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posted by martyb on Monday July 06 2020, @08:43AM   Printer-friendly
from the a-snitch-in-time-saves-nine dept.

NY partygoers get subpoenas after stonewalling COVID-19 contact tracers:

Test, isolate, trace, quarantine: these are the bedrock public health measures proven effective at stamping out an infectious disease before it flares to the point where the only option left is to foist draconian lockdowns on whole populations.

[...] On Wednesday, officials in Rockland County—just north of New York City—reported a cluster of cases linked to a recent party of up to 100 people largely in their early 20s. At the time of the party, the host was infected and had symptoms but held the party anyway.

So far, at least eight attendees have tested positive for the virus. But many partygoers have refused to work with public health officials to track the potential spread and notify others who may have been infected and could go on to spread the disease further.

"We are not receiving the necessary cooperation when we contact those who are positive for COVID-19 or those who have been at some of these gatherings," Dr. Patricia Schnabel Ruppert, Rockland County's health commissioner said at a press briefing Wednesday.

She explained:

My staff has been told that a person does not wish to, or have to, speak to my disease investigators. They hang up. They deny being at the party even though we have found their name from another party attendee or a parent provides us with the information. Many do not answer their cell phones and do not call back. Sometimes parents answer for their adult children and promise that they have been home consistently when they have not been.

This must stop.

In response, Ruppert announced that the county will issue subpoenas to anyone who refuses to cooperate with contact tracing. So far, the county is processing eight subpoenas. In addition, those who do not comply will face civil fines of around $2,000 every day they are out of compliance.


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  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by driverless on Monday July 06 2020, @11:50AM (30 children)

    by driverless (4770) on Monday July 06 2020, @11:50AM (#1016960)

    And if you don't want to take the EU, take the United States of Australia, which is also a bunch of federated states in which each one can pretty much do whatever it damn well pleases. Main difference is that they have leadership at the national level. Granted he's an asshole, but at least he's an asshole who's managing the pandemic well.

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  • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @12:41PM (25 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @12:41PM (#1016987)

    Doing a lockdown with no reason to, nor any explainable benefit from (can you keep bunkering down in fear of that "second wave" for a decade?). How and for whom it has done good?

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by c0lo on Monday July 06 2020, @02:59PM (24 children)

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 06 2020, @02:59PM (#1017055) Journal

      Doing a lockdown with no reason to

      1. Doing a lockdown based on the models of possible outcomes early in March
      2. admitting those are models and adjusting the length and severity of the lockdowns as we progressed in the pandemic
      3. even applying harder lockdown on smaller areas [vic.gov.au] due to clusters caused by various reasons [theguardian.com]

      Things like that, yeah.

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @05:02PM (23 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @05:02PM (#1017147)

        What are the "we"? Weren't you being an European some posts ago?
        Anyway, WHAT is the positive side of "applying harder lockdown" now when the very fact of "clusters caused by various reasons" NOW demonstrates that the lockdown game can NOT do anything useful? Except kill the economy dead, that is.

        • (Score: 2, Touché) by Opportunist on Monday July 06 2020, @05:42PM (4 children)

          by Opportunist (5545) on Monday July 06 2020, @05:42PM (#1017182)

          Yeah, fuck the people, save the economy!

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:47PM (3 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @09:47PM (#1017339)

            You can survive without the economy? Go ahead with your photosynthesis then, but we the squishy humans do need to eat to remain alive.
            If instead the case is the username mirrors your source of income, do consider that a shrunken economy is also less money to spend on lowly propaganda mooks.

            • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Opportunist on Monday July 06 2020, @10:24PM (2 children)

              by Opportunist (5545) on Monday July 06 2020, @10:24PM (#1017360)

              I can survive without the economy. Because, guess what, there will be some economy as long as there are people.

              On the other hand, when I'm dead, I can't give half a shit about the economy.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:49PM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:49PM (#1017374)

                Bold words, but will you survive, say, a mugging? Desperate people kill for any paltry thing.
                Your error is, you equate "some economy" with "civilized economy". There are many places on this world, that have convincingly proven otherwise to their denizens.

                • (Score: 1) by Opportunist on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:29AM

                  by Opportunist (5545) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:29AM (#1017532)

                  Your error is, you equate your shithole of a country that shits on its people and doesn't leave them anything to lose (which history taught us over here is a BAD thing, once in 1789 and again in 1917) with sensible countries that made sure that people don't have to get desperate just because the economy takes a downturn.

                  Yes, I'm fairly sure I won't get mugged.

        • (Score: 3, Interesting) by c0lo on Monday July 06 2020, @10:17PM (15 children)

          by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 06 2020, @10:17PM (#1017352) Journal

          What are the "we"? Weren't you being an European some posts ago?

          Former east-european, immigrant down-under, currently living in Melbourne.

          Anyway, WHAT is the positive side of "applying harder lockdown" now when the very fact of "clusters caused by various reasons" NOW demonstrates that the lockdown game can NOT do anything useful?

          You're an idiot. Queensland, South Australia, Tasmania, Northern Territory are free of covid because of the previous lockdowns and are currently opened.
          New South Wales is opened as well, with new daily cases varying around 10.

          Would have been the same in Victoria, if not for some idiots [soylentnews.org].

          --
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:38PM (12 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:38PM (#1017370)

            Former east-european, immigrant down-under, currently living in Melbourne.

            Let's hope the story won't get even more complicated in a month or two. *wink*

            You're an idiot. Queensland, South Australia, Tasmania, Northern Territory are free of covid because of the previous lockdowns and are currently opened.

            Meanwhile in the East Europe, Latvia is practically free of same despite no lockdowns, and is currently a month into reducing the distancing; therefore, the mantle of an idiot firmly stays with you. Wear it with pride!

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by c0lo on Monday July 06 2020, @10:45PM (2 children)

              by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 06 2020, @10:45PM (#1017373) Journal

              Former east-european, immigrant down-under, currently living in Melbourne.

              Let's hope the story won't get even more complicated in a month or two. *wink*

              Never changed since 2004.

              Meanwhile in the East Europe, Latvia is practically free of same despite no lockdowns

              If Latvia managed to do it, explain why can't US do the same?

              --
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:51PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:51PM (#1017375)

                If Latvia managed to do it, explain why can't US do the same?

                Isn't it the $3,000,000,000,000 question?

              • (Score: 4, Informative) by RS3 on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:19AM

                by RS3 (6367) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:19AM (#1017417)

                "Why can't the US do the same." Part of the problem is that we're freer than maybe most of the rest of the world realizes. We love the words "freedom" and "independence". Our country was founded in Independence Hall in Philadelphia. (Too many) Americans have very free spirit, "I'll do it my way" attitudes that often defy wisdom, intelligence, and greater public opinion and good, just to flaunt their freedom and independence. A good thing taken too far sometimes.

                And, as others here have pointed out, many simply don't trust the government. So bash the US government all you want, but remember: far too many Americans aren't going to obey. I personally know people who think the whole thing is either made up, or some kind of exaggeration to control people. Ridiculous of course.

                And how can the government know what to do when they don't know what's going on because of a lack of testing? Blame government, I know, but realize: criminals sold bogus tests to the government.

                You'll rightfully want citation and I neglected to bookmark a recent article chronicling COVID in the US, but basically it started way back in December and January when there were only a few cases identified on the West Coast. But people generally can't keep in mind many simultaneous dynamic situations. At that time there were thousands of infected but asymptomatic people flying in from China. Even when there were travel restrictions, quarantine and "stay at home" orders, the infected people flew in and interacted without masks. So the disease spread like wildfire. Hopefully most here understand the concept of exponential growth. As we've all heard ad nauseam, testing lagged, and even now we're not sure about testing because IT'S POSSIBLE TO BE INFECTED BUT TEST NEGATIVE.

                Not defending the mass idiocy, but one of many things I've observed for years: people in Eastern Asia, Japan especially, often wear surgical masks in public, going about their daily business. I've always seen it as a sign of higher social consciousness and just plain hygiene. I can not and am not speaking for America in general, but perhaps (subconsciously?) Americans generally thing of mask-wearing as culturally different? And/or a fashion statement?

                A week ago I and a couple of other people helped someone move. You know, box up stuff, carry boxes, load in truck, etc. The someone moving turned out to be a doctor who happened to be from India. We moving helpers wore masks, but he (the doctor) did not, nor did his female Chinese roommate (who I believe was also a doctor). I did not ask why he didn't wear a mask, but I assumed he knew what he was doing- that he's probably getting tested and contact traced a lot. But he could have been infected and not know it.

            • (Score: 3, Informative) by fido_dogstoyevsky on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:14AM (8 children)

              by fido_dogstoyevsky (131) <axehandleNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:14AM (#1017415)

              ...Latvia is practically free of same despite no lockdowns...

              Uhmmm - no. [corona.help]

              Latvias' population is about two million.

              Sweden tried avoiding lockdowns and achieved a truly appalling death rate [corona.help] (population about 10 million), worse than the US (but Trump is working to fix that).

              --
              It's NOT a conspiracy... it's a plot.
              • (Score: 3, Informative) by fido_dogstoyevsky on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:23AM (4 children)

                by fido_dogstoyevsky (131) <axehandleNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:23AM (#1017423)

                ...Latvia is practically free of same despite no lockdowns...

                Uhmmm - no [quibbling about "practically free]...

                Actually, the "despite no lockdowns" part was also not correct. [wikipedia.org]

                --
                It's NOT a conspiracy... it's a plot.
                • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @07:25AM (3 children)

                  by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @07:25AM (#1017527) Homepage
                  Bzzzt!

                  No lockdowns. Urging people to stay at home and be responsible and socially distance when they do go out to the shops, and bars and restaurants - some of whom have remained open the whole time - is *not* in any way shape of form "lockdown".

                  Latvia's been pretty much identical to the fellow Baltic Bubble member Estonia where I live, and I've been to a pub or restaurant *every single day* since January.

                  I repeat - no lockdowns, please stop talking out of your arse.
                  --
                  Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
                  • (Score: 2) by fido_dogstoyevsky on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:09PM (2 children)

                    by fido_dogstoyevsky (131) <axehandleNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:09PM (#1017571)

                    ...Urging people to stay at home and be responsible and socially distance when they do go out to the shops, and bars and restaurants - some of whom have remained open the whole time - is *not* in any way shape of form "lockdown"...

                    Sounds damned close to our lockdown. Although food and drink are only take away.

                    --
                    It's NOT a conspiracy... it's a plot.
                    • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:48PM

                      by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:48PM (#1017589) Homepage
                      Please learn what the pertinent words mean before enterring into an argument. That's not a lockdown.

                      Handy hint if you can't work it out - no doors were forced to remain closed.
                      --
                      Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
                    • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:54PM

                      by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:54PM (#1017595) Homepage
                      Yup, I have proof you're either an idiot or a troll

                      You call the above "a lockdown".
                      Yet earlier (but lower) in the thread you say "Sweden had no lockdown."

                      Yet the Latvian and Swedish responses were almost identical, almost all sectors of society were treated in exactly the same way (Latvia was even looser for some subsets), mostly just a few arbitrary numbers that don't pertain to locked-down-or-not-ness were different.

                      Make your mind up - is having the business open and freedom of movement preserved "a lockdown" or "no lockdown"?
                      --
                      Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
              • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @07:40AM (2 children)

                by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @07:40AM (#1017529) Homepage
                A thousand cases in a population of two million for an important regional land-connected transport hub (many of the Estonian cases can be traced to Riga airport) is getting off pretty much scot free when the R_0 of this thing was looking like it was about 5. That's twice as good as the *best* continental US state (and also better than non-continental Hawaii), 20x better than your average, and 60x better than some similarly sized countries. It's a genuinely low number. Most lower numbers you will find will be one of (a) island states; (b) ones with a history of pandemics and immediate response; or (c) countries who haven't really had it arrive yet.

                And what's the fuck has Sweden got to do with Latvia? Take step back and look at your (failure at maintaining a coherent) argument:
                  A: Latvia's practically free from it
                  B: Sweden has loads of cases
                ?!?!??
                --
                Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
                • (Score: 2) by fido_dogstoyevsky on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:12PM (1 child)

                  by fido_dogstoyevsky (131) <axehandleNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:12PM (#1017572)

                  ...B: Sweden has loads of cases

                  Sweden had no lockdown.

                  And better than the US is a REALLY low bar.

                  --
                  It's NOT a conspiracy... it's a plot.
                  • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:45PM

                    by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:45PM (#1017587) Homepage
                    Fuck me, you're stupid.

                    The whole point of me repeating was because your mentioning Sweden is utterly *irrelevant* in a discussion about Latvia.

                    And you do it again!
                    --
                    Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
          • (Score: 2) by fido_dogstoyevsky on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:01AM (1 child)

            by fido_dogstoyevsky (131) <axehandleNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:01AM (#1017407)

            ...Queensland, South Australia, Tasmania, Northern Territory are free of covid because of the previous lockdowns and are currently opened.
            New South Wales is opened as well, with new daily cases varying around 10.

            Would have been the same in Victoria, if not for some idiots

            Vic/NSW border closing to keep NSW safe. As a Victorian I can only praise Andrews, Berejiklian and Morrison for doing so.

            I've just said something good about three politicians (let alone one) - really never thought I'd do that.

            --
            It's NOT a conspiracy... it's a plot.
            • (Score: 3, Informative) by c0lo on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:44AM

              by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:44AM (#1017435) Journal

              Vic/NSW border closing to keep NSW safe. As a Victorian I can only praise Andrews, Berejiklian and Morrison for doing so.

              Heh, I have a higher bar for "deserving praise", this is common** sense.

              ** something that the Americans seem to lack. Likely too individualists [soylentnews.org] to have something in common.

              --
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
        • (Score: 2) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:01AM (1 child)

          by PartTimeZombie (4827) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:01AM (#1017406)

          c0lo has always been an Aussie.

          The country right next door to him completely locked down for a month. We now have exactly no community spread of Covid-19 and are living our lives in a more-or-less normal matter because we locked down hard that one time.

          Go on, tell me again how terrible that has been for everyone and how our "rights" have been taken away.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:21AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:21AM (#1017420)

            I'm super-impressed. Maybe if Americans spent less time bashing their own government and more time working together it would have been different.

  • (Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:43PM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @01:43PM (#1017023)

    Granted he's an asshole, but at least he's an asshole who's managing the pandemic well.

    Wow .... I guess you get what you deserve if you think he's managing anything well. He can't even manage his dick well or his makeup.

    https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/06/24/883154244/trump-administration-moving-to-close-federally-funded-covid-testing-sites [npr.org]

    • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @02:31PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @02:31PM (#1017044)

      GP was talking about the PM of Australia. Last I checked, he wasn't called Trump [wikipedia.org].

      • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Monday July 06 2020, @03:01PM

        by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 06 2020, @03:01PM (#1017056) Journal

        Oh God, thanks for that!

        --
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 2) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:06AM

        by PartTimeZombie (4827) on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:06AM (#1017409)

        It's Gaz isn't it?