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posted by
martyb
on Thursday July 26 2018, @08:01AM
from the if-it-walks-like-a-duck,-sinks-like-a-duck,-oh,-wait... dept.
from the if-it-walks-like-a-duck,-sinks-like-a-duck,-oh,-wait... dept.
The Los Angeles Times reports:
The duck boat that sank in a Missouri lake last week, killing 17 people, was built based on a design by a self-taught entrepreneur who had no engineering training, according to court records reviewed by the Los Angeles Times.
The designer, entrepreneur Robert McDowell, completed only two years of college and had no background, training or certification in mechanics when he came up with the design for "stretch" duck boats more than two decades ago, according to a lawsuit filed over a roadway disaster in Seattle involving a similar duck boat in 2015.
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Duck Boat in Missouri Disaster was Designed by Entrepreneur With no Engineering Training
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(Score: 4, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Thursday July 26 2018, @11:34AM (8 children)
Agreed, the boat operators had plenty of history and knowledge of the vessel and its characteristics.
I've taken tourist rides in converted freight train cars with seats made of 2x10 lumber, I'm sure there was a certain lack of pedigree in the designer's background, but the tour operator wasn't barreling us down 30 degree inclines at 70 miles per hour - they were operating their vehicle in a safe manner for its design, condition and environment. I'd expect engineering degrees from someone designing a 70mph roller coaster, but not a tour train that tops out at 20mph, and usually operates closer to 7mph.
The rough waters of the lake during that storm would have been a problem to any tour boat, if the tour boat was designed like a North Atlantic life-pod for a cruise ship - nobody would take the tour. It's first up to the captain, and second up to the tour company who hires the captain, to operate their vessels in a safe manner.
I am a little surprised that so many people failed to put on personal floatation and ride the storm out on their vests - that, and getting caught by the weather, would seem to fall on the captain.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by Weasley on Thursday July 26 2018, @02:45PM (4 children)
What good does a personal flotation device do if you're trapped in the boat? At least I assume that must be the case. Could there have been that many people on the boat that can't swim?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 26 2018, @03:29PM (1 child)
From what I've seen, many (most? all?) of the victims fall into a particular demographic of people who aren't good at swimming.
Racial/Ethnic Disparities in Fatal Unintentional Drowning Among Persons Aged ≤29 Years — United States, 1999–2010 [cdc.gov]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 26 2018, @10:27PM
I thought their afros would help them float?
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 26 2018, @04:15PM
It's one thing to swim in calm water, but quite another to do so during a storm. Yes, if you were trapped under the boat you'd be screwed, but if you weren't a life jacket would help even a good swimmer. You really want all the help you can get.
Admittedly, most of my experience is on the great lakes and not smaller ones... but a good captain is supposed to ensure that everyone on board gets their life jackets ready at the first sign of bad weather. I don't mean when the waves start to get bad, I mean when you first notice a storm on a horizon or hear about it over the radio. The winds and chop show up before the actual storm does, and if you aren't ready you might not have the chance to get ready depending on the strength of the storm.
Saying "nah, we don't need it" is how you end up with these people in the water and all the life jackets in the boat. Not a good situation, and they probably wouldn't have made it worse had they been worn.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Thursday July 26 2018, @04:32PM
There's a video online of the whole ordeal - I haven't seen it, but from what I've heard it took quite a while between when it was obvious there was a serious problem and when the boat started going down.
Even if you can't swim, a PFD will float you face up. A great captain wouldn't have been caught out by the storm. An adequate captain would have recognized he was screwed and gotten everyone into their PFDs before it started getting bad.
Now, if people don't heed the call to abandon ship, there's not much a captain can do, but when it started looking bad enough to go down, I'd have gotten out a rope and told the strongest swimmers to take the end and swim away from the boat, and had the floaters jump in after them. But, not every disaster story goes well, and just because you've been a captain for 16 years doesn't mean you're not capable of panic.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 26 2018, @04:40PM
Actually, the first question to ask is: Why was the boat on the water during the storm?
Where I live, all the boats are required to leave the lake in case of storm warning. And in modern times, it's not exactly that storms catch you by surprise. There's always a sufficient warning period to get off the lake.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 26 2018, @10:05PM (1 child)
> I'd expect engineering degrees from someone designing a 70mph roller coaster
And you might be disappointed. I've read a personally published memoir by a leading roller coaster designer (published by photocopy) who designed a number of large rides for Disney, Six Flags, etc. Don't think he has any degrees at all. It includes his engineering calculations which stop at simple particle physics (like calculating accelerations for turns of different radii and speed). Nothing but the most basic of stress calculations, no fatigue calculations or experiments. If these rides were reliable it's because they were wildly overbuilt (not a bad thing, but not what I expected to be reading).
This guy's career was in the 60s-80s, things may have changed in the amusement ride business since then?
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Friday July 27 2018, @12:25AM
Well, when I say degrees, I'd rather have actual practical knowledge than degrees any day. I know far too many engineers who essentially purchased their degrees and can't explain much less perform an integral to save their lives.
I knew an engineer with zero college who did metalwork design, knew his cad inside and out, could calculate a load with the best of 'em. That was in the '90s, I think the may have been the last of his kind - so many degreed engineers out of work who can get the job first, especially in big corporations which demand such things.
🌻🌻 [google.com]