SoylentNews is people
SoylentNews
from the EVs-are-making-a-charge-on-ICEs dept.
The BMW i3 has been on sale since 2014, and in that time, BMW has seen fit to expand its battery size and, by proxy, its range. For the 2019 model year, it's getting yet another battery upgrade, and it's a big one.
The 2019 BMW i3 will come with a 42.2-kWh battery (120 amp-hours), which should permit for up to 153 miles of all-electric driving. This is a roughly 30 percent improvement over the previous 94-Ah battery, which allowed for 115 miles of range. The i3's first battery was just 60 Ah, offering a range of just 81 miles. Oh, how far we've come.
BMW will offer the battery in both variants of the i3. The standard i3 uses a 170-horsepower electric motor, powerful enough to get the little EV to 60 mph in just 7.2 seconds. The i3s, on the other hand, is the sportier trim, offering a 181-hp electric motor and a 6.8-second sprint to 60.
Will EVs (electric vehicles) like this succeed in replacing ICEs (internal combustion engines) as commuter cars?
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Saturday September 29 2018, @08:24PM (10 children)
It's not "don't drain below 20% capacity, don't charge above 80%,", instead, it's don't do that every day.
Outliers, the average commute is 15 miles each way.
I also think the age of your cars are outliers.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday September 29 2018, @11:24PM (9 children)
I also think the claims of 2000 cycles are going to prove to be outliers in the real world. As for my outlier ICE vehicles, that's mostly attributable to living close to work - when your daily commute is under 4 miles each way, the daily driver doesn't spin the odometer too quickly through the years.
I have been dealing with all forms of rechargeable battery tech for my entire life. In certain well controlled use cases batteries can out-perform the manufacturer's "typical" recharge cycle lifetime claims. In the real world, where batteries might be stored in a hot place, where discharge to flat might happen once in a while, where rechargers aren't as smart as they could be, where any one of a thousand other things can happen to throw off the ideal circumstances, rechargeable batteries very often do fail to live up to their "typical" recharge cycles as claimed by the manufacturer.
This has been true of all forms of lead-acid (liquid, AGM, gel, etc.), NiMh were some of the worst, and puffy LiPo happens way faster than it should. I just ordered a replacement for a pack that's barely 4 years and 50 recharge cycles old - puffed up to the point it looks like it's going to split. I read on the one hand how LiFePO4 is "different, bulletproof" and then in the moment you read about how they're catching motorcycles on fire, even with specialized charging regulation in place.
Bottom line: when my $100 AGM cell goes bad after 3 years, I shrug it off and buy another. When a $20K battery system does the same, three days after the manufacturer's warranty expires... I'm just not going to put myself in that position.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Sunday September 30 2018, @03:03PM (8 children)
In the real world, batteries on Teslas are holding up very well. Perhaps it is due to the thermal and electrical management preventing damage to the batteries.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Sunday September 30 2018, @04:07PM (7 children)
I think the thermal management is a big part of the key, and I question whether or not the systems are engineered to be able to deal with the sub-tropics (Florida, Texas...) or if they're just taking a hit on the increased warranty claims and paying them out.
As for how well the Teslas are doing - how many have caught fire so far? (Extreme examples of thermal management failure :) Not many, but per-mile-driven I think much higher than the gasoline powered competition, and certainly way higher than diesel.
The tech has to get to the point that it stops blaming user error on early battery failure and starts "just working" for people who don't do much more than drain the system then plug it in to charge it. Maybe Tesla and the others have made it there, at least for most climates. But, when the ambient temp is 50C (122F) as it can easily be nearly every day for months on end in an enclosed garage or on a sun-baked tarmac, how well does that thermal management system cope?
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Sunday September 30 2018, @04:43PM (6 children)
I will confess that I cannot be sure about this, but I think that the number of fires in which there was not some kind of mechanical issue (accident, hit object on the road, etc.) is zero or close to it.
The batteries are required (at least in CA) to have a long warranty. There are a few outliers that Tesla has replaced, but for the most part (including in hot states), the batteries are holding up very well.
Temperature is more of an issue when combined with 100% state of charge. So as long as you are not charging to 100% routinely, it should not normally be an issue. With a 250 mile (or more range), there are very few days that most drivers will need to charge to 100%, and on those days, the car will be driven, so it won't stay at 100% very long.
Everyone can describe outliers for whom electric cars are not suitable, but for people who live in a single-family home, with access to charging at home, they are very convenient. My boss lives on a boat and he drives a Model S.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday October 01 2018, @12:11PM (5 children)
This just in: a friend with a 7 year old Lexus hybrid (10 year nominal battery life, $5K replacement cost), had an early failure of her battery pack at 5 years of age. Dealer replaced, not sure the cost, anyway, on the drive home last night she got a "stop vehicle immediately" light on the dash, apparently the 2 year old $5K battery pack also has a problem.
Now, if ever there was a "blame the user" scenario, she's probably it - anecdote: kids left an unwrapped candy bar in the car overnight, while parked in the dirt under a big oak tree - major ant infestation in the morning... parks outside in the sun both at home and work, etc. On the other hand, she also isn't intentionally abusing the battery beyond driving the last 10 miles home rather than stopping and calling for a tow... for example: they took bikes to the grocery store after getting the car home.
N of 1, but probably less than a 1SD outlier on the "lacking mechanical empathy" curve.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Monday October 01 2018, @04:50PM (3 children)
This just in, it might not have been a battery failure:
https://jalopnik.com/the-dealer-wanted-4-400-to-fix-his-hybrid-he-did-it-h-1685721487 [jalopnik.com]
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday October 01 2018, @09:34PM (2 children)
Early reports from unreliable sources are notoriously: unreliable.
She did have to replace the battery at 5 years, and at this point I believe the battery is out of warranty for her - didn't get details of cost to her at the time.
This "stop driving immediately" warning last night was diagnosed this morning by the mechanics as a master cylinder failure: $3400.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Monday October 01 2018, @11:44PM (1 child)
So, she got one new battery problem solved under warranty and since then, no battery problems?
$3400 for a master cylinder? That sounds insane.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday October 02 2018, @02:44AM
Remember: Lexus (aka license to rape customers in the service department.)
I don't know how the first battery failure at 50% of projected lifetime was handled, I do know that she was afraid that this was a repeat (same message as the battery failure), and that it doesn't really matter if it's a $5K battery or a $3400 master cylinder, it's starting to smell citrus-y in that car.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Monday October 01 2018, @04:55PM
In CA, her replacement battery would probably have been covered under the warranty (10 years, 150,000 miles)
https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/resources/fact-sheets/california-vehicle-and-emissions-warranty-periods [ca.gov]
Batteries are a good example of something for which insurance makes sense: failure is an unlikely event that has huge cost implications. Insurance spreads the risk so that no individual gets a huge, unplanned bill.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory