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NY partygoers get subpoenas after stonewalling COVID-19 contact tracers:
Test, isolate, trace, quarantine: these are the bedrock public health measures proven effective at stamping out an infectious disease before it flares to the point where the only option left is to foist draconian lockdowns on whole populations.
[...] On Wednesday, officials in Rockland County—just north of New York City—reported a cluster of cases linked to a recent party of up to 100 people largely in their early 20s. At the time of the party, the host was infected and had symptoms but held the party anyway.
So far, at least eight attendees have tested positive for the virus. But many partygoers have refused to work with public health officials to track the potential spread and notify others who may have been infected and could go on to spread the disease further.
"We are not receiving the necessary cooperation when we contact those who are positive for COVID-19 or those who have been at some of these gatherings," Dr. Patricia Schnabel Ruppert, Rockland County's health commissioner said at a press briefing Wednesday.
She explained:
My staff has been told that a person does not wish to, or have to, speak to my disease investigators. They hang up. They deny being at the party even though we have found their name from another party attendee or a parent provides us with the information. Many do not answer their cell phones and do not call back. Sometimes parents answer for their adult children and promise that they have been home consistently when they have not been.
This must stop.
In response, Ruppert announced that the county will issue subpoenas to anyone who refuses to cooperate with contact tracing. So far, the county is processing eight subpoenas. In addition, those who do not comply will face civil fines of around $2,000 every day they are out of compliance.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @12:35PM (13 children)
The first are nice as talking points, but quickly cause irreversible slide down the second, unless the third are firmly set and adhered to.
Plainly, if you do a "compromise" every time someone is forcing you to, in time you lose everything. There must be a point where you stand your ground, if you don't want be reduced to less than livestock.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @04:10PM (11 children)
A reasonable point. However, I don't see how that applies to efforts to limit the spread of a deadly disease for which we have no immunity. Please elucidate.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @05:22PM (10 children)
Please look at actual statistics and observed hard facts, before spreading the journalistic verbiage of "a deadly disease", "efforts to limit the spread" and "we have no immunity". No one in the wide world is paid to enlighten you; you have to spend effort yourself, or be misled.
Some elucidation, given as you asked nicely; on the actual deadliness, and on immunity:
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm#AgeAndSex [cdc.gov] (open the "Table 1" and study the data some)
https://swprs.org/studies-on-covid-19-lethality/ [swprs.org]
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/exposure-common-cold-could-provide-immunity-covid-19/ [telegraph.co.uk]
As to "limiting the spread", the news of re-lockdown are quite easy to find.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @06:35PM (9 children)
There have been more than 500,000 "excess" deaths associated with COVID-19. Should we ignore that?
Are you claiming that the data (see links immediately below) is a lie?
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/us-map [jhu.edu]
https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page [nyc.gov]
https://data.ny.gov/browse?tags=covid-19 [ny.gov]
Gee, that's strange. NYC just entered Phase III of re-opening today. No re-lockdowns here. In fact, the places which implemented stay at home and face covering policies (with the exception of California) are doing *much* better than states that did not:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/new-cases-50-states [jhu.edu]
In fact, New York State has maintained its downward rates of infection positive tests (1.1%) , deaths (8) and total hospitalizations (844).
Managing this is a local thing. If folks in a city/county are doing their part to reduce the spread of this *deadly* (535,000+ excess deaths is deadly, or those 535,000+ people would still be alive).
I wonder why that might be, especially given the enormously high population density of NYC compared with other places?
Not because anyone is holding a gun to anyone's head, that's for sure.
Number of arrests in NYC for non-mask wearing: 0
Number of arrests in NYC for lack of social distancing: 0
I'm still not sure what point you're trying to make. We have a pretty good idea as to how to get Coronavirus under control:
1. Social distancing;
2. Widespread testing;
3. Widespread contact tracing of infected persons;
4. Self-isolation of infected/exposed persons.
In places where the above is happening, Coronavirus is being brought under control. In places where it is not, Coronavirus is raging out of control.
This isn't an issue of liberty. Your right to freedom of association and movement does *not* include the right to infect me (or anyone else) with a potentially deadly pathogen.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @06:47PM (2 children)
"This isn't an issue of liberty. Your right to freedom of association and movement does *not* include the right to infect me (or anyone else) with a potentially deadly pathogen."
Look, you stupid bitch. I'm not responsible for fucking nature or microscopic pathogens that i didn't create or force into your body. Nor am i responsible for your chicken shit immune system. Fuck off and die! Who cares. All you are is a liability to free peoples everywhere.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @07:22PM (1 child)
Why don't you go and shoot up your local public health office like you say you want to do.
Hopefully, you haven't reproduced and, as such, the extant gene pool will be positively impacted.
Kissy, kissy baby.
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:18PM
And thus the lefties' real "respect for life" shines again.
Then tomorrow you'll scream and rant why no one with a brain believes a word you, or your leaders, say.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 06 2020, @10:15PM (5 children)
Do you really not understand the difference between "associated with" and "caused by"?
As to your "excess deaths" you pulled from somewhere unnamed; Latvia, for one example, had no excess deaths and no lockdown. I wonder why; don't you?
The bosses at WHO disagree. And observing the current situation in Australia, Israel, etc., the previous lockdowns there definitely hadn't got anything "under control"; the actual results look like "delaying the inevitable" instead.
Given that any part of humans' essential microbiota is potentially deadly to immunocompromised individuals, this totally IS an issue of liberty. You (or anyone else) do not have the right to cage everyone else to protect (or "protect") your singular self. Saying what you did, you are not thinking straight at best.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:21AM (2 children)
It had no lockdown, but it introduced sensible restrictions on large gatherings, social distancing measures, home quarantining for positive cases, extensive testing and contact tracing right from a very early stage (literally days after its first case). It was an "Emergency" response, and people knew that, and they respected that.
However, those emergency NPI measures would create a dip in the expected death rate, the flu is also retarded in its spread and people are adopting more risk-averse behaviours hygiene-wise, so even staying perfectly in the middle of the expected mortality band would imply that there were a significant number of deaths directly attributable to CoViD-19.
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:43AM (1 child)
Johns Hopkins says [jhu.edu] that in Latvia there were
1184 confirmed COVID-19 cases
30 deaths related to COVID0-19
Out of a population of ~2 million.
Not sure why I even bothered feeding the troll (GP, that is).
(Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 07 2020, @01:07PM
What I was saying was that in times of extensive NPI, "no excess deaths" doesn't tell the whole story about the effect of the disease.
Of course, given that the last time I looked (may/june) Latvia had not published any excess mortality figures centrally with the European medical statistics board, your assertion that it has no excess mortality might be nothing but fabrication. However, 30 deaths is a damn low number, there's even a chance that CoViD-19 and the NPIs have caused *negative* excess deaths.
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:49AM
Cage? Who is being caged? Did you not take your meds today?
You don't have the right to get in my face and spew on me. People have been shot for less.
You're a moron. Stay the hell away from me, asshole.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 07 2020, @08:53AM
It was named all right, moron. It was linked in the comment you replied to:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html [jhu.edu]
(Score: 2) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday July 07 2020, @12:07AM
That doesn't follow at all.
Or it doesn't have to at least.