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Debian Developers Take To Voting Over Init System Diversity
It's been five years already since the vote to transition to systemd in Debian over Upstart while now there is the new vote that has just commenced for judging the interest in "init system diversity" and just how much Debian developers care (or not) in supporting alternatives to systemd.
Due to Debian developers having differing opinions on handling non-systemd bugs in 2019 and the interest/commitment to supporting systemd alternatives in the scope of Debian packaging and various related friction points, they've taken to a new general resolution over weighing init system diversity.
The ballot is available on-line. The choices are:
Choice 1: F: Focus on systemd
Choice 2: B: Systemd but we support exploring alternatives
Choice 3: A: Support for multiple init systems is Important
Choice 4: D: Support non-systemd systems, without blocking progress
Choice 5: H: Support portability, without blocking progress
Choice 6: E: Support for multiple init systems is Required
Choice 7: G: Support portability and multiple implementations
Choice 8: Further Discussion
[Ed. note: I'm not sure what the letters after the choice numbers indicate, nor do I know where "C" disappeared to.]
(Score: 2, Interesting) by shrewdsheep on Tuesday December 10 2019, @02:46PM (12 children)
To the contrary. There is a lot of duplication of efforts going on in the larger Linux/BSD community. Start with hosting, bug tracking, packaging systems, packaging itself and there is no end in sight. Freedom it is and it is everybody's choice, I do cherish that for sure. In terms of market penetration, Linux would be much more effective if efforts would concentrate on fewer distributions.
It is a double edged sword: the zeal and idealism of developers/contributors drives these projects, the very same zeal and idealism leads to deep emotional conflict, flame wars, and forks.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Arik on Tuesday December 10 2019, @03:01PM (4 children)
That's not a bad thing.
"In terms of market penetration, Linux would be much more effective if efforts would concentrate on fewer distributions."
I doubt that very much, in fact I'll go so far as to say the opposite is far more likely to be true.
Different distros exist to meet the needs of different people. You start eliminating them, you lose the people they served, you lose the people that were motivated to develop and maintain them, it's all very counterproductive.
Instead, you might focus on shaming application developers to produce proper software again - well written applications are portable, crappy ones expect you to use the same distro as the developer and that's really not acceptable.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 1, Offtopic) by epitaxial on Tuesday December 10 2019, @07:45PM (3 children)
Take iMessage for example. It works over wifi unlike normal SMS messages. On wifi I can text any other iPhone user because its the only messaging app. Now take Android. It has that capability but via third party apps, of which there are dozens. Which one can I install that will work with EVERY Android. There isn't one. Simple shit like this is the problem.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Arik on Tuesday December 10 2019, @07:58PM (2 children)
And Android is an excellent example of what should never be done. On just about every level. So I'm not even sure if you replied to the right message.
It's a bit mystifying.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 2) by epitaxial on Tuesday December 10 2019, @09:10PM (1 child)
It perfectly describes your problem of packaging. There are competing formats that all do the same thing and now that systemd is involved it makes things much worse.
(Score: 1) by Arik on Wednesday December 11 2019, @05:08AM
Not my problem. Again, I suspect you are replying to the wrong messages for some reason.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Mojibake Tengu on Tuesday December 10 2019, @03:40PM (3 children)
If the true needs are divergent, any effort to converge them by just exercising power is harmful. This is what evil corporations do, like RedHat or Microsoft.
You want cathedral, instead of bazaar. Centralism does not fit to the concept of FOSS.
Duplication of efforts is critical factor to prevent single points of failure by concentration of errors. Linux needs more different distros, not fewer almost identical.
Respect Authorities. Know your social status. Woke responsibly.
(Score: 2) by Dr Spin on Tuesday December 10 2019, @05:23PM (2 children)
You want cathedral, instead of bazaar. Centralism does not fit to the concept of FOSS.
Actually, the BSDs are cathedral like, and are a good answer if what you want is *BSD!
OTOH closed sores is the answer if you want a pile of shite.
Warning: Opening your mouth may invalidate your brain!
(Score: 2) by Bot on Tuesday December 10 2019, @07:48PM
In the meantime, project trident, aiming to improve freebsd, transitioned to systemd-free void linux, they also stated their reasons.
https://project-trident.org/post/os_migration/ [project-trident.org]
So, just use freebsd is not a catch-all solution, even without considering licensing philosophies.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 10 2019, @08:22PM
The BSDs are a bazaar of cathedrals; each one may be a cohesive whole, but there are many to choose from.
And, I would put forth that the cross-pollination between the BSDs are a great source of their strengths.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday December 10 2019, @05:59PM
We now have fewer Linux distributions than there are Linux users. At one time in the past the opposite was true.
So progress has already been made.
To transfer files: right-click on file, pick Copy. Unplug mouse, plug mouse into other computer. Right-click, paste.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 10 2019, @06:21PM
>> There is a lot of duplication of efforts
That is exactly why Poettering is doing the community a huge favor by incorporating new functionality into systemd... he accepts your suggestion to add hosting, bug tracking, packaging systems, packaging itself and there is no end in sight.
(Score: 2) by Bot on Tuesday December 10 2019, @07:43PM
But this happened with systemd. Distros are becoming mere branding thanks to systemd propension to submit other services. Linux did not advance much as a result did it?
Account abandoned.