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posted by martyb on Tuesday December 10 2019, @02:06PM   Printer-friendly

Debian Developers Take To Voting Over Init System Diversity

It's been five years already since the vote to transition to systemd in Debian over Upstart while now there is the new vote that has just commenced for judging the interest in "init system diversity" and just how much Debian developers care (or not) in supporting alternatives to systemd.

Due to Debian developers having differing opinions on handling non-systemd bugs in 2019 and the interest/commitment to supporting systemd alternatives in the scope of Debian packaging and various related friction points, they've taken to a new general resolution over weighing init system diversity.

The ballot is available on-line. The choices are:

Choice 1: F: Focus on systemd
Choice 2: B: Systemd but we support exploring alternatives
Choice 3: A: Support for multiple init systems is Important
Choice 4: D: Support non-systemd systems, without blocking progress
Choice 5: H: Support portability, without blocking progress
Choice 6: E: Support for multiple init systems is Required
Choice 7: G: Support portability and multiple implementations
Choice 8: Further Discussion

[Ed. note: I'm not sure what the letters after the choice numbers indicate, nor do I know where "C" disappeared to.]


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  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Thexalon on Tuesday December 10 2019, @09:45PM (3 children)

    by Thexalon (636) on Tuesday December 10 2019, @09:45PM (#930796)

    Systemd is good enough in practice

    In my experience: It's good enough when everything is working as it's supposed to. When it's not, it can be downright nightmarish to figure out what's going on, because its error feedback is often confusing or non-existent.

    For example, I once rendered a systemd box non-bootable by unplugging my mouse with the box not running, leaving me unable to make any changes to the system until I plugged that mouse back in, and had the problem really been that my formerly working mouse had stopped working I would have been screwed. Sysvinit, Upstart, Runit, etc would have started up without the mouse, and at worst forced me to use the keyboard and possibly a command line to explain what was going on.

    As for it maturing, I don't expect it to so long as Lennart is in charge of it: His projects have consistently been not-terrible ideas to start with, but lousy questionable code and design that others have had to come along and make not suck anymore (see: Pulseaudio).

    --
    The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
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  • (Score: 3, Funny) by krishnoid on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:14PM (1 child)

    by krishnoid (1156) on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:14PM (#930816)

    by unplugging my mouse with the box not running,

    My God, what were you thinking? People like you should not be allowed near anything more complex than an abacus.

    leaving me unable to make any changes to the system until I plugged that mouse back in, and had the problem really been that my formerly working mouse had stopped working I would have been screwed.

    Well of course, isn't that how all UNIX-based systems work? Seriously, this is why people hate users who try to admin their own systems.

    I'm baffled how you somehow figured out that the mouse was the culprit -- kudos.

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Thexalon on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:30PM

      by Thexalon (636) on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:30PM (#930819)

      Yeah, I know. Clearly, I was holding it wrong too.

      --
      The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
  • (Score: 3, Funny) by krishnoid on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:15PM

    by krishnoid (1156) on Tuesday December 10 2019, @10:15PM (#930817)

    As for it maturing, I don't expect it to so long as Lennart is in charge of it: His projects have consistently been not-terrible ideas to start with, but lousy questionable code and design that others have had to come along and make not suck anymore (see: Pulseaudio).

    Just unplug his mouse. I think he'll get the point.