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from the taking-swatting-to-the-next-level dept.
This weekend, Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) launched an airstrike at Hamas's Cyber HQ in an apparently first of its kind real-time physical response by a nation state targeting the source of a cyber attack (as far as we know).
The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) has launched a physical attack on Hamas in response to an alleged cyber attack. A strike launched by Israeli forces targeted a building in the Gaza Strip that was hosting Hamas cyber army.
The IDF adopted a hybrid approach, it first stopped the cyber attack carried out by Hamas, then once it [had] localized the source of the offensive launched an airstrike.
This is simultaneously an evolution in hybrid-warfare and a return to levels of physical violence in the conflict between Hamas and Israel that hasn't been seen for five years.
The United States has reserved the right to retaliate similarly against cyber attacks since 2011, but has not done so.
The US had considered kinetic responses to a cyber attack:
State-backed hacking and physical warfare have been on a slow but steady path toward convergence for about two decades, and both information security and warfare researchers say that it was only a matter of time before a nation launched a kinetic attack against enemy hackers. "When I joined the very first Cyber Command in April 1999, we were talking about that as a serious thing in case it was needed," says Jason Healey, a former staffer in the George W. Bush White House and current cyberconflict researcher at Columbia University. "I wouldn't say we necessarily had plans for it, but we were thinking it through."
That's an expensive wrench
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 08 2019, @03:24PM (13 children)
Israelis are invaders who have no right over the land of Palestine.
Israeli nuclear missiles are aimed at Europe, did you know?
(Score: 3, Interesting) by DannyB on Wednesday May 08 2019, @03:44PM (6 children)
Before May 1948, Jews lived in what was then called Palestine. And they were called . . . ta da . . . Palestinians, like everyone else.
With the stroke of a pen in the UN, the state of Israel was established. Those Jews suddenly were invaders. Wars started.
I'm not going to argue with your point of view. Please continue to hate the people of your choice.
The lower I set my standards the more accomplishments I have.
(Score: 2) by Bot on Wednesday May 08 2019, @04:09PM (3 children)
>With the stroke of a pen
IIRC it was more a kind of bending to terrorists [wikipedia.org], which can only yield fruit like this.
Venetians, for example, succumbed to gentrification with very little blood (e.g. Serenissimi protest with a tank in S. Marco), and more subtle zionists would have won by now. But it appears the objective is to have a hate generation plant, not a victory.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Wednesday May 08 2019, @04:29PM (2 children)
People will take different sides on this. Jews in some number have had a continuous presence in the land. If it were an easy problem to solve, it would have been.
The lower I set my standards the more accomplishments I have.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 08 2019, @04:47PM (1 child)
One map speaks better than many worlds http://www.worldliteraturetoday.org/sites/default/files/2012/May/palestinian-loss-of-land-1946-2010.jpg [worldliteraturetoday.org]
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Wednesday May 08 2019, @07:43PM
That is a useful map to see.
The thing that remains in my mind is that the Jews do have some claim to the land.
As for migrations, I'm not sure what can be said about that.
The lower I set my standards the more accomplishments I have.
(Score: 2) by FatPhil on Wednesday May 08 2019, @04:55PM
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
(Score: 5, Insightful) by edIII on Wednesday May 08 2019, @07:51PM
I don't hate the Jews, but you're being remarkably simplistic. The creation of Israel on top of Palestine was by no means as civil, correct, or ordered as you think. Jewish terrorists are a real thing that existed before the creation of Israel.
Jews WERE the invaders here. If it was Palestinian land before the creation of Israel, and the Palestinians were living there with their own society and autonomy, please explain the moral and ethical correctness of non-citizens thousands of miles away taking their land and autonomy from them? Before that, and before the terrorism, the Palestinians were hosting Jewish refugees from in an unarguably horrific situation in Europe. Yes, Jews just like the Palestinians have ancient and religious claims to the land. How do you determine again which group has more rights?
All I know is that Palestinian sovereignty was wholly disrespected in the formation of Israel. Once it became clear what the Palestinians lost, it started a war, which shouldn't have been a surprise to anyone. Since one side was Muslim, that made attacking that side extremely problematic because then ALL Muslims everywhere were obligated to fight in a holy war. Greatly exacerbating the situation was the presence of holy sites to both peoples, namely Jerusalem. Neither people's will accept the loss of this city, seemingly under any conditions.
Personally, both sides are disreputable to me. I've always thought the Palestinians needed to look at Ghandi and how his peaceful movement gave India back its sovereignty and autonomy from the British. Alas, instead of that we've now been trained to hate the Muslims, and they've never once stopped the holy war against the invaders in the last ~70 years now. The Jews are not much better for wholly failing to acknowledge what they did to the Palestinians, and acting like they own the place. Which is factually in dispute. As a thought experiment, how would Americans react if Nebraska was signed away to Syrian refugees by a "stroke of a pen in the UN"?
It would do the world some good to take off the blinders and acknowledge what really happened to both peoples, and try and figure out a way to move forward.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 08 2019, @06:15PM (5 children)
Not that I agree with them having the things, but, considering the past millennia of Jewish persecution from the massacre of the Jews of York, through various Pogroms in the east, then the Holocaust, if I was in their position and in possession of the things I'd be bloody targeting Europe as well.
You do know that back in the day the French nukes targetted Germany, the US, the UK as well as the Soviets? (chances are, they still do, the French being the French..)
I'd also bet there are targets in both France and Germany in the UKs list of 'places to make glow' and I'll bet the US have a number of nukes permanently targetted on 'allies' capital cities..scorched earth policies and all that in case they do have to go up against the Chinese/Russians.
Fuck knows who else (other than each other) Pakistan and India target, but I'll bet Pakistan have targets in Israel and India have a few in China.
(and I'll bet that all of the above have targets in Switzerland, just to teach the smug bastards a lesson...)
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 08 2019, @07:31PM (4 children)
Prove to me that such a thing happened. That same thing has been used over and over again to commit war crimes and terrorism. Repeating lies does not make them true.
But given that Stalin is said to have said something similar to: "a lie repeated often enough becomes the truth".
You hear so much about an event that never happened that you do not even question its existence and attack anyone who suggests otherwise. Media is powerful, and the enemy owns it.
(Score: 2) by fyngyrz on Wednesday May 08 2019, @11:36PM (3 children)
Holocaust images that have been around for many decades [google.com] long before image editing was a thing — you could easily find them in any history book, printed long, long ago. Or, you know, just search for them, as I did for you.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 09 2019, @08:16AM (2 children)
There is a Red Cross report from just after the war when they were investigating the camps. They estimated that as many as 250,000 people died in the camps including all deaths from disease and malnutrition as well as executions.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by fyngyrz on Thursday May 09 2019, @02:57PM (1 child)
Also numerous soldier's biographies. And trial records.
Someone (who is a prolific shitposter, so perhaps they would know) told me I had been trolled by the above "what Holocaust?" post. Possibly so. Because it is difficult for me to comprehend the level of ignorance that would allow anyone with even the slightest grasp of history to take such a stance. But. We see other examples of profound ignorance here on a regular basis. So... yeah. Could have been either one.
I have to admit that when I see people trying to rewrite history to excuse or deny such horrors, I am more than a little tweaked. If we cannot maintain as accurate as possible a view of our past, we will be less able to learn from it. Troll or not, people as the above are complicit. As trolls, mindfully so, which may actually be worse. Assholes, one and all.
--
Co-worker: "Good morning!"
Me: "You need to seriously calm down."
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 09 2019, @11:16PM
One of the main reasons for holocaust denialism is it has become the Israeli answer to any criticism. People see it being used cynically and start disbelieving it.
"Why are you bombing Palestinians?" - "but Holocaust you anti-semite."
"Why are you stealing Palestinian land?" - "but Holocaust you anti-semite."
"Why are you systematically draining Palestinian water wells?" - "but Holocaust you anti-semite."
Overuse something and it loses its effectiveness. People are tired of being told that they have to make special allowances for certain people because of what some unrelated people did to other unrelated people 75 years ago on the other side of the world.
Did the holocaust happen ? yes.
Was it bad? yes.
How old is anybody who was complicit? At least 92 (if they were 18 when the war finished).
Is it worth chasing them? No.
How many people were killed? about 11,000,000.
How many of them were Jews? about 6,000,000.
Why are the others forgotten?
Why is the holocaust so much worse than the long march, which killed 50,000,000, or Stalin's purges which killed 20,000,000, or the killing fields which killed 3,000,000?