace one down the road.
Just remove the necessary components from the software.
Go in synaptic, search for wireless, and uncheck the drivers.
Delete iwconfig
Something like that
Or get the 2B without wireless.
(Score: 2) by insanumingenium on Thursday March 15 2018, @04:44PM
This will never be a good device for building a firewall though. Also, I wouldn't bother with a "tap" interface, sample the interfaces via software when you need it.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Sunday March 18 2018, @06:55AM
Okay MacGyver, cut the red wire. The red one. No wait, not the red one, the blue one. Yes, the blu.. no, not the blue one!
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday March 15 2018, @12:18AM
stage0 PXE Boot and UEFI included in uBoot... unless they mean as features of the RPi3B+ pi images, in which case ignore me.
In the former case however they have just made the Pi more like a PC and less like the 'down to bare metal' platform many people appreciated them for being. If the next step is enabling TrustZone for DRM support, then the Pi4 will be dead to me.
As to the other complaints about all the USB2.0 peripherals: Consider a Rock64 instead. 4GB of LPDDR3, a real Gigabit Ethernet port, a real USB 3.0 port, an optional wifi port (albeit for 10+ dollars extra), a 5V 3A Barrel Jack Power supply (~55 dollars before tax and shipping for the 4GB model+PSU, or ~35 with the 1GB model and PSU), onboard SPI flash for your bootloader, and optional eMMC socket based off the older hardkernel removable eMMC daughterboard. Plus a regular microsd card slot if you want it.
Downsides? It uses a Mali4x0 graphics core, and may not have composite video out (Pine64 I believe does.) If you can made do with those, and aren't in need of the drop in GPIO ecosystem of the RPi (Rock64 has both new and old Pi GPIO headers, but not every pin has the same functionality), it has all the trappings of a better network device than the RPi2,3B,3B+ and is cost competitive for the same RAM quantity, while selling models sufficiently big to act as a low end desktop replacement. If they get a PineBook spin using the Rock64 configuration for a similiar price, it could also offer a cheap and competitive netbook/cloudbook for everything except the Intel GPU at around half the cost.
(Score: 2) by Unixnut on Thursday March 15 2018, @12:20AM
> The Raspberry series has been a wonderful groundbreaker, but I still don't think I can use this to build the firewall I want: three wired ports and NO wireless.
What about this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_Pi#Banana_Pi_BPI-R2 [wikipedia.org]
it isn't an exact match because it has wifi + BT, however you can just not enable that.
Ok, so it isn't a raspberry pi, but the raspberry pi foundation kick stated an entire ecosystem of "pi-like" boards that maintain some software and/or GPIO compatibility, while giving you a bunch of features, from multiple Ethernet ports like the above, to SATA connectors, and more...
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Virindi on Thursday March 15 2018, @12:29AM (6 children)
Agreed. A cheap device which had no wireless but at least two (preferably gigabit) ethernet ports would be quite useful.
Personally I don't use consumer routers, I only build them. But that leaves me using old PCs, which are not always ideal (power use and noise) and not something that really works if I wanted to set one up for someone else.
It would be nice to just be able to provide a family member with a router with Debian on it which was a RPI form factor and power consumption.
(Score: 2) by Justin Case on Thursday March 15 2018, @01:17AM (1 child)
Closest I've found so far is this:
https://corpshadow.biz/bizstore/apu-combo-kits/apu2c2-red-combo-kit.html [corpshadow.biz]
Don't know if that meets your definition of "cheap". At $175, plus you still need to hook up some stuff, you're mighty close to the price of an entry level Winblows box.
(Score: 2) by driverless on Thursday March 15 2018, @07:06AM
The APU2 is damn nice, they run at $100-130 direct from the source depending on what features you want. They're also vastly more powerful than a Pi or anything similar, you're looking at a 1Ghz quad-core x64 CPU with 2-4GB of RAM, that was a server spec some years ago.
(Score: 2) by EETech1 on Thursday March 15 2018, @02:12AM (1 child)
I thought people were using cheap trend-net routers and dd-wrt.
Not Debian, but it might not need to be.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday March 15 2018, @04:18PM
dd-wrt and openwrt are not secure enough for a real firewall os.
(Score: 2) by PartTimeZombie on Friday March 16 2018, @01:15AM (1 child)
These are slightly bigger [pcengines.ch] than an RPi, but way more powerful and quite capable of running pfSense with OpenVPN.
I bought one from here. [nicegear.nz]
Including a case, power supply and a 16GB mSATA drive I spend about $380 (Local money, about $US275 or so).
It's about the size of a consumer ADSL router.
(Score: 2) by canopic jug on Friday March 16 2018, @04:45AM
It's about the size of a consumer ADSL router.
APU3s are great for a specific context but miss a lot. One big problem is that there are only three Ethernet ports.
And like a consumer ADSL router it has almost no hardware expansion capabilities. There's a nub that you can build on to add your own PCIe expansion slot, but that requires skill, effort, and knowing the right parts to get. Then once you have that, you have to build a custom enclosure otherwise cats and kids will be all over that peripheral as it sticks out of the side of the default enclosure you had to saw open.
Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions.
(Score: 2) by richtopia on Thursday March 15 2018, @01:54AM
I haven't tried it myself, but I think the ESPRESSObin delivers on your needs.
http://a.co/276645R [a.co]
(Score: 4, Funny) by EETech1 on Thursday March 15 2018, @02:06AM
Should be some kind of apt-get uninstall wireless something or another that makes sure the wireless won't work.
Funny how far we've come, someone is complaining that wireless works on Linux!
(Score: 2) by TheGratefulNet on Thursday March 15 2018, @03:08AM
espresso-bin (sp?) has lots of eth ports.
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
(Score: 2) by frojack on Thursday March 15 2018, @03:17AM (5 children)
I haven't had a bit of problem with the WiFi. Don't want it, blacklist it. Romove the drivers. Just don't configure it. I thought you were a software guy.
I use it to feed a Chromecast and it handles the load just fine.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 3, Touché) by Justin Case on Thursday March 15 2018, @02:24PM (4 children)
I've been around long enough to notice that if a machine has a capability, sooner or later it gets abused. (So have you, BTW.)
We once thought we could trust our hardware. Then came Intel's built-in backdoor, IME. We were told "but you can disable it in BIOS". Then people started noticing it had vulnerabilities, just like every damn thing.
What you can disable with a software bit, malware can enable with a software bit. There is no perfect security. The best you can do is simplify the architecture as much as possible. Cleaner to just not have the leaky hardware there in the first place.
(Score: 2) by insanumingenium on Thursday March 15 2018, @04:53PM (3 children)
If you have malware replacing your kernel or installing modules, I don't think a wifi radio is your biggest issue, you are already pwned. Simplifying is a great message, but if an attack vector is predicated on already having total control, seems a bit like closing the barn doors after the cow has knocked over a lamp and burned Chicago to the ground.
(Score: 2) by Justin Case on Friday March 16 2018, @12:22AM (2 children)
Totally agree.
But there's this thing called Defense In Depth. Even if it IS pwned, perhaps I don't want it to phone home.
I can physically control and see where the wired connections are going. With wireless, I just have to hope the manufacturer isn't incompetent, or out to get me, or I didn't screw up my config, or the next software update doesn't silently "fix" it for me, or......... Why would I want all that additional risk and complexity for no benefit?
(Score: 2) by insanumingenium on Friday March 16 2018, @06:02PM (1 child)
I get your point, I just think you are choosing a silly mountain to die on.
The presence or lack of a kernel driver or module is within your control, not the manufacturer. No amount of their incompetence or maliciousness on their part will make that radio work without a driver, and if you can't handle compiling a kernel and/or deleting some modules you shouldn't be rolling your own FW. Anyone who can inject that a into your kernel owns you root and stem.
You do get a benefit from that wireless radio, subsidized hardware. You couldn't personally build a pi equivalent for the price of the pi, if you could we wouldn't be having this conversation. You may see the wireless radio as a millstone, but it is just part of what is making this hardware available to you. For its intended use case, the wifi radio is absolutely useful. And if you find it easier to put that square peg in your round hole, good for you. But arguing that the peg shouldn't have corners is silly, especially when you have the tools and techniques round out that peg yourself. No one is saying you have to buy square pegs just because they are cheap, you have my permission to buy the correct hardware for your application. Yeah that analogy got a little tenuous by the end, sue me.
(Score: 2) by Justin Case on Friday March 16 2018, @07:01PM
You are assuming I am going to connect any of the interfaces to a public network.
You can think what you want, of course. All I said is this is the feature set I want. Why does everyone have to pop up and say "no you don't want that, you want this instead"? What are you, Best Buy salespeople?
Perhaps you've already forgotten that Intel includes a network stack in the hardware, where you can't touch it. You can completely disable whatever networking your OS provides, but the hardware is still backdoored. Deliberately.
Asked and answered, your honor.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Thursday March 15 2018, @03:36AM (1 child)
I am intrigued by the PoE possibility, but disappointed that it needs a hat - I guess it's logical that they wouldn't populate the PoE down-conversion circuitry on the base board.
Now... what would I actually _do_ with a PoE Pi? Hopefully the hat is pass-through compatible with most other hats.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Thursday March 15 2018, @02:07PM
The PoE is indeed interesting when you want to put an Ethernet connected Pi somewhere remote and don't have electrical power available. All sorts of applications for a Pi powered this way. Use Pi as a security camera. Or other remote sensor platform. Or as a remote device controller with a dozen connected relays. Or motor controller.
Power over Ethernet is great!
Now if they would please give me Power over WiFi, I wouldn't need to string cables.
To transfer files: right-click on file, pick Copy. Unplug mouse, plug mouse into other computer. Right-click, paste.
(Score: 2) by driverless on Thursday March 15 2018, @07:00AM (3 children)
I was just thinking the same thing, the press release is missing:
I like the original Pi, it was a great educational toy, but it's remained just that. If you want to actually build something that you can rely on, get a BBB (low-power) or an ODroid (high-power) or something similar. The first time I looked at the ODroid schematics I was astounded, everything the Pi does wrong is done right in the ODroid.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday March 15 2018, @08:13AM
What does that mean? There are plenty of USB devices that are self-powered. Does this mean that Rasberry Pi is so broken that it will suck power from USB hub, even when it has its own power source??? It should be just using the data lines!
(Score: 3, Interesting) by urza9814 on Thursday March 15 2018, @01:01PM
I've got dozens of micro usb power supplies, from 500mA to 3A. Any of them work fine with the Pi in my experience. I regularly power it from my laptop USB ports too. Switching to a barrel jack would be incredibly inconvenient as I'd have to buy all new plugs for all of my Pis. I also have a Pi running from the USB jack on my router, while if they switched to a barrel jack I'd have to run an extension cord to get more free outlets. Or, more likely, if they switched to barrel jacks I'd be spending hours sitting there splicing USB ends onto them. USB is perfect for this use case. The only thing I've ever seen a barrel jack do better than a USB one is bursting into flames, but if that's what you're after you might need a bit more than 5V too ;)
Yeah, probably agree with you on this one, although it depends on the price. The Pi certainly is not designed to be a file server or anything, and I can't think of any times when the bandwidth or latency of any of mine have been an issue. If adding a real Ethernet port is gonna cost an extra $5, it's not worth it to me.
Never had this problem. I run a Pi with a USB webcam and another USB used just to suck power for some fans, and that's the one plugged into the USB port on my router, and it's been running for about a year with no issues. I suppose you'd need a powered port if you've got some seriously high powered peripherals, but as far as I can tell the Pi is perfectly capable of delivering the 500mA required by the USB spec. If your device requires more, it ought to come with a way to get that power.
So that if anything goes wrong with the memory, the entire board is trash? Any flash memory has a limited lifespan, so soldering that crap to the board is just a form of planned obsolescence. I prefer my computing devices to have as many serviceable parts as possible. Plus, soldered memory means non-expandable memory. Some of my Pis run 8GB cards and don't even need that much; others have 64GB card that still aren't quite sufficient. So even if you include onboard memory, you still have to have ports for additional external memory. Which means you'd be needlessly increasing the price for anyone who needs more memory, possibly overcharging anyone who needs less memory, and making life more difficult for people who try to use both.
Also keep in mind that the Pi is the lowest common denominator for these kinds of devices. It's the Ubuntu of single board computers. The main advantage it has is convenience, and convenience is king. For any specific needs, you can probably find a Pi-alike board that would do the job better; but if you're going to be using it for something different every week, the Pi is an excellent cheap and safe choice.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday March 15 2018, @04:23PM
and both the bb and the odroid are more open, IIRC
(Score: 2) by TheRaven on Thursday March 15 2018, @08:48AM
sudo mod me up