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posted by martyb on Friday February 22 2019, @05:18AM   Printer-friendly
from the keep-your-friends-close-and-your-enemies-closer? dept.

An article at vice.com reports The Number of U.S. Hate Groups Keeps Surging, Largely Thanks to Young, White men:

The number of hate groups nationwide reached a record high in 2018, driven partly by the persistent growth of white nationalist groups catering to young, college-aged men.

There are currently 1,020 active hate groups in America — up from 954 in 2017, and 917 the previous year, according to an annual tally by the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC). The new, young face of hate emerged from the shadows during the 2016 election and organized through a shared language of memes and under the banner of the “alt-right.” Many hailed then-candidate Donald Trump, with his hard-line views on immigration, as a hero. In celebration of his election, the alt-right’s one-time de facto leader Richard Spencer led a room full of young men in suits to give Nazi salutes.

Since then, Spencer and other prominent actors, entangled in costly lawsuits and tired of being heckled by anti-fascist protesters, have faded into relative obscurity.

At the same time, groups like Identity Evropa — whose khaki-clad members were a formidable presence at the violent “Unite the Right” rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, in August 2017— have proliferated and expanded their reach by setting up new chapters across the country. Patriot Front also grew significantly in 2018 after splintering from Vanguard America, the group linked to the 19-year-old neo-Nazi who rammed his car into a crowd of protesters during the Charlottesville rally and killed Heather Heyer.


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  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by deimtee on Friday February 22 2019, @08:14AM (20 children)

    by deimtee (3272) on Friday February 22 2019, @08:14AM (#804940) Journal

    They're also wrong to feel attacked at all. I'm straight, white, cisgender (which just means not trans), and male and I never feel aggrieved for any of it. Why don't I feel like my identity is constantly under assault? The people who feel like they are, they're trapped in a sort of reverse plot to the movie They Live. They're going through life with glasses which make the real world--the benign, non-hostile, mostly safe and friendly, world--seem alien and malicious.

    If you are posting on SN, you are probably a techy. You are very literate. You probably have a pretty good job, with good prospects for the future and significant assets.

    The guys joining up with these groups are not. They are struggling to hold a shitty job, if they are working at all. They are constantly told they have all these advantages, and that they should easily be successful. When they aren't it feels like a personal attack. When you constantly call someone a loser they get pissed off.
    It isn't that their identity is under attack, it is that they don't fit into the privileged caricature that is projected on them.

    Affirmative action makes it worse. Even though you keep losing the race, the officials keep saying you have an advantage and moving your competitors further down the track.

    --
    If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
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  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @09:14AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @09:14AM (#804953)

    It's not just financial security. People who are in a relatively good situation but never had any authority of their own, say code monkeys, do feel attacked too.
    It's flat out wrong saying you're fragile for taking offense of blanket statements on groups that include you. Try saying that you can't be lumped with the lot because you've heard all during your millenial education about equality of sexes and people and anyway you've never been in a situation to actively discriminate against someone because you've always been a subordinate with no say in whatever matter and hear the retorts coming. they all come down to:
    You're blinded by your own hubris, you've been a shitty person without knowing it. And even if you're not, being rigorous in our statements instead of accusing the whole lot of cishet white males would detract from the fiery passion in our cries, so we'll keep doing it.
    It's like being stuck in some class about how to use ms word. Even if you haven't used it before you got it in one hour tops, but the schedule is 5 to 7 every day forever. If you've ever dealt with cults or the like, trite repetition like that can give you actual headaches.
    I get that it's hard to get the struggle you're not living, but it's insulting when your education to inequality issues began as soon as kindergarten and never stopped, to assume one can't possibly have done the work to understand in about twenty years.
    When you keep shouting abuse at someone who has yielded there's not much that can happen. Either they're submissive and take it, they're agressive and echo your tribalism to riposte or they grow to stop caring about both sides of the conflict.
    Maybe I'm a bitter wreck of a person but the only choice I see before me is hate myself, hate people that aren't like me or hate everyone else but me.

  • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @11:05AM (9 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @11:05AM (#804971)

    It isn't that their identity is under attack, it is that they don't fit into the privileged caricature that is projected on them.

    I didn't realize that spittoon-gargling redneck was a "privileged caricature". I learn something new every day here on SN.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by deimtee on Friday February 22 2019, @11:30AM (8 children)

      by deimtee (3272) on Friday February 22 2019, @11:30AM (#804980) Journal

      The "privileged caricature" is a Harvard-educated white male in an expensive suit who can get a high-paying job from one of his family's friends with a handshake on the golf course.

      So simply because he is a "cis white male" you project that image on some poor redneck who is struggling to keep his trailer, claim he is privileged, and then wonder why he is pissed off and threatened.

      --
      If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
      • (Score: 2, Disagree) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @02:39PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @02:39PM (#805040)

        I don't know of anyone who does that. Seems like a lack of critical thinking and taking generalizations too personally.

        • (Score: 4, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Friday February 22 2019, @08:00PM

          by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday February 22 2019, @08:00PM (#805284) Journal

          It's impressive how these folks can act like victims in a thread about how they keep murdering people and committing terrorism.

          I'd have a bit more sympathy if they hadn't spent the last 20 years blaming all Muslims for 9/11.

      • (Score: 2, Disagree) by julian on Friday February 22 2019, @08:14PM (5 children)

        by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Friday February 22 2019, @08:14PM (#805299)

        you project that image on some poor redneck who is struggling to keep his trailer, claim he is privileged, and then wonder why he is pissed off and threatened.

        He is privileged because he is white and male. That's not incorrect. It's just that his economic class is the far bigger influence on his well being. The negative effects of his poverty absolutely swamp any white or male privilege.

        So of course he votes Democrat, the only party offering him real hope and actual public policy that will improve his life. Right? He wouldn't do something crazy like vote for the other party that will further impoverish him just so he can retain his racial and gender pride. No one would be that stupid, petty, and spiteful.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @10:06PM (4 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 22 2019, @10:06PM (#805344)

          You mean you expect him to vote for the party that tells him that he should move to California and learn to program?

          Interesting..

          I would suggest he is more likely to vote for the party that tells him they want to bring back basic manufacturing jobs to america - you know - the things HE does.
          He will also probably vote for the party that protects his right to own a gun (because that makes him feel strong), and does constantly tell him that he be bad for being white and male.

          Why the fuck would he vote for the Dems?

          • (Score: 4, Informative) by Joe Desertrat on Friday February 22 2019, @11:32PM

            by Joe Desertrat (2454) on Friday February 22 2019, @11:32PM (#805379)

            I would suggest he is more likely to vote for the party that tells him they want to bring back basic manufacturing jobs to america - you know - the things HE does.

            Ha ha ha ha ha ha! Sure they TELL him that. They don't do it though, do they? The only way those jobs will come back in any quantity that matters is if the working conditions, including relative pay, fall to the standards of the places the jobs were exported to in the first place. The manufacturing may come back without that, but most of the blue collar jobs will be lost to automation.And it's the party he votes for that not only makes sure that is the way it happens (they both share guilt in this), but they also strive to eliminate the social safety nets that could buffer the loss of jobs. Then as things get worse the party he votes for continually tell him it is the fault of even poorer people. He fails to notice that they are not getting the wealth he no longer shares in, and he supports those that are now gaining that wealth. But oh, they get to have guns, a fairly useless benefit. Feeling safe from imaginary fears is of little real value.

            Things have been steadily getting worse in the US for the middle and lower classes since the "Reagan Revolution", and will only continue to do so as long as long as Republican thoughts and ideals remain in practice.

          • (Score: 5, Informative) by julian on Friday February 22 2019, @11:44PM (2 children)

            by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Friday February 22 2019, @11:44PM (#805385)

            You mean you expect him to vote for the party that tells him that he should move to California and learn to program?

            Democrats aren't saying this. This is literally a right wing troll meme on Twitter dot com directed at out of work journalists.

            I would suggest he is more likely to vote for the party that tells him they want to bring back basic manufacturing jobs to america

            This is a lie, but I can't blame some people for falling for it. These jobs didn't leave America; they left the Earth, they're leaving humanity. In the last century we outsourced them to the first generation of robots, Chinese people, and now we are rolling out the second generation which are actual mechanical robots. The jobs aren't coming back, but the manufacturing is.

            He will also probably vote for the party that protects his right to own a gun (because that makes him feel strong)

            Well, I can't really argue with that. If he wants to keep a firm grip on his penis...I mean gun, to feel "strong" then he's welcome. He'll have plenty of time to spend with his guns since he'll remain unemployed and useless to our oligarchic economy since he was terrible at life priorities and continued to vote for the party that would rather feed his hatred than his belly.

            and does constantly tell him that he be bad for being white and male.

            I just never see this, and I'm a white male so I think I would notice. He should take off the "They Live" glasses of imagined white victimhood.

            • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 23 2019, @06:16AM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 23 2019, @06:16AM (#805485)

              You mean you expect him to vote for the party that tells him that he should move to California and learn to program?

              Democrats aren't saying this. This is literally a right wing troll meme on Twitter dot com directed at out of work journalists.

              You do know why it is a right-wing troll meme don't you?
              There was some guy teaching a very few coal miners to code after they were laid off. Good on him and great for those who can learn to code.
              The shitty side came when anti-coal journalists started telling all the laid-off workers "learn to code". Throwing it back at the journalists when they in turn were laid off was predictable and justified.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 24 2019, @11:01AM

              by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 24 2019, @11:01AM (#805897)

              Oh, where exactly is China if it's not on Earth?

  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Nuke on Friday February 22 2019, @11:42AM (8 children)

    by Nuke (3162) on Friday February 22 2019, @11:42AM (#804982)

    This (deimtee's post) is absolutely right.

    I am a well-to-do straight white male, qualified with a good safe technical job, and I believe I am good at it. I have all the things I want. However I remain capable of recognising that a poor young white male can feel at the bottom of western society because in fact they are. TV, advertising and the media are constantly drumming in that white straight males are the villains of society, past and present, and surveys show that young white males are the least happy members of western society. It is axiomatic that TV dramas cast them as the losers in the plots with usually a loud black man scoring with the most attractive white girl and the white guy left looking like a geeky twisted incel who is eventually sent back to his basement computer, chess playing, or model railway building*.

    Western politicians need to step back and look at what is going on. To ignore or (worse) to try to quash these efects is as dangerous for society as when French or Russion autocrats ignored or tried to quash the discontent of the people leading up to their revolutions. They need to make positive responses, otherwise they are sitting on a time bomb.

    Even I, while I am not short of money or employment, feel somewhat like a social outcast. As an engineer keeping things running I am like a Morlock in H.G.Wells' story "The Time Machine". Wells portrayed the Morlocks as the villains but, working machinery underground, they gave a living to the Eloi, a beautiful but usless class of people who swanned around in luxury on the surface. We techies are the Morlocks.

    * My advice is give black girls a try. There seem to plenty of them and many prefer white guys and culture over black, and don't have much good to say about the latter, based on experience. They don't have the feminist outlook that many white women have adopted. Many seem to have an illegitimate child or two though, having been dumped afterwards.

    • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Friday February 22 2019, @07:19PM

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday February 22 2019, @07:19PM (#805253) Journal

      The President of the United states going "wink-wink-nudge-nuge" every time he tells whitey to stop committing acts of terror isn't helping, either.

      Why won't the President say "Radical Rightwing Terrorism?"

    • (Score: 2, Disagree) by julian on Friday February 22 2019, @08:43PM (6 children)

      by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Friday February 22 2019, @08:43PM (#805319)

      I remain capable of recognising that a poor young white male can feel at the bottom of western society because in fact they are.

      They are at the bottom of society because they are poor. The other things don't matter, and in fact, help them out. The problem is that poverty is much stronger than white privilege, so any benefit they get from being white or male is obliterated by being poor.

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 23 2019, @06:23AM (5 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 23 2019, @06:23AM (#805486)

        So why all the focus on being a white male if it is such a small effect?
        Where are all the people clamoring for affirmative action for the poor?
        Poor lives matter!!

        • (Score: 2) by julian on Saturday February 23 2019, @06:36AM (4 children)

          by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Saturday February 23 2019, @06:36AM (#805487)

          So why all the focus on being a white male

          My main point is that there is not very much focus on this at all. People falsely believe there is because they consume media which over-reports on fringe issues and rare events which play to the fear and paranoia of white conservatives. It is a combination of selection bias and the availability heuristic. Even the dreaded boogeyman of "affirmative action" barely exists in the real world in the pernicious form that conservatives bemoan. It's almost never the cause of a white/male individual's failure; it's just a convenient excuse and story used by the moneyed elites to direct blame away from themselves.

          Black immigrant women didn't take their jobs; capitalists first outsourced it to Asia and then automated it out of existence entirely.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 23 2019, @11:50AM (3 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 23 2019, @11:50AM (#805541)

            I'm not talking measurable results in the real world, but the perceptions promulgated by the media. By that measure those poor white male bastards are under attack and are responding appropriately.

            • (Score: 2) by julian on Saturday February 23 2019, @07:07PM (2 children)

              by julian (6003) Subscriber Badge on Saturday February 23 2019, @07:07PM (#805705)

              Then I suggest they find better sources of media. If they stopped watching Fox News, listening to right-wing radio, reading sites like Breitbart and The Daily Caller, then they'd stop feeling so attacked. The "white men are under attack!" coverage is coming from the far-right news sources because that drives traffic, clicks, and ad-revenue among their hypnotized audience.

              • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 24 2019, @01:21AM

                by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 24 2019, @01:21AM (#805805)

                It is not solely the right-wing media. They are the ones pointing out and exagerating the attack, but the left-wing media and popular entertainment ares the ones carrying it out.
                Take the script for almost any recent movie or TV show and do a search and replace on the characters. Swap black for white, and male for female.
                Now reread the script and tell me that there won't be violent complaints about the treatment of the female black characters.

              • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Nuke on Sunday February 24 2019, @01:01PM

                by Nuke (3162) on Sunday February 24 2019, @01:01PM (#805916)

                When in my OP I described a typical TV drama where a bitter and twisted young white incel guy ends up back in his basement while the socially-climbing black Jock hero scores it with the most attractive white girl(s) in the cast, I had in mind some recent BBC and ITV dramas. These are mainstream media, not alt-right - in fact they are often accused of left bias.

                That is the point. The main stream media is trying to brainwash us into accepting that young white guys are crap and are fair game for every kicking in the teeth and every humiliation that they get. What I am saying is that while some white guys are rolling over and lapping it up in a kind of sado-masochism, this will eventually cause a major backlash, and the alt-right glimmerings are the first sign of that reaction. Despite, being in a comfortable position myself, I can understand it - it is an inversion of what blacks were complaining about 50 years ago in the civil rights movement. Politicians and the media need to be beware.