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Volkswagen (VOWG_p.DE) intends to sell electric cars for less than 20,000 euros ($22,836) and protect German jobs by converting three factories to make Tesla (TSLA.O) rivals, a source familiar with the plans said.
VW and other carmakers are struggling to adapt quickly enough to stringent rules introduced after the carmaker was found to have cheated diesel emissions tests, with its chief executive Herbert Diess warning last month that Germany's auto industry faces extinction.
Plans for VW's electric car, known as "MEB entry" and with a production volume of 200,000 vehicles, are due to be discussed at a supervisory board meeting on Nov. 16, the source said.
Fallout from cheating on diesel emissions tests continues. If German automakers, of which VW is the largest, switch to electric vehicles (EVs), will other car companies have to follow suit?
(Score: 2) by deimtee on Saturday November 10 2018, @05:22AM (6 children)
I was more addressing the blackout comment. I think economical power storage is going to have far reaching effects beyond electric cars. Like it or not, solar power and storage are slowly getting cheaper and oil dearer. Eventually it will hit a tipping point and I think we will end up with a much more distributed combined generation/storage system.
Instead of gas stations, you might have a couple of acres of solar cells and energy storage, paid charging slots, and a coffee shop to wait in while your car charges. Seems like a reasonable proposition out along the highways where land can be cheap.
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 2) by legont on Saturday November 10 2018, @06:14AM (5 children)
Historically, changes were different. For example, oil revolution happened in addition to existing technologies - horses and wale oil. Fossil fuels added to the existing capacity. Nobody tried to forcibly switch old to new. Now it is different. New technology adepts are using unfair business practices and government support trying to replace the old. Power grid needs all the customers to function. If solar or whatever takes even 10-20% of the old system, the old one will die while the new system is not proven to function well enough. I'd have no problem if solar would take new business - new energy consumption - but it is stealing existing business. Replacing existing one should come later. Starting with robbing existing infrastructure is a receipt for a disaster.
"Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by deimtee on Saturday November 10 2018, @11:06AM (2 children)
Yep. Not really arguing with unfair support at the moment. But I think that the trends are that pretty soon it would have happened anyway without forced incentives. Maybe not as fast, but it would still have happened.
I think we will soon have .Gov propping up power companies, and probably legislating to stop people going off grid. 'Support for Infrastructure Bill' or something similar that requires you to stay connected to the grid and pay the fees. And the fees will keep rising.
Interestingly, here in AU, technically the way the law governing utilities was originally written, the power company can come in and put a meter on your own generator and charge you for the power you generate. They did not expect that people would ever generate their own power.
They never have yet because the backlash would be huuuuge, but I can easily see them claiming you are not allowed to disconnect.
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 2) by legont on Sunday November 11 2018, @12:09AM (1 child)
They - power companies - have a point, I think, and our ancestors thought about it carefully.
"Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.
(Score: 2) by deimtee on Sunday November 11 2018, @12:04PM
I don't understand your comment here. What point and which ancestors?
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 2) by rleigh on Saturday November 10 2018, @01:24PM (1 child)
If you look at history, Standard Oil did a number of rather dodgy things to force the adoption of oil and motorised transport. Later government policy encouraged it with the development of motorways and interstate systems etc. These actions displaced the previous systems, some forcibly through legistation and sharp business practices.
I can't see much difference with this change. The technology is here, and the infrastructure is being slowly rolled out. It's not yet ready for universal adoption, and won't be for a good while until we have the electrical generation and distribution capacity to match. But it's coming is an inevitability. Just like haymaking and distribution was once of great concern to driving our economies and feeding us, oil product manufacture and distribution will eventually decline as well. The legislation in progress to e.g. ban diesel in cities and eventually sale of diesel cars is harsh, but necessary given the problems we face. Is that any different than the banning of horse-drawn vehicles from fast roads?
The points about the electricial grid being a single point of failure are well made. We do need independence in case of failure. Be it diesel or other fuel generators, solar panels, wind or whatever you can make work for you. Important buildings already have this capability in place for short-term failure, but we are already mostly entirely reliant on a functional grid, and it's not realistic for all of us to go off-grid. The point about distributed storage is also well made. It may well be that car batteries themselves are part of that solution, as well as PowerWall type domestic storage systems.
(Score: 2) by legont on Sunday November 11 2018, @12:06AM
Company I work for has large headquarters in Manhattan and we produce our own electricity using fuel cells. Yes, we burn fossils for electricity right in the middle of the island.
The reason is that it is cheaper than to pay for grid electricity plus to have backup generators. We, however, still attached to the grid in case of emergency.
Now, look at it from the power company point of view where cheap electricity especially a reliable kind is a matter of scale which we reduce. If I were their boss, I would not give us emergency power.
Here is the punch line: imagine Lehman Brothers bankruptcy and all the follow up because it was refused power. That's where we are now.
"Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.