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posted by martyb on Monday July 06 2020, @08:43AM   Printer-friendly
from the a-snitch-in-time-saves-nine dept.

NY partygoers get subpoenas after stonewalling COVID-19 contact tracers:

Test, isolate, trace, quarantine: these are the bedrock public health measures proven effective at stamping out an infectious disease before it flares to the point where the only option left is to foist draconian lockdowns on whole populations.

[...] On Wednesday, officials in Rockland County—just north of New York City—reported a cluster of cases linked to a recent party of up to 100 people largely in their early 20s. At the time of the party, the host was infected and had symptoms but held the party anyway.

So far, at least eight attendees have tested positive for the virus. But many partygoers have refused to work with public health officials to track the potential spread and notify others who may have been infected and could go on to spread the disease further.

"We are not receiving the necessary cooperation when we contact those who are positive for COVID-19 or those who have been at some of these gatherings," Dr. Patricia Schnabel Ruppert, Rockland County's health commissioner said at a press briefing Wednesday.

She explained:

My staff has been told that a person does not wish to, or have to, speak to my disease investigators. They hang up. They deny being at the party even though we have found their name from another party attendee or a parent provides us with the information. Many do not answer their cell phones and do not call back. Sometimes parents answer for their adult children and promise that they have been home consistently when they have not been.

This must stop.

In response, Ruppert announced that the county will issue subpoenas to anyone who refuses to cooperate with contact tracing. So far, the county is processing eight subpoenas. In addition, those who do not comply will face civil fines of around $2,000 every day they are out of compliance.


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  • (Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @11:35AM (31 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @11:35AM (#1016952)

    As an American, I don't imagine the EU to be at all similar to the US - they still have very much separate countries, cultures, languages, and governments. A good bunch of them still have feudal lords, even if they are largely symbolic!
    In American public school, I was taught that my own government is the greatest danger to my life and liberty, and that it's my responsibility as an American to be vigilant and ready to take up arms against that government. How did you learn to think about yours?

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  • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Dr Spin on Monday July 06 2020, @12:10PM (4 children)

    by Dr Spin (5239) on Monday July 06 2020, @12:10PM (#1016969)

    We think the purpose of government is as a way to organise and manage things that happen at a country wide scale which has the
    general approval of all.

    We also think that the process for doing this is not very good, but no one has thought of a better one. If they do, we will probably adopt it.

    It helps to have a figurehead whose predecessors had a discussion that went:

    King: I am King. God made me king. I will do as I please
    People: You are king because we consent. We might withdraw our consent if you continue with this foolishness.
    K: I am King. God made me king. I will do as I please
    P: "Off with his head" (Head rolls)

    or

    Queen: "What is that god-awful racket outside"
    Advisor: "The people are hungry and crying out for bread"
    Q: "Let them eat cake"
    People: "Off with their heads" (Large number of heads roll)

    Having a "leader" that understands that issuing executive orders may lead to the immediate death of themselves,
    their entire family, and all their friends, and other random other people is clearly an excellent idea.

    As someone once wrote "fear of death concentrates the mind wonderfully"

    However, having a leader incapable of "understanding" probably defeats the entire strategy at base 1.

    YMMV

    --
    Warning: Opening your mouth may invalidate your brain!
    • (Score: 2, Insightful) by fustakrakich on Monday July 06 2020, @05:40PM

      by fustakrakich (6150) on Monday July 06 2020, @05:40PM (#1017180) Journal

      Having a "leader" that understands that issuing executive orders may lead to the immediate death of themselves,
      their entire family, and all their friends, and other random other people is clearly an excellent idea.

      The Sword of Damocles. It's up to us to keep it in proper working order.

      --
      La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
    • (Score: 2) by PartTimeZombie on Monday July 06 2020, @11:43PM (1 child)

      by PartTimeZombie (4827) on Monday July 06 2020, @11:43PM (#1017395)

      But Americans are so vigilant and ready to take up arms against that government.

      They never actually have, except for that time when some of them wanted to continue to own people like they were livestock, but other than that they won't.

      They do boast an awful lot about how they're just about going to though.

      I'm sure their ruling class are just terrified.

      • (Score: 2) by Opportunist on Wednesday July 08 2020, @09:53AM

        by Opportunist (5545) on Wednesday July 08 2020, @09:53AM (#1018122)

        The US citizens will never rise against their government. Never. Because their government knows one thing that has been true for times immemorial: Keep your population fed and entertained, and they will not rise up against you. Panem et circenses worked in Roman times and it has worked ever since. When you take a look at the history of revolutions, you'll notice that the only ones that were successful were either led by the ruling classes or were fought by people with their back against the wall whose options were basically to die in a revolution war or to die without putting up a fight.

        In the end, though, all those revolutions led to were a difference in who gets to call the shots. They didn't change jack shit for the subjects.

    • (Score: 1) by Opportunist on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:43PM

      by Opportunist (5545) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:43PM (#1017586)

      As someone once wrote "fear of death concentrates the mind wonderfully"

      Who said that, Stalin?

  • (Score: 1) by Opportunist on Monday July 06 2020, @12:26PM

    by Opportunist (5545) on Monday July 06 2020, @12:26PM (#1016975)

    Our "political education" pretty much deals with the mechanics of democracy and how various forms of government work, but it does not qualify them in any way, neither as a force to be followed without questioning or a danger to liberty if it becomes overbearing. There's a general "nudge" to democracy being the best system available because it means that you get a say in matters rather than just being subject to some sort of ruler, but aside of that there's not much in terms of "coloring".

    I guess it has less to do with education and more with how our governments are generally perceived. Yes, we do complain and lament about them as much as anyone, but at the core we do expect them (and so far at least with good reason) that when push comes to shove (like now) that they get their shit together and do what's necessary, and keep the cronyism at bay 'til the danger is averted and we're back to business as usual.

    Oddly, that seems to work. No idea why, but it does.

  • (Score: 5, Informative) by epitaxial on Monday July 06 2020, @12:34PM (12 children)

    by epitaxial (3165) on Monday July 06 2020, @12:34PM (#1016982)

    Yeah they never taught that in school. The more you talk the worse you sound.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @12:40PM (11 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @12:40PM (#1016986)

      Really? You didn't study the constitution every year, and discuss it in depth, and what it means?

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @12:49PM (10 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @12:49PM (#1016989)

        That's what you remember from studying the constitution?

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:01PM (9 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:01PM (#1016992)

          That's what was drilled into me by all history teachers. Why did the colonies revolt, why the articles of confederation failed, the reasoning behind every clause of the constitution and the bill of rights - those were the questions we dealt with every year in US history. I was very much taught that blind nationalism is a bad thing and that we must all strive for democracy to work, and that it was our duty to grab the ammo box if the soap box stopped working.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:01PM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:01PM (#1016993)

            * ballot box not soap

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @02:23PM (1 child)

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @02:23PM (#1017041)

              Why that correction? Isn't it ballot box < soap box < ammo box ?

              I.e. if you don't like the choices on your voting ballot, try to form your own movement before resorting to revolt? Or has your education successfully convinced you to never even try to take part in democratic society? Because you're right in the rest of your statement, blind nationalism is a bad thing and everyone must strive to make democracy work. That's why I'm surprised everyone is so eager to discard the "soap box" option, and play the Trumpnationalist card instead.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @02:26PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @02:26PM (#1017042)

                If we were picking up the guns, you would know. I'm not a Trump supporter either, I'm a member of the fucking SEP!

          • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:17PM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:17PM (#1016999)

            Let me guess: You were educated in the south.

            • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Monday July 06 2020, @01:28PM

              by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday July 06 2020, @01:28PM (#1017009) Journal

              I was taught this in the West as well. Maybe it's only in the large urban centers that they did not teach the core principals of the American system.

              --
              Washington DC delenda est.
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:35PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:35PM (#1017015)

              Northern Midwest.

          • (Score: 2) by epitaxial on Monday July 06 2020, @05:19PM (2 children)

            by epitaxial (3165) on Monday July 06 2020, @05:19PM (#1017160)

            I think you are confusing school with Rush Limbaugh.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @05:53PM (1 child)

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @05:53PM (#1017192)

              I think you're a kneejerking jackass, but it's cool. That's literally what I and many others were told in school. I don't see anything wrong with that, but I was mainly attempting to demonstrate the level of distrust of government inoculated into Americans from a young age. Where did you go to school, and what did they tell you?

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @11:36PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @11:36PM (#1017392)

                I was most certainly taught the same as you were. I think far too many people were mind-numbed into becoming part of the Collective (herd?).

                The only real reason to distrust government is: it's made of PEOPLE. People are imperfect. And, most importantly, try really hard (those of you who are mind-numbed) to think about the motivations of people who wish to be in power.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @03:30PM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @03:30PM (#1017069)

    In American public school, I was taught that my own government is the greatest danger to my life and liberty, and that it's my responsibility as an American to be vigilant and ready to take up arms against that government.

    And that is why we have to close public schools and abolish the Dept of Education. Am I saying the right thing?

    • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @03:45PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @03:45PM (#1017087)

      No. That's true anti-fascism. The power is in the people's hands, and it's staying there.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @06:35PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @06:35PM (#1017226)

      yes. the dept of ed and "public schools" are run by cultural marxists brainwashing kids against their own people. shut that shit down and make parents do their fucking job. When they can barely get by, maybe they'll do their goddamn duty as citizens and force political change.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:15PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:15PM (#1017323)

        They are not "our people", it is you and a polished white turd in your pocket. Nice try, Vladimir!

  • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:14PM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:14PM (#1017321)

    As an American, I don't imagine the EU to be at all similar to the US -

    American exceptionalism, where Americans think they are exempted from things like knowledge and education. Of course you don't imagine, being an American! You probably cannot identify Europe on a map! You are a crippled monoglot, and you only speak one language, and that one badly! You have no self-awareness, no idea how parochial, xenophobic, and idiophallic your world view is! You president is a representative sample of American idiocy. Point taken.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:22PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:22PM (#1017327)

      No, their systems are not similar at all, except in that there's nominal democracy. I would love to see an America with real social services and good governance. I don't want to see us disarmed under a totalitarian police state.

      • (Score: 2) by PartTimeZombie on Monday July 06 2020, @11:55PM (1 child)

        by PartTimeZombie (4827) on Monday July 06 2020, @11:55PM (#1017401)

        ...except in that there's nominal democracy.

        I see you've never been to Europe. Also, don't believe what the Murdoch media tells you about the EU, its all lies.

        I would love to see an America with real social services and good governance.

        You've had more than 200 years to get that project under way. It's not going to happen, is it?

        I don't want to see us disarmed under a totalitarian police state.

        Why would that have to be the only other option?

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 07 2020, @01:03AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 07 2020, @01:03AM (#1017440)

          You mean there is no democracy, or it's less nominal than ours?
          I don't think America will survive in anything more than name, if that. The next hundred years will make us or break us as a species anyway though, so I'm not too concerned. WWIII or Space Race II - maybe both at once.
          The only reason Aristarchus or his equally annoying AC clone took issue with what I posted above is they saw "take up arms" and assumed I'm some militia methhead or boomer blowhard. I was just stating what they told me in school two decades ago.

  • (Score: 2) by dry on Tuesday July 07 2020, @04:47AM (2 children)

    by dry (223) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @04:47AM (#1017512) Journal

    In American public school, I was taught that my own government is the greatest danger to my life and liberty, and that it's my responsibility as an American to be vigilant and ready to take up arms against that government. How did you learn to think about yours?

    When I went to school, I was also taught the American government was the greatest danger to my life and liberty. Even had example such as the Vietnam war, the war on drugs and how America gave its people a choice between Coke and Pepsi and called it freedom.

    • (Score: 1) by Opportunist on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:36AM (1 child)

      by Opportunist (5545) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:36AM (#1017534)

      US politics is actually a lot like the choice between Coke and Pepsi...

      • (Score: 2) by dry on Tuesday July 07 2020, @02:10PM

        by dry (223) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @02:10PM (#1017642) Journal

        Exactly, and back then 7UP was basically illegal.

  • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @07:12AM

    by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @07:12AM (#1017526) Homepage
    The difference is that we have a closer approximation to democracy in the EU (the UK only barely does, but isn't EU, so doesn't count). We're taught to vote for people we actually trust and want in power, because that's who will get in power once the votes are counted if enough people want them.
    --
    Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves