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posted by martyb on Wednesday March 11 2020, @01:46AM   Printer-friendly
from the Having-UBI-would-afford-more-time-to-spend-supporting-SoylentNews dept.

The fine folks at the CBC bring us the following report:

Participants in Ontario's prematurely cancelled basic income pilot project were happier, healthier and continued working even though they were receiving money with no-strings attached.

That's according to a new report titled Southern Ontario's Basic Income Experience, which was compiled by researchers at McMaster and Ryerson University, in partnership with the Hamilton Roundtable for Poverty Reduction.

The report shows nearly three-quarters of respondents who were working when the pilot project began kept at it despite receiving basic income.

That finding appears to contradict the criticism some levelled at the project, saying it would sap people's motivation to stay in the workforce or seek employment.

That's an interesting way of looking at it. An alternative viewpoint could be that over a quarter of the people who were working before the UBI trial stopped working. Unclear are the benefits that resulted from their new spare time — such as providing support to an ailing family member.


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  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 11 2020, @04:52PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 11 2020, @04:52PM (#969694)

    I think there is a difference between UBI and services intended to help the legitimately disabled. What you may be arguing for is more services to help those that legitimately can't help themselves. I would argue that that's different than something like UBI where you are just giving people that can work money in exchange for nothing. I would say those are different conversations.

    Slashdot had some good comments on this. Aside from the people that would have probably been working that quit working (which is bad) and the fact that this wouldn't scale to larger proportions (if everyone got UBI it would just be a wash in terms of how it helps everyone and how that gets adjusted when it comes to increases in the cost of living. Or I suppose you can say it's the equivalent of a tax cut for all which one may argue is good) there are some other useful comments.

    "by inhuman_4 ( 1294516 ) on Thursday March 05, 2020 @07:41PM (#59801270)
    The report shows nearly three-quarters of respondents who were working when the pilot project began kept at it despite receiving basic income. That finding appears to contradict the criticism some levelled at the project, saying it would sap people's motivation to stay in the workforce or seek employment.

    Contradict the criticism? More than 25% of employed people quit working when they start getting basic income. That sounds like a pretty clear cut confirmation to me! Worse the whole report is based on a self-reported online survey, and written by a pro-basic income advocacy group. No doubt an actual review based on hard data would be much less flattering. As would a study that includes the hard part of basic income: raising taxes to pay for it. Handing out free money or pumping it in to a local community is easy. Close the loop and let see how well the system can sustain itself.
    ...
    "

    https://news.slashdot.org/story/20/03/05/2024220/people-kept-working-became-healthier-while-on-basic-income-report [slashdot.org]

    "by Jane Q. Public ( 1010737 ) on Thursday March 05, 2020 @08:03PM (#59801374)

    See my other post further down the page.

    Most attempts at UBI-like systems were with far more people, and lasted longer.

    And they all failed. Because many people stopped working.

    But you need time to really see that happening. People aren't going to change their ways overnight."

    Another person notes

    "by sabbede ( 2678435 ) on Friday March 06, 2020 @10:42AM (#59802974)
    The survey had a lousy response rate. 217 out of about 4000. So, it was pretty much worthless."

    and those that do fill out the surveys are probably less lazy, and benefited more, than those that didn't. So they aren't exactly a representative sample of everyone that participated in the study. The fact that so few people even filled out the survey says something about the majority of the people that participated. They received all this free money that someone else paid for and they aren't even grateful enough to, and they're too lazy to even, fill out a survey? Really? Ingrates. They don't deserve this money.

    "by Oligonicella ( 659917 ) on Thursday March 05, 2020 @08:44PM (#59801474)
    I know of one where many of the people who quit working took the opportunity to pursue further education which could give them a more promising career than the one they had before

    Perhaps a cite would bolster your case. Would also be interesting to know if those people actually went out and *got* the new promising career."

    It would be interesting to note what percentage of people that receive UBI spend it on education, get their degrees, and get a good job as a result. Because if my taxpayer money is going to go to this I want to know the results of where my money is going.