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"The US House of Representatives has passed a resolution to formally proceed with the impeachment inquiry against President Donald Trump.
The measure details how the inquiry will move into a more public phase. It was not a vote on whether the president should be removed from office.
This was the first test of support in the Democratic-controlled House for the impeachment process.
The White House condemned the vote, which passed along party lines.
Only two Democrats - representing districts that Mr Trump won handily in 2016 - voted against the resolution, along with all Republicans, for a total count of 232 in favour and 196 against."
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Trump Impeachment: House Votes to Formalise Inquiry
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In the Halls of Justice the only justice is in the halls.
-- Lenny Bruce
(Score: 2) by Snotnose on Friday November 01 2019, @02:47PM (74 children)
Much as I'd like to see Trump booted from the oval office into a prison cell, I don't think he's actually done anything impeachable. Which, considering the amount of noxious shit he's pulled, is a sad state of affairs.
My ducks are not in a row. I don't know where some of them are, and I'm pretty sure one of them is a turkey.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Friday November 01 2019, @03:43PM (27 children)
Trump should be impeached on the sole ground that he and his antics make the world a much more unstable place, hence threatening the safety of the United States.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @04:05PM (1 child)
So you're of the school of thought that it's strictly a political process?
That's one position, sure, but it's not uncontroversial. Check out the Laws and Sausages comic for an overview.
Seriously, it's a good one, and should be in grade schools nationwide.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Friday November 01 2019, @04:32PM
I had never heard of "Laws and Sausages", thanks. I glanced at a few- very informative, and hopefully factually accurate.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Friday November 01 2019, @04:27PM (24 children)
Perhaps you should define "stable". I can make a pretty strong case that Saddam Hussein made the world a more stable place, and that Bush made the world far more unstable with his regime changing. Does ISIS or DAESH ring any bells? Overall, Trump seems to be more stabilizing than not. He's pried Li'l Kim's ass out of North Korea to begin peace talks, has he not? Yeah, Trump's an ass, but he's not so unstable as many believe. But, for variable definitions of stability, I suppose you can condemn anyone you like.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Friday November 01 2019, @04:37PM (13 children)
At the time I remember there were strong arguments for keeping Saddam Hussein in place for overall stability. However, and I'm not sure what my vote would be, what if someone like Hussein was maintaining stability, but also committing atrocities? I've heard similar argument regarding Bashar al-Assad of Syria, and that forcefully removing him (if possible) would pave the way for expansion of ISIS.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Runaway1956 on Friday November 01 2019, @05:02PM (8 children)
I feel that slippery slope here, but I'll try - - -
An "atrocity" in our western society is pretty easy to define. An "atrocity" in the Mid-east is something else. I don't think that any of us, who grew up outside of that tribal culture can truly understand it. In their views, it's pretty much acceptable to kill off the population of a village filled with rivals. Or, better yet, kill off the men, and steal their women, their goats, their camels, and rape their sons. That is the apex of civilization in the Mid-east.
It is for this reason that Saddam Hussein can be credited with maintaining stability. He was hated, but his methods earned respect among his peers.
Now, please don't presume that I "like" that. Or that I "approve" of it. I am merely stating fact, as clearly as I am able to. Arabs, Persians, and most of the rest of those people are NOT Christian, not western, not Euro, not American. The thing that ties most all of them together, is their history under the Ottoman. The Ottoman nurtured this tribalism.
Bleahhhh - I'm not walking any further out on that slippery slope unless you insist, and I may not then . . .
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Friday November 01 2019, @05:33PM (4 children)
Yeah, thanks, it's very very complicated, with deep cultural roots, norms and values very different from Western, such that we Westerners just can't empathize or understand.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Monday November 04 2019, @08:10PM (3 children)
No, it's understandable and can even be empathasized with. But it takes a heck of a lot more study, dedicated academic study, than what soundbite news will tell one. Just like thinking that because one has been to Virginia and Kentucky and watched HBO one understands and empathizes with the Hatfields and McCoys.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by RS3 on Monday November 04 2019, @11:02PM (2 children)
I agree with you. In my effort to be brief, I often fail to write that which seems obvious to me: yes, sure, given enough time and mental focus, most people could understand it, but too many have other priorities. As you described it well, they just accept what they hear in news soundbites, and miss much (most?) of the underlying story. "Popular misconception" is too prevalent in society.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Tuesday November 05 2019, @11:37PM (1 child)
Yeah and you do have the core that even if the situation is understandable not many will produce the effort to do so, and people will continue to make judgments without all the information. And no, one can't know everything about everything within a lifetime, either.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Wednesday November 06 2019, @02:47AM
Right there's the problem (that bugs me much- overconfidence!)
But that said, how does a reasonable person know when they know enough about something to have valid opinions, worthy of sharing them such that others are enriched and society maybe enhanced?
(ugh, me the non-philosopher...)
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @06:14PM
I've never forgiven them for that terrorist group Al Gebra.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @06:29PM (1 child)
Oh NOes! Lookout! Runnyway is getting aroused!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @11:29PM
Runaway is only interested in getting peoples' goats.
(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Saturday November 09 2019, @10:25PM (3 children)
Americans never got to see it. Between government censorship and self-censorship by the media, you got duped into an unnecessary war.
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Sunday November 10 2019, @12:21AM (2 children)
Thanks. Actually, we did have some news coverage, I did watch it closely, and I was infuriated that the US military was invading Iraq. I remember that there were problems with inspectors and inspections, but it wasn't reason enough to attack. Something is terribly wrong, and I've never been quite sure what it was/is. I've heard of over-zealous and brutal police, but the US govt. doing so on that large of a scale?
And, my frustration and embarrassment of the US govt. / military / lack_of_intelligence was just that: you mean to tell me the US intelligence community is THAT inept? Just what WERE they doing?
BTW, I felt Powell was being a yes-man- telling Bush (it was Bush?) what he wanted to hear. Again, not sure why though. What a mess... And it just pissed them off and we had/have created Isis, Taliban, etc...
(Score: 3, Insightful) by barbara hudson on Sunday November 10 2019, @01:31AM (1 child)
The moral decline in the presidency goes back to Kennedy, who was a womanizer and paid for it with his life (he had thrown his back during a sexual liaison and was wearing a back brace, so couldn't duck when the shooting started.
Then there was Johnson's secret war. Followed by Nixon. Ford wasn't really president long enough to do much damage, but was finally convinced he couldn't run because of the taint from pardoning Nixon. Nobody was buying his excuse that he had to pardon Nixon. Carter was the only president who, even decades later, is regarded as having integrity. Bush de was CIA - enough said. Clinton was another adulterer who lied under oath, and passed laws favouring neocon ideology. Bush jr was an alcoholic. With a history of cocaine use. Obama was a crackhead who had a hit list of over 3,000, backed by an opinion that he could order assassinations. He also sucked up to the banks, spending more taxpayer funds to bail them out of the consequences of their illegal frauds while it would have been cheaper to just take over the bad mortgages at a discount and not force people into bankruptcy. Trump - a crook.
The contagion is spreading. Justin Trudeau illegally interferes with the prosecution of SNV-Lavalin for bribes to Libya's dictator. Alexander Boris Johnson wants to be a mini-me to Trump.
What a mess!
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Sunday November 10 2019, @01:57AM
That was an excellent summary!! Pulitzer candidate. Thank you.
I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but sometimes I cynically wonder if it's all a smokescreen for what's really going on. Keeps the press busy and off of the real crap going on.
Yes, I've always liked Carter. He inherited an impossible mess. We (US) were too invested in the Shah of Iran and when that whole mess happened, well, we know what happened.
Oh yeah, the "energy shortages" of the '70s- 2 major times OPEC cut petroleum production, caused huge gas lines (queues waiting for petrol), huge price increases, etc., all hurt Carter's image.
From what little I know, I always thought that Nixon was mostly good for the US and world. He ended the horrible Vietnam mess and did much good overall. He said he was not a crook, right? I dunno, a little clever spying- I was a kid but I thought it was all very entertaining. I mean, how else do you follow a moon landing! ;)
(Score: 5, Insightful) by barbara hudson on Friday November 01 2019, @06:13PM (1 child)
Trump keeps sucking up to the guy, same as he does to other dictators. He's jealous.
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @12:05AM
Kim Jong Un is Xi's puppet. If these missile tests were not authorized that is China's problem. If they were, then whatever blame is deserved lies with China.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @09:12PM (5 children)
No, he has not.
1) Nothing whatsoever has been meaningfully done about reunification or actually settling peace between the Koreas.
2) Nothing whatsoever has been meaningfully done about denuclearizing North Korea. Just a lot of noise where Trump has been pacified and can be "in love" with Kim while Korea continues it's proliferation effort.
He uses instability as a bargaining tactic, which is stupid given the characters he is dealing with. And he doesn't have the brainpower nor does he rely on the tools of statecraft. That's about as loose cannon as it gets.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday November 02 2019, @02:39AM (1 child)
Not gonna happen any time soon. There was too much time the two societies diverged in values.
Has been, what, almost 30 years already and the inner reunification of Germany is still a thing in progress [wikipedia.org].
Bottom line: if you expect any American president to do it or consider them a failure, all American presidents will be a failure.
"Politics is the art of the possible, the attainable — the art of the next best. Otto von Bismarck"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 04 2019, @08:19PM
Other American Presidents have not presented themselves as capable of solving the NK issue, or rather, presented that they're now succeeding where past ones failed. (Not without a success like Nixon actually going to China. Trump going to NK wasn't that because there is no substance behind the gesture.) Or actively PR'ing themselves that they have "made it happen" when they literally haven't done shit that's meaningful. Other Presidents much more meaningfully show the packed fist of why an NK attack is suicide for NK (i.e. joint military exercises). They use economic tools that work to constrain NK and they use diplomatic tools to get China to make sure NK still heels on the necessary level (oops! harder to do in a trade war!)
Bottom line: Other Presidents haven't tried to claim what Trump is falsely claiming he delivers, nor have other Presidents been taken in by NK's political maneuvering the way Trump has been completely suckered. And Trump doesn't even realized he's been played - he still personally thinks he's winning that one. Because THEY know Trump and Trump refuses to pay attention to what his experts can tell him about Kim. Just like all the others he is losing because he doesn't understand. Trump may or may not understand dealmaking (I think he understands how to con others and profit-by-weasling, not to make deals) but even if we give him that bit he does not understand diplomacy except in the "If I bully them they'll give me something good for me and I'll let them have something I don't care about" sense. Not dealmaking, really, and surely not the art of the possible which diplomacy is.)
Anyway...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @06:56AM (1 child)
2) Nothing whatsoever has been meaningfully done about denuclearizing North America.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 04 2019, @08:21PM
Show me where denuclearizing the United States has been on the table in relations with NK, then we'll talk.
(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Saturday November 09 2019, @10:34PM
He's functionally near-illiterate, talks like a 4th grader, refusing to read anything more complicated than single line paragraphs and bullet points - and even then he can't retain much.
He clearly has dementia. And to add insult to injury, before it used to be his hair that was the brunt of jokes; now it looks like large chunks of his face have worked lose from the underlying flesh.
He's unstable, and never been a genius. It would take a genius to keep all his lies straight, and a stable genius would be smart enough not to need to lie in the first place.
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @02:27AM (1 child)
Except there are no talks. And Kim is still testing his nuclear weapons delivery systems [militarytimes.com] (that was *yesterday*, November 1 2019).
What's more he's targeting the US with malware [us-cert.gov]:
(again, this report was released yesterday).
Whatever "effort" the Trump administration *might* be making is a dismal failure, just like most of everything these incompetent bastards do.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @07:01PM
Exactly - he gave away the prize, which was giving Kim international recognition - without getting anything in return. Now Kim is rattling his pram toys again and Trump better come up with another gift.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @04:01PM (7 children)
Just out of curiosity, what do you think would be compelling grounds for impeachment? Does he have to shoot someone in the middle of 5th Ave in front of a crowd of onlookers? What would push you over the line to be in favor of impeachment?
For my part, I think Trump should be impeached just for being an embarrassment to the nation.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday November 02 2019, @12:41AM (6 children)
(Score: 2) by Pino P on Saturday November 02 2019, @02:44PM (4 children)
Volume II of Special Counsel Robert Mueller's Report on the Investigation into Russian Interference in the 2016 Presidential Election [wikipedia.org] lists ten counts of obstruction of justice [wikipedia.org]. Under federal sentencing guidelines that apply to everybody but the President of the United States, obstruction adds two levels to the sentence for any other federal crime, which can elevate a misdemeanor to a felony. And given how elected officials are in a unique position to obstruct justice, obstruction is among the "high crimes" (abuses of an office's power) that can get a President removed from office.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday November 02 2019, @07:27PM (3 children)
Alleged.
(Score: 2) by Pino P on Sunday November 03 2019, @01:54PM (1 child)
And it's the House's job to follow up on these allegations of bribery, obstruction, and other high crimes, and lay the evidence before the Senate.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday November 04 2019, @04:02AM
Only if there's evidence for the allegations. Trials are punishments in themselves and shouldn't be allowed on frivolously contexts. Just because a prosecutor can "indict a ham sandwich" doesn't mean that the threshold is appropriate. I think it's notable here that there's never been probable cause for the Mueller fishing expedition and none of the charges mentioned have anything to do with the purported purpose of the investigation.
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Monday November 04 2019, @08:22PM
Then let them be tried.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Saturday November 09 2019, @10:43PM
Obstruction was the charge that brought Nixon down, both in the eyes of the public and the republicans in the senate. He resigned when he was told that the votes weren't there to save his ass.
Of course, treason is also supported by trying to make it look like Ukraine, and not Russia, was behind the hacks of Clinton's email. And he can't pardon himself for treason since any action he took after any treasonous act is null and void.
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by bussdriver on Friday November 01 2019, @04:56PM (20 children)
Redundant news post.
Trump has been doing impeachable acts LITERALLY (actual definition) since day one! Unbiased rational review of his actions has him down for probably at least a dozen offenses. It just shows the sorry state of the collapsing democracy of the USA and the ignorance of the public. In a democracy, it should be obvious that using the government to undermine the democracy is the #1 worst thing you can do.
You don't need formal crimes-- I encourage people to read the bits in the constitution! It lays out a political process limited only by the threat of voter backlash; it's not a civil or criminal process. The BS out there about due process rights, 5th amendment, etc. are ALL lies and BS by people who know better. You don't get any of those rights; the constitution says so. It's not a criminal proceeding so the 5th doesn't apply; just for an example to get you started. Oh, and any nimrod knows investigations are done in private; when determining facts, you can't have suspects/witnesses corroborating their accounts! Later you have public testimony. In fact, the whole entire thing can be completely secret (almost like a grand jury...which is what impeachment is similar to) and the testimony comes in the trial... which itself could be secret and the votes could be in private. (As Jeff Flake said, if it was a secret vote 30 senate republicans would vote to remove him.) The current rules of the Senate put too much power into 1 man, whose wife working for Trump! There should be a law against that; it gives the Exec branch undue power over the Leg branch! She's committed violations; if not crimes, in her job already which sets up Mitch for political blackmail.
Nobody has done more harm to this democracy than Donald Trump. That alone should be enough; but like I said, it's a political process and large tribe of ignorant people don't care about reason, logic, decency, morality, even their own professed religious beliefs. Tribalism is STRONG and it's biological. A reasonable person can see how much more strongly the other tribe would fight for removal if Obama only did 1 of the many things Trump has.
Perhaps the Democratic side has some ethics left but you can't be sure of that when anybody on the side of good is labeled as being tribal by the side of evil. Oh yes, I went there-- the side of evil is about as clear as Italy in the 1930s... which is to say, it's not crystal clear to the slow people yet... It will take a massive war for them to learn... and a few will still not learn. This "Make Italy Great Again" crap should be politically radioactive because of it's history as should "Lying Press" was taboo because of Germany's history (modern translation easily is "Fake News".)
FYI, I used to read/watch propaganda as a hobby. Now, I just try to avoid it...
(Score: 0, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @07:02PM (18 children)
How come nobody wants to look at the also criminal Democrats?
Bill Clinton signed the repeal of Glass-Steagall. I think that is up there or worse than anything that Trump has done.
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass%E2%80%93Steagall_Act [wikipedia.org]
(Score: 4, Touché) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Friday November 01 2019, @07:44PM (8 children)
Because this is not whataboutism.
Next.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by slinches on Friday November 01 2019, @08:06PM (7 children)
What a convenient way to dismiss your hypocrisy.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @10:25PM (6 children)
Because Bill Clinton has no bearing on the topic at hand. You are just searching for some way to say "well you're protecting YOUR side when it is blatantly corrupt tooooo!"
Which is absolute horse shit. Democrats have gotten in trouble and resigned over improprieties, Republicans do not and continue to support criminals and pedos. Even "saint Obama" is criticized regularly by liberals for his mistakes and broken promises.
The fuck is wrong with you conservatives? Just don't have the fortitude of character to admit when you're wrong and stick to basic morality and ethics? The. Fuck?
(Score: 2) by slinches on Friday November 01 2019, @11:24PM (4 children)
When/if the investigation is complete and the articles of impeachment are sent to the Senate, I will evaluate the merits of the case then. The investigation is still ongoing and we have only the parts of the evidence that were leaked from closed door sessions and what the White House has said publicly. It's quite possible that new evidence may be revealed that conflicts with what we have seen so far, favorable and unfavorable.
I just hate the term "whataboutism". It's all too often used to deflect criticisms of hypocrisy or analogous situations that are relevant to the discussion.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @11:22PM
Except you're already crying about the impeachment inquiry and crying foul. Try again.
Hint: pay attention to Trump's lies and the publicly available evidence of his crimes. If you don't already understand he needs to go then I doubt you ever will, and "When/if the investigation is complete and the articles of impeachment are sent to the Senate, I will evaluate the merits of the case then" just seems like a way to escape admitting that you are defending a criminal POtuS.
What will you do if the investigation is damning but McConnell decides to sink the whole thing? Do you declare victory even with obviously corrupt bullshit going on? Do you have any shred of dignity and decency as an American? Or would you rather create a conservative dictatorship just so you can "win"?
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Monday November 04 2019, @08:23PM (2 children)
Bill Clinton and Glass-Stegall has NOTHING to do with Trump and Ukraine. NOTHING.
It's whataboutism.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by slinches on Monday November 04 2019, @11:31PM (1 child)
The way to deal with off topic lines of conversation is to state that they are off topic and move on. So, calling out "whataboutism" isn't necessary and makes available a tool to dismiss valid parallel lines of inquiry.
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Tuesday November 05 2019, @11:07PM
Yes. I am intentionally attempting to dismiss it as not relevant to the subject at hand. It is more than off topic to me for it reads as an attempt to distract focus away from the very real problems at hand concerning the impeachment by introducing an irrelevancy to the topic at hand. And done so in a thread that is already swollen with commentary.
That does not mean your point is not valid or should not be raised in another forum at another point in time. But until it is relevant it is trying to name the sins of the Democrats instead of the conduct of the Presidency. Thus you are asking, "well, what about this thing here?" I thus still fail to see how this is not a textbook definition of whataboutism and thus my criticism and dismissal is more than valid, it is apporpriate.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by hemocyanin on Saturday November 02 2019, @06:43AM
Any real investigation of DC, would see the whole place walled off and the gate key thrown away.
You know the worst part about impeaching Trump (and Pence) -- you get Democrats. It's like extricating yourself from a cesspool to land in a sewer.
(Score: 2) by SpockLogic on Friday November 01 2019, @07:48PM (2 children)
Bravo.
Nice bit of Whataboutism to deflect from the current unrepentant Adulterer in Chief's crimes.
Don't forget to invoice the RNC for your effort.
Overreacting is one thing, sticking your head up your ass hoping the problem goes away is another - edIII
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @06:46AM (1 child)
Shouting "whataboutism" -- the ultimate dodge. It's cheap, transparent, and it doesn't make your shit not stink.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 03 2019, @05:22PM
Using whataboutism, lame cheap and shows you know you're wrong so you need to use distractions of reality.
(Score: 2) by sjames on Friday November 01 2019, @10:13PM
Bill's been out of office for some time now. It's a bit late for impeachment now.
The repeal of Glass-Steagall was a giant bi-partisan blunder, but unfortunately not a crime.
(Score: 2) by bussdriver on Friday November 01 2019, @10:29PM
You can't place that all onto Clinton because the disgraceful repeal of Glass-Steagall passed with like 90% support! VETO PROOF MAJORITY, not even just barely it was way over what was needed. At that point Clinton's support was completely irrelevant; furthermore, it was at the end of his term and he had huge $ debts...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @02:35AM
And 535 members of Congress *passed* that bill with broad *bipartisan* support.
https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=106&session=1&vote=00354&TB_iframe=true&width=720&height=540 [senate.gov]
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/1999/roll570.xml [house.gov]
Although, I'd point out that signing a bill passed by both houses of Congress is hardly criminal, regardless of the contents of such a bill.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @02:35AM
And 535 members of Congress *passed* that bill with broad *bipartisan* support.
https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=106&session=1&vote=00354&TB_iframe=true&width=720&height=540 [senate.gov]
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/1999/roll570.xml [house.gov]
Although, I'd point out that signing a bill passed by both houses of Congress is hardly criminal, regardless of the contents of such a bill.
(Score: 2) by Joe Desertrat on Saturday November 02 2019, @11:25PM
Clinton signed it, but it was passed by both the House and Senate, both with Republican majorities. If the Democrats had control of either chamber of congress, the repeal would never have passed. Since the day it originally became law the Republicans have railed against it and worked to repeal it. It was a pet dream of Representative Jack Kemp, who first began serious efforts to repeal it in the 80's. That most Republican voters blame Democrats for the repeal of Glass-Steagall is the perfect example of the effectiveness of the conservative propaganda machine at work. Four legs good, two legs better and all that...
(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Saturday November 09 2019, @10:49PM
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @09:03PM
Are you some kind of medium channeling the stuff then?
(Score: 5, Informative) by LVDOVICVS on Friday November 01 2019, @05:01PM (2 children)
He jeopardized national security for his own political gain. He held held foreign aid hostage for personal benefit. If that's not impeachable, nothing is.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @02:49AM (1 child)
well, banging an intern and obfuscating Congress about it was enough back in the day.
Now we have a president who brags about his gaslighting of (aka lying to) Congress on a perpetual basis and THAT isn't impeachable?
By the Republicans' own actions, burden of proof and processes from the Clinton era, Trump is impeachable many times over, and they should have no problems here.
(Score: 2) by LVDOVICVS on Saturday November 02 2019, @05:34AM
They *should* have no problems with calling him out. But it appears once you've sold your soul to the Orange Devil there's never even the faintest hope of ever getting it back.
But he might toss a few bucks into your re-election fund if you stand naked on the Senate desks and sing his praises from the top of your lungs one more time.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by JoeMerchant on Friday November 01 2019, @05:19PM (3 children)
Congress writes the laws, including Constitutional amendments. If a geriatric trust fund baby with a mail order bride from the #1 hostile foreign state ever gets elected president again, Congress should be giving themselves the tools to deal with that effectively.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @05:29PM (2 children)
"mail order bride from the #1 hostile foreign state"
Slovenia? You fucking idiot.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @07:12PM (1 child)
Do you mean the "Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia"? Which for the first 21 years of Melaina's life was a part of the Eastern Block. Or do you mean Ivana from Czechoslovakia, which from the end of WWII was a part of the Eastern Block until 1989 (the first 28 years of her life before she married D. Trump? Is there a pattern here other than Marla Maples?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @09:44PM
Go ask Hillary whether Maples is a Russian asset too.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @05:29PM
Then you fundamentally do not understand what “impeachment” is.
Absolutely anything at all is an impeachable offense if the House so deems it.
(Score: 0, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @06:45PM (2 children)
Seriously? this is not bad enough for you?! Its one thing to attempt to rig an election with weasel games in the voting regulations and it is quite another to coerce foreign governments into interfering in the election! Sure other governments do things but they are not asked (russia) or coordinate with your staff (russia) and especially are not forced into it (ukraine.) This would allow any implied attacks without any means to counter it because the other government doesn't have to play by any legal rules here... especially a government with a history of big corruption problems; it has to be easy to find somebody to cook up things that look bad long enough to do great damage that fall apart later on.... or in that country's case-- they can jail innocent people for trumped up crimes and they have in recent years!
After trump is gone we may find out ukraine had recordings and more evidence of blackmail. They won't dare risk it now. Besides, the "transcript" is NOT a transcript! That is the edited clean version the white house impeached themselves with, due to their incompetent english skills! Just like that idiot chief of staff moving 1 step ahead and admitting to the crime openly and it wasn't an "out of context" situation they are claiming. But just watch, it's their MO: deny everything, then deny the worst bits, then admit it and extend what is "normal" and even brag about it. The whole time during their typical corporate PR game they libel and attack everybody who dares point out the truth... even people on their own side.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @06:49AM (1 child)
If we are to take the RussiaRussiaRussia thing seriously, it's pretty clear Republicans should take up the UkraineUkraineUkrain refrain because it appears pretty clear Ukraine was trying to interfere in the election to get HRC in office.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 02 2019, @07:04PM
Boring - try harder. Moar conspiracy needed.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by bussdriver on Friday November 01 2019, @07:13PM (3 children)
Nixon had "plumbers" who incompetently broke into the watergate building 4 times trying to find dirt. illegal but also immortal, unethical, etc. At least Nixon hired AMERICAN "plumbers"! Since the whole mess wasn't completely investigated who knows if he had "electricians" or others ... he trashed the evidence instead of handing it over as it was REQUIRED by the constitution to do. Abuse of power; obstruction was on his impeachment. (well, abuse of power is basically the whole purpose for impeachment.)
Stupid Watergate 1: Russia collusion. Saved like every mobster-- by using obstruction; nobody talks against the don...or has physical evidence since stooges do the work. The mobster professes their innocence over and over and over plus how unfair it's being pinned on them... There is no murder! You don't have the body! as their stooges obstruct (contempt etc.) to insulate from a direct connection. Leaving it to the IRS or accountants at the FBI to go after the money laundering.... but never get the crimes behind all those coverups. Better to get a few years of contempt than life for the actual crime. Loyalty is how it all works and why it's so extremely important.
Stupid Watergate 2: Ukraine; but it's a shakedown... it even involves protection money! "Find" some dirt or else I'd hate to see my FRIEND Putin have his way with you... He can't even have Americans do the shakedown! Could he have found more shady looking/sounding Ukrainians to handle the job?
This is like a children's spy movie... Spy Kids? the villain is a fool and hires fools whose incompetence is largely tolerated. 1 henchman is punished as an example to others because the FOOL thinks loyalty is the problem when it's always incompetence why they fail to stop the Spy Kids. (the heroes who are extremely lucky too.) Biden should learn from his grandchildren's movies! Go turn himself into Trump to confess but instead get him to monologue...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @07:16PM (2 children)
Johnson spied on Nixon but was never outed publicly. Both parties are criminal in similar ways
(Score: 2) by bussdriver on Friday November 01 2019, @10:47PM
I listened to the Johnson declassified tapes a few times... they drop some new ones now and then.
Nixon actually traveled abroad and made a deal with the ENEMY (Vietnam) to not make any deals with Johnson who was beginning to negotiate a deal with them. Johnson was aware of Nixon's TREASON but you can hear it in his own words on the tape. Dig it up. He didn't like the political mess it would create in doing so. Obviously, they were spying on Nixon... because the enemy was being spied on along with ANYBODY who did business with them! That is something you must to if you are going to find any traitors or spies...
During Obama they were watching Russian agents who ended up dealing with some Trump people so obviously they ended up aware of such interactions. Hell, Trump can be clean but you sure as hell want to know what some employee is doing with the enemy agent! you don't stop recording when the traitor turns out to be somebody important; that makes it possibly an even more important case! This is really basic stuff; it's nothing like the patriot act BS expanding into listening to all our phone calls.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 01 2019, @11:38PM
Nixon committed treason before his election but Johnson let it go.
(Score: 4, Informative) by Thexalon on Friday November 01 2019, @09:58PM (1 child)
Why are each of these crimes not impeachable:
- Receiving bribes from foreign governments. (Bribery is specifically listed as grounds for impeachment in the Constitution)
- Sexual assault (at least 25 counts, including 1 of a minor).
- Public corruption that directs federal spending to his personal accounts. (also specifically listed as grounds for impeachment)
- Witness tampering.
- Obstruction of justice (this one cost Nixon his presidency).
- Involvement with organized crime (RICO).
- Extortion. (Specifically, if Ukraine didn't get the aid that the president was dangling in front of him, they'd likely be taken out by Russia, and everyone involved knew it)
- Business fraud (TrumpU).
- Threatening the life of public officials (most notably Ilhan Omar).
- Tax evasion.
- Crimes against humanity (treatment of migrants at the border in violation of the Geneva Conventions).
- Campaign finance violations (payoffs of Stormy Daniels and several other victims of sexual assault by the president, as detailed by Michael Cohen).
Evidence of all those crimes is currently in the public record.
Additional crimes there's good reason to think he may have committed but aren't yet proven in the public record include:
- Money laundering.
- Murder of a witness (namely, Jeffrey Epstein, although a lot of other people had means, motive, and opportunity for that one).
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Saturday November 09 2019, @11:00PM
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