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posted by janrinok on Sunday June 03 2018, @10:47PM   Printer-friendly
from the naughty-naughty dept.

The Center for American Progress reports

Last month, the NFL announced a new policy for its players during the national anthem: Players are permitted to stay in the locker room during the anthem, but if they go out onto the field during it, they must stand. If any of the players takes a knee, the team will be fined.

Soon afterwards, a Wall Street Journal report confirmed what most have long suspected: That President Donald Trump's public outrage about NFL players protesting police brutality and systemic racism during the national anthem at football games heavily influenced NFL owners to change the rule, and discouraged them from signing players who would protest.

It's all terrible news for those in favor of free speech and peaceful protest, and for those against white nationalism and police brutality.

However, Mark Geragos, the lawyer representing Kaepernick in his collusion lawsuit against the NFL, [...] believes [...] that Trump's direct influence over NFL owners on this issue violates federal law. U.S. Code 227 [which] says that members of Congress or the executive branch cannot "wrongfully influence a private entity's employment decision ... solely on the basis of partisan political affiliation".

A few revelations from the last couple of weeks strongly support Geragos' case here, and it's important to remember that Geragos knows much more about the case than we do--he has taken the depositions of more than a dozen NFL owners, while the public only knows about the depositions that have leaked.

[...] Of course, influencing the private hiring decisions of a company isn't the only part of U.S. Code [227] that needs to be proved; it would also have to be shown that Trump did it for partisan political purposes.

That sounds trickier to prove, but in this case, that's not necessarily true. First of all, Trump's comments were made at a political rally supporting an Alabama Republican candidate for US Senate--an expressly partisan environment. And according to the WSJ, Trump told Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones in private conversations that the issue was a "winning" one for him.

Previous: NFL: New National Anthem Rule; NY Jets CEO: Break the Rule and I'll Pay the Fine


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  • (Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 04 2018, @02:24AM (9 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 04 2018, @02:24AM (#688186)

    The Venn diagram of "national anthem" and "football" shows zero overlap.
    Same deal with "employer" and "national anthem".
    To get an intersection requires that you add "stupid".

    This anthem silliness in which you nationalists so revel could be eliminated entirely from these events with absolutely no change in the sport of football.
    From the starting kickoff to the final gun, everything would remain the same.

    Anything that happens on the field between those 2 events (which is what an actual sports fan came for) is unchanged.
    Now, if you want dancing girls and bad singers and airplane flyovers and any other nonsense, stay home and pull up YouTube.
    ...or do that stupid shit out in the parking lot before the game.

    As has been mentioned upthread, forced patriotism completely misses the point.

    -- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]

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  • (Score: 2) by AthanasiusKircher on Monday June 04 2018, @02:57AM (4 children)

    by AthanasiusKircher (5291) on Monday June 04 2018, @02:57AM (#688197) Journal

    Note that I complete disagree with the NFL owners' decision, and I think they should allow players to act how they think appropriate during the anthem. HOWEVER, from a legal standpoint (as much as I hate to admit it), Mr. Buzzard has a point.

    Anything that happens on the field between those 2 events (which is what an actual sports fan came for) is unchanged.

    That isn't anywhere near the legal standard for what employers may be able to do. Are the players in their uniforms before the clock of the game starts functioning as official representatives for their employer (the team)? Are they required to be there as part of their job? Yeah, probably.

    And yes, employers can certainly choose to restrict the way you express yourself when you're participating in an official job function (even it's not what the "fans" care about) as a representative of who you work for. (Increasingly, legally employers have demonstrated they have the power to even fire you on the basis of how you express yourself publicly outside of your job... a trend I find questionable in some situations -- but we don't even need to go there for this case.)

    Bottom line: unless there's something in the player's contract that grants him free speech rights explicitly, there's likely no legal thing preventing an employer for fining or otherwise punishing a player. Some may find it morally repugnant for players to be punished in this case, in which case, you are certainly able to use your free speech rights to disagree with the NFL or Trump or whomever you want.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 04 2018, @06:48AM (3 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 04 2018, @06:48AM (#688256)

      The owners could just as easily have said that they are going to stop with the anthem nonsense.

      If the crowd expects a pre-game song, they could have chosen a different song.
      I suggest This land is your land, This land is my land. [woodyguthrie.org]

      I'd especially like them to sing the whole thing, in particular the part that says

      As I went walking I saw a sign there
      And on the sign it said "No Trespassing".
      But on the other side it didn't say nothing,
      That side was made for you and me.

      I'd like to see them try that sing-it-all thing with The Star Spangled Banner.
      Did you know that Francis Scott Key was a slaveholder?
      Did you know that Key's poem is a racist celebration of slavery? [googleusercontent.com] (orig) [theintercept.com]

      No refuge could save the hireling and slave
      From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
      And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
      O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

      Just as the Union Army took Black enlistees seeking to fight against the pro-slavery side 1861 - 1865, the British Army in The War of 1812 accepted slaves whom they had freed and allowed them to be trained as combatants to fought against the pro-slavery side (USA).
      That lot was the "slave" which Key was calling out for special brutality.

      -- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @01:25AM (2 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @01:25AM (#688676)

        All we need is rainbows and unicorns. Tell you what chief, when you save up your pennies and buy a NFL team, feel free to sing "Somewhere over the Rainbow" for all I care. Until then, tough shit if you don't like their rules. The rest of your post was just irrelevant gibberish meant to make a lefty feel good about virtue signalling.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @03:03AM (1 child)

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @03:03AM (#688700)

          I have no interest in professional sports.
          I've previously mentioned the heinous plantation model in use there.
          I've also mentioned billionaire team owners wanting a stadium built for them at city taxpayers expense.
          Round up the lot of them and load them on the B-Ark.

          In particular, I hate football of all stripes.
          It's a brutal sport[1], ranking down there with boxing and that other beat-the-hell-out-of-a-dude savagery that has somehow come to be called a "sport".

          [1] Ever hear George Carlin's comparison of baseball and football?

          Now, being a Socialist, the ownership model that does strike me as not being completely horrible, is Green Bay's thing.
          (From what I hear, in many ways[2], Wisconsin rocks.)

          [2] Milwaukee has had several Socialists elected to city government.
          Madison has a bunch of cooperatives.

          -- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @01:17PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @01:17PM (#688832)

            I've previously mentioned the heinous plantation model in use there.

            That's your interpretation of the model. I would argue it is a military model. Players are drafted prior to the playing season and trained intensively to work as a team. Players are traded (transferred/PCS) to other units which fit their talents during the duration of their contract/enlistment, although free agency somewhat mitigates that. And finally players are PAID for their efforts.

            I've also mentioned billionaire team owners wanting a stadium built for them at city taxpayers expense.

            And if taxpayers are stupid enough to bite, it's somehow the owners at fault? You see taxpayers sometimes have different desires than socialist outcasts and misfits. Sometimes, they want a professional football team near them. Sometimes business owners want the income that flows from a nearby team. Just because you don't want it doesn't mean that the other taxpayers can't.

            In particular, I hate football of all stripes.

            I'm not surprised. I don't much care for professional sports either, except hockey and F1 auto racing. From your apparent hatred though, I'd say you took a few too many swirlies in the locker room at high school.

            Milwaukee has had several Socialists elected to city government.

            Milwaukee: home to Jeffrey Dahmer. If you needed to give Wisconsin an enema, Milwaukee is where you'd have to shove the tube.

  • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Monday June 04 2018, @08:42AM (3 children)

    by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Monday June 04 2018, @08:42AM (#688290) Homepage
    > The Venn diagram of "national anthem" and "football" shows zero overlap.

    Demonstrably completely false - it's right there in black and white in their official policy statements and operations manuals.

    Whether it *ought* to be that way is another matter, but whether you like it or not, it is that way. You've confused your opinion with, and presented it as, fact.
    --
    Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 04 2018, @10:19AM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 04 2018, @10:19AM (#688302)

      Ask a referee if what happens when the ball isn't in play qualifies as "football".
      I'm quite certain he will say NO.

      What you described is "business" or, as already mentioned, forced patriotism.
      It has NOTHING to do with moving the ball between end zones.
      (I played in football games when I was a kid and the national anthem was NEVER involved.)

      -- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @01:28AM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @01:28AM (#688678)

        I'm sure you have a whole wall full of participation trophies too. Did you even keep score?

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @03:17AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 05 2018, @03:17AM (#688703)

          Pick-up games, dude.
          No uniforms, no pads.
          I was puny for my age until I was about 12.
          Before long, I learned that it was a brutal game.

          As a kid, Daddy had his collarbone broken playing football in the same mode.
          My older brother was always big for his age but Daddy wouldn't let him sign up for football teams.

          -- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]