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from the cue-music:-"I-always-feel-that-somebody's-watching-me" dept.
Mercedes spies on drivers by secretly installing tracking devices in cars and passing information to
Submitted via IRC for FatPhil
Mercedes has sparked a privacy row by admitting it spies on drivers with tracking devices covertly installed in its cars. The secret sensors, fitted to all new and used motors sold by the firm's dealers, pinpoint the vehicle's exact location.
The firm sold more than 170,000 new cars in Britain alone last year. Mercedes will not say how long it has used the sensors. And it insists they are only activated in "extreme circumstances" — when finance customers have defaulted on their payments.
But it admits sharing car owner information and vehicle location details with third-party bailiffs and recovery firms who repossess the cars.
Source: https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/9756250/mercedes-spies-drivers-tracking-devices/
Mercedes-Benz Tracking Down Customer Cars For Repossession: Report
Submitted via IRC for SoyCow3196
British publication The Sun, a sometimes terrible and occasionally entertaining tabloid across the pond, is reporting that concerns are boiling among human rights groups, former government ministers, and some legal experts about Mercedes-Benz using vehicle location data to track down customers who default on their finance program payments.
Source: https://jalopnik.com/brits-are-pissed-about-mercedes-benz-tracking-down-cust-1837449509
See also:
- https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1124662_mercedes-admits-to-tracking-vehicles-in-uk-for-repossessions
- https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7373639/Mercedes-admits-cars-fitted-secret-sensor-pinpoint-location.html
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 23 2019, @10:06PM (4 children)
Mercedes will not say how long it has used the sensors.
Since at least 2012 was when I first heard about it. Probably more like ~2010 when they started working with the onstar group. It is the same backend just different front end to look more 'quality'.
Oh and if you think your new shiny car does not have this sort of thing. Think again. It is what they call 'table stakes'. All new cars have this sort of thing. It is remote analytics IoT and how car dealerships disable the car if you skip a few payments.
A modem in every car. Broadcom, Qualcomm, AT&T, or Verizon, or something...
Also think your info can not be shared? Hahaha. Its in that fine print of that 30 page document they make you sign and initial everywhere to buy the thing. They also tie it to the remote services (like onstar, or GPS, or whatever they call the service). You ASKED them to do it will be what they say. It is in this contract. Hell at one point the salesman probably even described it. But car fever is a harsh bitch.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 23 2019, @10:58PM (3 children)
A contract is not about asking someone to do something. It is about an exchange of value, and in fact, you can't even have a completely one sided contract! There *must* be an exchange of "something".
Further, something being in a contract doesn't make it legal. And outside of legality, it doesn't make it moral.
Finally, there isn't a contract to sign when you buy a car with cash. At least not when I did. The dealership just passes over ownership of the car. Surely, I'm not going to sign any contract because I'm buying a piece of hardware...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 23 2019, @11:00PM
I might add, that there are differences between leasing, financing, and buying outright.
If you lease, well.. the manufacturer still owns the car! Completely! That is an entirely different beast. Is it wrong for me to have GPS in my car, and let you borrow it for a week? Or, if I tell you to give me $50 bucks, you borrow it, and I tell you about it?
Financing is more grey area, because it is 100% your car, but they have a lean on it. Different beast.
(Score: 3, Informative) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Saturday August 24 2019, @01:43AM
You certainly can sign a one-sided contract. It may not be legal to enforce, but it's signable. You can also go through the old standby of having the consideration be $1.00 and "other good and valuable consideration" - which granted is indeed an exchange but a meaningless one anywhere but a court. You can also contract with a minor. Again, it likely will not be enforceable without a parent or guardian signing it. And while contracts are generally entered into to help one legally in court, it can equally be to simply specify the terms of a deal and keep people to terms without a legal threat.
And if I am a dealer and selling you a car, cash deal or not, I will absolutely require you to sign a contract which defines exactly what you are getting, what your warranty options are, and what your recourses are should there have been a misrepresentation. I might also have a clause that you are warranting that the cash you're paying me is honest so I'll have some defense when the cops come knocking and say that you're a drug dealer and why did I knowingly enter a cash transcation with you? Won't buy from me in that event? Then we don't have a deal.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 24 2019, @01:58AM
There is pretty much nothing illegal about these things.
The dealership just passes over ownership of the car. Surely, I'm not going to sign any contract because I'm buying a piece of hardware
You are also getting wound up about the wrong thing. My point was this is here to stay and has been here for at *least* 10 years already. Also it is still there. If you want it or not. Some of them are tied into the infotainment systems. Some are add ons. Some are part of package. Some are just there. It really depends on make and model. Also I am fairly sure you signed something. I have bought and sold *many* used cars for cash. There is sometimes a notary involved and almost always some form of 'it is yours' contract plus the signature on the title (some people are fine with just this). Now a used car dealer may skip some of the paperwork. They just see the cash and want it out the door. You assume all liability for the car even if they do not explain everything the car does. A more reputable dealer will tell you, if they know. Some of the guys I know would see you a nickle for a dime and try to make you feel good about it.
Also they 'tell' you about it. But are very hand wavy. They probably do not even really understand what this stuff does. I do because I used to write software that did *exactly* that. But our customers wanted it and it was an add on.
you can't even have a completely one sided contract
Nothing one sided about it. They get money. You get a car plus some other stuff. But you really just wanted a car.
Again *all* cars have this. It is table stakes.
Want that nifty updating over the air GPS? Cell modem.
Want that nifty push a button and someone comes out to help? Cell modem.
Want that nifty email your car is due for service at X miles? Cell modem.
Your airbag just blew and they talk to you? Cell modem
Wifi in your car that connects to the internet? Cell modem
Traffic alerts? Cell modem
You bought a car from someone else and it is less than 10 years old? Cell modem.
Hell some of them use your own phone PLUS the one built in.
The modem is like a 10 dollar part. and the size of a stick of gum. It is just as capable as any smartphone. It is literally the same chipsets.