SoylentNews is people
SoylentNews
Common Dreams reports:
The death toll from this week's fiery explosions at the Chinese port of Tianjin climbed above 100 on Saturday, while confusion spread over whether authorities had ordered the evacuation of everyone within two miles amid fears of chemical contamination.
[...] Anti-chemical warfare troops have entered the site, according to the BBC.
[...] Two Chinese news outlets, including the state-run The Paper, reported that the warehouse was storing 700 tons of sodium cyanide--70 times more than it should have been holding at one time--and that authorities were rushing to clean it up.
Sodium cyanide is a toxic chemical that can form a flammable gas upon contact with water.
[...] "The company that owned the warehouse where the blasts originated, Rui Hai International Logistics, appears to have violated Chinese law by operating close to apartment buildings and worker dormitories", journalist Andrew Jacobs reports for [NYTimes] (paywall). "Residents say they were unaware that the company was handling dangerous materials."
About 6,300 people have been displaced by the blasts, with around 721 injured and 33 in serious condition, Xinhua news agency said. At least 21 firefighters are reported dead.
Related: Large Warehouse Explosions Injure 300-400 in Tianjin, China
For the adulterated baby formula abuses of 2008 (4 infants dead; 12,892 hospitalized), 2 people were executed. One wonders what will come of this case.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Gravis on Sunday August 16 2015, @02:38PM
today the head of the company that was storing 700 tons of sodium cyanide was executed. problem "solved".
the Chinese pretty much handle these problems the same way, kill the guy in charge and move on like nothing happened.
(Score: 2) by zocalo on Sunday August 16 2015, @02:52PM
UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
(Score: 3, Interesting) by frojack on Monday August 17 2015, @01:27AM
What about the fire fighters?
Early indications are that their use of water on a material that combusts more vigorously in water. Should they have known better?
This same thing happened in West City, Texas when fire fighters turned their hoses on a small fire and caused a huge explosion. Because of death of a lot of firefighters, the review went out of their way to not blame them directly and instead pin it on a lack of training at all levels of government.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by Whoever on Monday August 17 2015, @02:29AM
A material that should not have been there? How were they supposed to know that it was there?
(Score: 2) by frojack on Monday August 17 2015, @02:39AM
There is no indication that the material was not supposed to be there. Where did you read that?, Or did you just make it up?
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2) by Whoever on Monday August 17 2015, @03:05AM
oh [theguardian.com], really? [dw.com] From this latter link:
Perhaps you should do some investigation of your own [lmgtfy.com]before accusing people of making stuff up because of your own ignorance? It's not that difficult.
(Score: 2) by frojack on Monday August 17 2015, @04:43AM
Maybe try reading TFS, if not TFA:
Two Chinese news outlets, including the state-run The Paper, reported that the warehouse was storing 700 tons of sodium cyanide--70 times more than it should have been holding at one time
So CLEARLY they had approval to have SOME Sodium Cyanide, and simply had too much. Approved, by the government.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by zocalo on Monday August 17 2015, @06:49AM
UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
(Score: 2) by moondrake on Monday August 17 2015, @02:52PM
well, lets not jump to conclusions. Even IF they had a license (its not clear from that link, perhaps it just means that you can store up to 10 tons if you have approval), the firefighters may have had no knowledge of this. In general (as in labs where I work) storage of dangerous goods has all kind of string attached, but one significant one is clear labeling on doors and cabinets. This because when the building goes up in flame, people trying to put out the fire can make a sensible response (use water in this area or not, walk into this room even when there is minor fire, or simply clear the floor, etc etc).
Even when NaCN is present, it should usually stored in a safe way (do not know about Chinese regulations related to this however). If it was not stored properly, chances that things go wrong go up drastically.
When things like this happen, you generally are not going to file a 10 page document to your local government office asking them to provide you a list of the licenses they have.
This does not mean nobody has made a mistake, but it is silly to assume without more detailed knowledge that it was their own fault.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Monday August 17 2015, @03:10AM
Well, either you use the firefighting materials that are sanctioned for whatever they had officially stored, or...what? If their records are lies how are you supposed to know what they have on the premises?
If they supposedly had 1x of the stuff e.g. in a single building out of 8 and they really had 70x the stuff spread across all 8 buildings how are you supposed to know better?
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by frojack on Monday August 17 2015, @04:49AM
How would I know, its in CHINA for gotsake!
In this country, storage of dangerous materials has to be placarded, and fire departments have to be notified.
http://environmentalchemistry.com/yogi/hazmat/placards/ [environmentalchemistry.com]
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2, Disagree) by turgid on Sunday August 16 2015, @02:56PM
One of the features of a civillised, progressive society is one in which lessons can be learned from such incidents. Killing someone to make an example of them and shouting at everyone else, "Be more careful!" doesn't result in progress.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 1, Informative) by Francis on Sunday August 16 2015, @03:03PM
China isn't a civilized society in that regard. I lived there for 16 months and I don't recall ever having seen a single person learning from a mistake. I left and won't be going back any time soon speciifically because the foreigners are responsible for basically everything even when incompetent, racist managers can't be bothered to do their job. It's the Confucian culture. The people who make the decisions rarely see what the results of those decisions are. So you see people make the same mistakes over and over and over again because they can't put 2 and 2 together.
It's the main reason why I support them executing the top level executives involved. The younger Chinese are a bit smarter, but it's probably going to take generations before the school induced ADHD leaves their society.
(Score: 2) by turgid on Sunday August 16 2015, @04:59PM
That's very interesting. There was a BBC TV programme this week about an experiment where some British school kids were taught for a month by some highly-regarded Chinese teachers. The kids ran rings around the teachers.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Francis on Sunday August 16 2015, @08:12PM
Things are changing, I had some students who had been fortunate enough to go to classes that are more western in nature. Where they had to talk to each other in class, but in general for all the change, the schools are mostly stuck in the 12th century (or earlier) with very little changed since then.
Traditionally, the teacher has the knowledge and the students copy it. They're judged primarily on speed and accuracy, with no points at all for creativity or anything cross-domain . Things are changing, but the extreme level of top down thinking remains pervasive and the government has no incentive to discourage that way of doing things.
(Score: 2) by turgid on Monday August 17 2015, @08:04PM
Here's the programme about the Chinese teachers teaching British teenagers [bbc.co.uk]. Very revealing.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2015, @07:34PM
I would love to see a few thousand CEOs, bank executives, criminal cops, corrupt judges (like the two that stole the lives of thousands of children that they sentenced to serve time in a private prison for millions of dollars in kick-backs), corrupt politicians, etc., hanged, guillotined, drawn and quartered, or other execution by exhibition.
A death penalty for crimes of passion / mental illness, like murder has no deterrent effect and should be abolished. But, a death penalty against scheming rich parasites and their sycophants is far more likely to have a deterrent effect. Especially, if it is carried out enough times that the parasites have a reasonable fear that they will succumb to one of these ignoble deaths.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by hemocyanin on Sunday August 16 2015, @04:39PM
As compared to the American way (do nothing at all) which is better? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Fertilizer_Company_explosion [wikipedia.org]
Has anything of a criminal nature happened against the owners and management of West for violating regaulations? No.
I'm anti-death penalty so I don't really think China's method is awesome, but then, the US method: "do nothing and let the average joe suck it up, so sorry about that" really sucks too. Another expression of the one rule for the population, one rule for the over-class.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Gravis on Sunday August 16 2015, @04:55PM
As compared to the American way (do nothing at all) which is better?
i'm not commenting on what's good or bad, i just wrote what's going to happen.
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2015, @05:17PM
FTFY.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2015, @09:12PM
According to its last filing with the EPA in late 2012 [. . .] Federal law requires that [...] DHS be notified
An agency that could have padlocked the West, Texas operation until they were in compliance with standards is OSHA (Occupational Health and Safety Administration).
The Neoliberals in Congress (privatize everything; kill off all regulatory agencies), however, have continually defunded that agency in keeping with the principles of Reaganism.
Due to limited regulatory manpower, the West, TX plant was last inspected in 1985. [google.com]
My original suggested department was
from the a-more-free-market-and-fewer-regulations-is-clearly-the-solution dept.
takyon retained the nub of that.
-- gewg_
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2015, @05:29PM
And it turns out that the head of a faction in Beijing politics was directly responsible for overseeing the factory, so he was controlled, too.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2015, @07:19PM
the Chinese pretty much handle these problems the same way, kill the guy in charge and move on like nothing happened.
The world could learn a thing from the way the Chinese do it. Imagine how much better the world would be if every bank executive, bought and paid for politician, criminal cop, and C-level executive were hanged for their criminal activities. In the US, there wouldn't be any of these parasites left-- because here they are all crooks.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Monday August 17 2015, @03:07AM
It all depends whether the "fuck up and we'll execute you" causes the people in question to A) be law-abiding to avoid getting executed or B) be more careful while continuing to do the illegal thing.
Suppose if they can nail you with some random offence and execute you no matter what A) is basically right out the window.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"