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Debian Developers Take To Voting Over Init System Diversity
It's been five years already since the vote to transition to systemd in Debian over Upstart while now there is the new vote that has just commenced for judging the interest in "init system diversity" and just how much Debian developers care (or not) in supporting alternatives to systemd.
Due to Debian developers having differing opinions on handling non-systemd bugs in 2019 and the interest/commitment to supporting systemd alternatives in the scope of Debian packaging and various related friction points, they've taken to a new general resolution over weighing init system diversity.
The ballot is available on-line. The choices are:
Choice 1: F: Focus on systemd
Choice 2: B: Systemd but we support exploring alternatives
Choice 3: A: Support for multiple init systems is Important
Choice 4: D: Support non-systemd systems, without blocking progress
Choice 5: H: Support portability, without blocking progress
Choice 6: E: Support for multiple init systems is Required
Choice 7: G: Support portability and multiple implementations
Choice 8: Further Discussion
[Ed. note: I'm not sure what the letters after the choice numbers indicate, nor do I know where "C" disappeared to.]
(Score: 3, Touché) by RS3 on Tuesday December 10 2019, @02:48PM (13 children)
"collectivism"- I like that. I lump that in with "popular misconception".
Yes, agreed on all points.
The flaw I see is a lack of choice, including the survey: how about giving us a choice of init system?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 10 2019, @05:41PM (8 children)
Never gonna happen. It's not like this is part of the discussion, right:
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Tuesday December 10 2019, @06:47PM (7 children)
I find that wording awkward. I don't want multiple init systems. I want 1, that I choose from a list of options.
And, I was referring to ALL Linux distros, and software in general. Seems it (providing options) would solve the debate.
(Score: 4, Informative) by Bot on Tuesday December 10 2019, @07:55PM (3 children)
You are the user, there is written "support". So your objection as a dev might be I don't want to support many init systems.
Debian, before systemd and COCs, was adding support for different KERNELS. Why? because it is called the universal operating system. So multiple init support, especially in terms of removing BAKED IN dependence on systemd, should be one of the main goals of debian. That they have trouble achieving it for lack of dev power (everybody occupied with making their systemd work I guess?) is another matter.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:08PM (2 children)
It's amazing how confusing language can be. Let me try this: to me, the wording "support for multiple init systems" means "one installed OS can have multiple init systems installed at once." Does that make more sense? And maybe that could exist, and a boot menu would allow choosing which init system to use for that boot.
I'd rather the wording be: at installation, choose one init system from many available.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Bot on Tuesday December 10 2019, @11:03PM (1 child)
Mxlinux in fact has sysvinit and systemd as boot options.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Wednesday December 11 2019, @03:52PM
Thank you so much, I'll try it. I had tried "mepis" 8 or so years ago, before systemd became malignant. Recently when I saw systemd listed as part of Mxlinux I moved on, not knowing it was optional. Generally when a distro starts including systemd, my inclination is to steer clear because they're wasting valuable time and resources on a tumor. My fear with Mxlinux is that systemd will become defacto, but I'll try it...
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 10 2019, @08:37PM (2 children)
If you want such a an option list when installing a distro, from where do those options come?
Perhaps you could write several of them each time you install a new system? What's that? You just want a bunch of different options presented to you and don't care about how they get there? If that's the case, then the discussion/vote in TFA isn't aimed at you.
I'm not *at all* suggesting that you don't participate. By all means, say whatever you want.
However, the issue isn't awkward wording, it's your complete misunderstanding of the discussion WRT init systems in TFS/TFA is all about.
It's not like multiple init systems run at the same time (okay, I guess they *could*, but hilarity, then tragedy, would ensue -- possibly without the hilarity). As such, what do you think
means?
It means exactly what you're asking for. I'm not sure how you could be confused so badly. Lack of sleep?
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:10PM (1 child)
Whenever you misunderstand someone, it's always the best thing for all of society to insult the person, rather than realize that language is not exact, and sometimes some readers may misinterpret what they've read. /s
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:32PM
That, to you, is an insult?
Remind me not to hope you have a good day -- you might beat me up.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday December 10 2019, @06:04PM (3 children)
A choice can be a set of radio buttons with only one option. Or make that single item a checkbox if that helps you to perceive it as a choice.
(radio buttons...)
Which init system would you like to install:
(*) systemd
(checkbox...)
Would you like to have systemd installed as your choice of init system?
[x] Yes!
(unchecking the [x] Yes, will disable the Continue button to proceed with system installation.)
To transfer files: right-click on file, pick Copy. Unplug mouse, plug mouse into other computer. Right-click, paste.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 10 2019, @06:23PM (1 child)
Sorry, Microsoft has patented that trick already with Window 10 upgrade.
(Score: 2) by Osamabobama on Tuesday December 10 2019, @09:55PM
Microsoft used the opposite trick; the Continue button was never disabled, even when not clicked.
Appended to the end of comments you post. Max: 120 chars.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Tuesday December 10 2019, @06:49PM
> A choice can be a set of radio buttons with only one option.
Like everything but systemd is grayed out.