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posted by martyb on Monday August 27 2018, @02:50PM   Printer-friendly
from the Phineas-Taylor-Barnum's-Progeny dept.

When they're not potentially infectious, they have extraordinary health claims.

The maker of wide-ranging "water-based homeopathic medicines" has recalled 32 products marketed to children and infants due to microbial contamination, according to an announcement posted on the Food and Drug Administration's website this week.

The announcement does not provide any specifics about the contamination or potential risks. However, the North Carolina-based manufacturer behind the recall, King Bio, issued a similar announcement back in July. At that time, the company recalled three other products after an FDA inspection found batches contaminated with the bacteria Pseudomonas brenneri, Pseudomonas fluorescens, and Burkholderia multivorans.

Pseudomonas brenneri is a bacterium recently found in natural mineral waters, and its clinical significance is murky. However, Pseudomonas fluorescens is known to be an opportunistic pathogen, causing blood infections, and Burkholderia multivorans can cause infections in people with compromised immune systems and cystic fibrosis. It was also recently found to be a rare but emerging cause of meningitis.

[...] UPDATE 8/24/2018: King Bio updated its website to include a note about the recall. The company wrote that: "Within the past two weeks, microbial contamination was discovered in two children's products, but as an added measure of caution, we chose to recall all the children's products manufactured from August 2015 to August 2018." It added that no injuries or illnesses have been reported to date.

Source: https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/08/massive-recall-of-homeopathic-kids-products-spotlights-dubious-health-claims/


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  • (Score: 3, Funny) by DannyB on Monday August 27 2018, @05:49PM (9 children)

    by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Monday August 27 2018, @05:49PM (#727022) Journal

    No, it really is just water,

    It might be effective for ailments such as thirst.

    the chance that you'll have even one molecule of the diluted thing left at the end of the process is rather vanishingly small.

    But . . . they claim there is some kind of "molecular memory". At least that is what I read on Ars a couple years ago. Of course, no explanation of how this molecular memory might work is forthcoming. Does the active ingredient somehow leave tiny sticky notes on the water molecules it comes into contact with?

    --
    People today are educated enough to repeat what they are taught but not to question what they are taught.
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  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 27 2018, @06:10PM (4 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 27 2018, @06:10PM (#727042)

    No, its that if you actually check the final solution carefully enough there are very low amounts of the original ingredients remaining. At some point the concentration plateaus because its all aggregating in bubbles at the top or sticking to the walls, or something.

    The assumptions used for the chem 101 debunking do not hold so it is just as retarded as saying "water memory". Its idiots on all sides of this debate.

    • (Score: 2) by ikanreed on Monday August 27 2018, @06:21PM (2 children)

      by ikanreed (3164) Subscriber Badge on Monday August 27 2018, @06:21PM (#727053) Journal
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 28 2018, @11:12AM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 28 2018, @11:12AM (#727299)

        No it really is the exact same thing of comign up with a bunch of assumptions that do not at all apply to the real life situation and then drawing conclusiosn about whats going on based on what can be deduced from those assumptions. I see zero difference between the two "sides" regarding homeopathy.

        The only people making progress on that issue are those who actually collected data on whether this procedure really results in the theoretically calculated dilution rate. Those are the good, scientific people we should praise.

    • (Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 27 2018, @11:47PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 27 2018, @11:47PM (#727174)

      if you actually check the final solution

      Godwinned!

  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by ikanreed on Monday August 27 2018, @06:18PM

    by ikanreed (3164) Subscriber Badge on Monday August 27 2018, @06:18PM (#727049) Journal

    Water memory is a classic "glue the word quantum to this thing that's been shown to be bullshit, and now's it's true again" stuff.

    Their argument is that the water retains the inverse entangled state of the thing put in the water by virtue of being exposed to it and interacting on the particle level. The state then spreads out among the water somehow also quantum entanglementy. This then makes the water have the opposite properties of the original molecule.

    This has the following really really obvious problems.
    1. That's not how entanglement works. You can just put two things in the same flask and declare them entangled.
    2. That's not how entanglement works. Their next interaction with anything would erase any entanglement.
    3. That's not how entanglement works. Entangled electron pairs have opposite spin, but not a lot else has any relationship.
    4. That's not how entanglement works, it doesn't spread like a virus, it's a state that goes away.
    5. That's not how medicine works. You don't give people the opposite of what's afflicting them to fix problems. "Shove the burn victim in the freezer"
    6. That's not how medicine works. Almost all homeopathic remedies are oral, how do you even get them to the affected zone, even if they have the right properties to fix the problem.

  • (Score: 2) by requerdanos on Monday August 27 2018, @07:07PM (2 children)

    by requerdanos (5997) Subscriber Badge on Monday August 27 2018, @07:07PM (#727078) Journal

    But . . . they claim there is some kind of "molecular memory".

    If so, wouldn't the water remember all those times it was down in the raw sewage tank at the water treatment plant? That has happened to the water molecules, on average, a lot more times than being magically potentized through abracadabra sucussion.

    • (Score: 2) by DannyB on Monday August 27 2018, @07:15PM (1 child)

      by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Monday August 27 2018, @07:15PM (#727087) Journal

      I suppose they could argue that it would make the water even more beneficial.

      --
      People today are educated enough to repeat what they are taught but not to question what they are taught.
      • (Score: 2) by requerdanos on Monday August 27 2018, @08:00PM

        by requerdanos (5997) Subscriber Badge on Monday August 27 2018, @08:00PM (#727111) Journal

        Problem is, if like cures like, then with this water they would be cured of being full of a certain mushy brown smelly substance and could no longer tout the benefits of their wares. It's a paradox.