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posted by martyb on Friday July 24 2020, @09:27AM   Printer-friendly
from the counting-is-hard-when-it-counts dept.

With No Final Say, Trump Wants To Change Who Counts For Dividing Up Congress' Seats:

President Trump released a memorandum Tuesday that calls for an unprecedented change to the constitutionally mandated count of every person living in the country — the exclusion of unauthorized immigrants from the numbers used to divide up seats in Congress among the states.

The memo instructs Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross, who oversees the Commerce Department, to include in the legally required report of census results to the president "information permitting the President, to the extent practicable" to leave out the number of immigrants living in the U.S. without authorization from the apportionment count.

But the move by the president, who does not have final authority over the census, is more likely to spur legal challenges and political spectacle in the last months before this year's presidential election than a transformation of the once-a-decade head count, which has been disrupted by the coronavirus pandemic.

[...] Since the first U.S. census in 1790, both U.S. citizens and noncitizens — regardless of immigration status — have been included in the country's official population counts.

The fifth sentence of the Constitution specifies that "persons" residing in the states should be counted every 10 years to determine each state's share of seats in the House of Representatives. The 14th Amendment, which ended the counting of an enslaved person as "three fifths" of a free person, goes further to require the counting of the "whole number of persons in each state."

It is Congress — not the president — that Article 1, Section 2 of the country's founding document empowers to carry out the "actual enumeration" of the country's population in "such manner as they shall by law direct."

In Title 2 of the U.S. Code, Congress detailed its instructions for the president to report to lawmakers the tally of the "whole number of persons" living in each state for the reapportionment of House seats. In Title 13, Congress established additional key dates for the "tabulation of total population."


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  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @01:35PM (8 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @01:35PM (#1025754)

    In case you were just born yesterday, there have been myriad problems with vote tabulation throughout history. High-tech has added new layers of potential problems, including "hacking".

  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by khallow on Friday July 24 2020, @02:39PM (3 children)

    by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday July 24 2020, @02:39PM (#1025785) Journal
    I knew of those problems when I wrote my post. Perhaps you should reread it with that new information in mind.
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @03:54PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @03:54PM (#1025817)

      You get 2 upmods sir.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @03:57PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @03:57PM (#1025818)

      Apologies- my post was meant for previous AC. Human error; corrections not allowed.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @06:19PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 24 2020, @06:19PM (#1025877)

      But, khallow was born yesterday, he's a Millenniall.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by khallow on Saturday July 25 2020, @05:33AM

    by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Saturday July 25 2020, @05:33AM (#1026089) Journal
    Since several people seem to be having the same misconceptions, I'll point out that the "problems" above mean that exit polling may still be a more accurate estimate of the vote than the official tally of the vote. Even with people like the previous AC who claim they deliberately lie to polls.
  • (Score: 2) by Mykl on Sunday July 26 2020, @09:06AM (2 children)

    by Mykl (1112) on Sunday July 26 2020, @09:06AM (#1026503)

    there have been myriad problems with vote tabulation throughout history

    Oh, OK. I guess we don't need to worry about trying to fix it then.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 27 2020, @02:53PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 27 2020, @02:53PM (#1027116)

      No, by all means, keep on worrying. That approach has worked so well so far. Sorry for the sarcasm, but as far as I can tell society is full of problems that never get fixed. Do you have any suggestions for fixing the problem?

      • (Score: 2) by Mykl on Monday July 27 2020, @11:25PM

        by Mykl (1112) on Monday July 27 2020, @11:25PM (#1027387)

        Do you have any suggestions for fixing the problem?

        Yes.

        1. Get rid of electronic voting. It's proven to be too unreliable and non-verifiable. I know that irregularities predate it, but there are far worse irregularities with e-votes than without
        2. Stop getting private companies to supply most of the equipment and logistics for voting. This should be managed by an independent government body (like the Australian Electoral Commission)
        3. Have your independent body draw the electorate maps, not the incumbents. Remove Gerrymandering. This is what most western civilizations do
        4. Move your voting to weekends, where more people are able to make it to the polls, and more volunteers are able to assist with ensuring that voting runs smoothly
        5. Leave each state to determine what they want to do for state-level elections, but have one single consistent approach to voting across all states for Federal Elections (i.e. have the Federal Election run Federally!)

        These are a start. Going further, please improve the quality of the election process by introducing preferential or runoff voting.