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posted by n1 on Thursday April 03 2014, @03:43PM   Printer-friendly [Skip to comment(s)]
from the sabre-rattle-heard-in-space dept.

NASA has released a statement indicating that they are "suspending the majority" of "ongoing engagements with the Russian Federation". Cooperation will continue "to maintain safe and continuous operation of the International Space Station." They have taken this action citing violations Ukraine's sovereignty by Russia.

NASA apparently is focusing on regaining human spaceflight capabilities and ending dependence on Russia. The statement goes on to say: "The choice here is between fully funding the plan to bring space launches back to America or continuing to send millions of dollars to the Russians." According to time.com the "information initially came to light from a leaked memo".

This comes after a recent statement by Charles Bolden a NASA administrator indicating that relations with Russia were fine. There are currently Two Americans, Three Russians, and the Japanese Commander aboard the ISS Expedition 39.

Related Stories

Head of Russian Space Agency Roscosmos Wavers on Lunar Orbital Platform-Gateway 33 comments

Russia throws doubt on joint lunar space station with U.S.: RIA

Moscow may abandon a project to build a space station in lunar orbit in partnership with U.S. space agency NASA because it does not want a "second fiddle role," a Russian official said on Saturday.

[...] [The] head of Russian space agency Roscosmos, Dmitry Rogozin, said Russia might exit the joint program and instead propose its own lunar orbit space station project.

[...] A spokesman for Roscosmos said later that Russia had no immediate plans to leave the project. "Russia has not refused to take part in the project of the lunar orbit station with the USA," Vladimir Ustimenko was quoted as saying by the TASS news agency.

FLOP-G?

Also at ABC (Associated Press).

Previously:

Related:


Original Submission

Future of U.S.-Russian Space Cooperation in Doubt 15 comments

Russia Wants to Extend U.S. Space Partnership. Or It Could Turn to China.

The American incentives for engaging with Russia in space in the 1990s — political goals like the employment of idle rocket scientists to prevent missile proliferation — have mostly disappeared with the resumption of tensions. The Trump administration has already proposed that by 2025 the United States should stop supporting the International Space Station that is the principal joint project today. A final decision is up to Congress. The American role might be shifted to a commercial footing thereafter.

[...] [It] is unclear how much longer the post-Soviet era of space cooperation between the United States and Russia can last in the more hostile environment now surrounding relations. In the interview, [Dmitri O. Rogozin, the director of Russia's space agency,] said Russia wanted to carry on joint flights with the United States and its allies, despite the tensions over election interference, wars in Syria and Ukraine, and the chemical weapons poisoning of a former double agent in Britain.

[...] Analysts say Moscow has a strong incentive to maintain the joint program: a decided lack of money to pursue a lunar station on its own. Russia's budget for its space program is something less than one-10th what the United States spends on NASA. [...] Russia's preference is to press on with a space program entwined with the United States', on either the lunar program or another venture, Mr. Rogozin said. But if talks fail, Russia can turn to China or India for partnership. There might then be two stations circling the Earth or the moon, one led by the United States the other a Russian-Chinese enterprise. Mr. Rogozin even floated the idea of a "BRIC station," the acronym for the developing economies of Brazil, Russia, India and China.

Mr. Rogozin in November ordered the Russian Academy of Sciences to study the prospects for a solo Russian program to build a habitable base on the surface of the moon. Ivan M. Moiseyev, the director of the Institute of Space Policy in Moscow, said in a telephone interview that any proposal for a lone Russian lunar station was fantastical, given the budget constraints. "The technical capability exists, but the finances don't."

The U.S. and NASA could develop stronger partnerships with the European Space Agency, Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency, and Indian Space Research Organisation instead.

Previously:

Related: Price War Between SpaceX and Russia


Original Submission

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  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Covalent on Thursday April 03 2014, @03:55PM

    by Covalent (43) on Thursday April 03 2014, @03:55PM (#25650) Journal

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0086837/quotes?item=qt 1047634 [imdb.com]

    Clarke gets it right...again.

    This, however, is just plain silly.

    --
    You can't rationally argue somebody out of a position they didn't rationally get into.
  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Skarjak on Thursday April 03 2014, @03:57PM

    by Skarjak (730) on Thursday April 03 2014, @03:57PM (#25653)

    This is ridiculous. The scientific community should have no frontiers. The advancement of human knowledge is too noble a goal to let politics get in the way. Certainly, collaboration on this matter shouldn't be viewed as a "favour", which you can remove at any point.

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by melikamp on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:25PM

      by melikamp (1886) on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:25PM (#25668) Journal
      On the bright side, this is pure posturing without any real substance. Russian Deputy PM in charge of defense tweeted: "Aside from ISS, we didn't cooperate with NASA anyway".
    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Sir Garlon on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:45PM

      by Sir Garlon (1264) on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:45PM (#25747)

      The advancement of human knowledge is too noble a goal to let politics get in the way.

      Unfortunately, the politicians feel that no goal is too noble for them to interfere with it.

      --
      [Sir Garlon] is the marvellest knight that is now living, for he destroyeth many good knights, for he goeth invisible.
      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by isostatic on Thursday April 03 2014, @08:59PM

        by isostatic (365) on Thursday April 03 2014, @08:59PM (#25856) Journal

        As do the public that allow those politcians to be in power.

    • (Score: 3, Funny) by TK on Thursday April 03 2014, @09:41PM

      by TK (2760) on Thursday April 03 2014, @09:41PM (#25882)

      If I were a NASA administrator who knew how to leverage politics to get what I wanted, I would use this situation to push congress into approving another set of manned spacecraft, "so we won't be dependent on those damn Ruskies".

      --
      The fleas have smaller fleas, upon their backs to bite them, and those fleas have lesser fleas, and so ad infinitum
  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by JeanCroix on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:14PM

    by JeanCroix (573) on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:14PM (#25662)
    When I saw this announced this morning, I started to wonder - what could the U.S. really do if Russia decided that no more American astronauts were allowed to use Soyuz craft? Sure, more economic sanctions, but that hasn't been effective so far. If things continue to sour between the two, they could effectively lock the U.S. out of the space station. Does anyone here have their finger on the pulse of the relations between the various space programs, and have thoughts on how such a scenario might play out, if at all?
    • (Score: 5, Funny) by hybristic on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:19PM

      by hybristic (10) on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:19PM (#25666) Journal

      They tried this once with the Stargates DHD and with the help of SG-1 we were able to get the DHD and save Teal'c. So if it ever comes to that we just need Daniel Jackson to go talk with Putin and sort all of this out.

    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by jmoschner on Thursday April 03 2014, @05:34PM

      by jmoschner (3296) on Thursday April 03 2014, @05:34PM (#25697)

      what could the U.S. really do if Russia decided that no more American astronauts were allowed to use Soyuz craft?

      Right now there isn't much the U.S. can do. Putin knows he can pretty much do what he wants and nobody will stop him. He is going to keep pushing until it hits a breaking point (like a small war). Then he'll back off, let things coll down, then start over again.

      To get back to the ISS the U.S. would have to first look to China. Right now China is really the only other country doing manned launces that can reach the ISS. The U.S. would have to work closer with them and likely would.

      I don't see congress giving more funding to NASA for manned flights.

      Other options would include investment in U.S. efforts to get manned flight going again or working with one of the other space agencies that isn't doing manned launces yet. Most likely India or Japan. Then there is the hope that private companies like Space X, will develope and have manned flight capabilities sooner rather than later.

      • (Score: 4, Informative) by tibman on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:56PM

        by tibman (134) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:56PM (#25760)

        SpaceX would love to send humans in to space but was basically told it could not. They are taking direction from NASA and on their timeline. http://www.spacex.com/dragon [spacex.com]

        --
        SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
      • (Score: 2) by frojack on Friday April 04 2014, @12:31AM

        by frojack (1554) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 04 2014, @12:31AM (#25943) Journal

        The ISS is an aging dinosaur anyway. Everything of value that the ISS can deliver was delivered in the building and design phase. And the US was the major benefactor of that knowledge.

        There is little useful science being done on the ISS these days. Its a huge Kludge, waiting for a disaster to happen.

        Russia is playing a waiting game, until the US formally abandons it. It will then be theirs.

        About all that the ISS routinely gets from the US is the use of Communications networks. As soon as something breaks down NASA astronauts end up going outside to fix it.

        Note: I'd feel the same about it if the Russians lost interest in it. It is an expensive budget sucking toy. Build it on the moon and I'll get interested again.

        --
        No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
  • (Score: 5, Interesting) by omoc on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:47PM

    by omoc (39) on Thursday April 03 2014, @04:47PM (#25677)

    So the US can invade Vietnam, Somalia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, (almost Syria), use drones/missles in Yemen, north-Africa and Pakistan and that's all totally legitimate.

    Crimea has a democratic referendum to become independent and then is asked by Russia to join the country which it accepted.

    Now Washington lectures us about violating sovernty and issues sanctions that even reach the scientific field.

    This is an interesting world view indeed.

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by goody on Thursday April 03 2014, @05:40PM

      by goody (2135) on Thursday April 03 2014, @05:40PM (#25698)

      Bad analogy. The US never annexed any of those countries and Crimea, as far as I know, hasn't threatened Russia or its allies. But point well taken about the Democratic referendum. However, I doubt it would be well taken if the state of Maine voted to become Canadian and Canada invaded Maine.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 04 2014, @03:35AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 04 2014, @03:35AM (#26024)

        Talk about ignoring the elephant in the room.

        You think Crimea would be safe from Ukraine if they did not immediately join Russia after declaring independence? After the current Ukraine leaders just staged a coup to take control of Ukraine?

        OTOH, do you think all the people in those countries invaded by the US wouldn't be happy to join the US as the 51st state? So they became equals to other US citizens? Imagine the backlash all Iraqis, Lybians, etc can vote in the US Presidential election! It is the people in the US that don't want it!

        You think living in a puppet state of the US is better than living in the 51st state?

    • (Score: 2) by tibman on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:53PM

      by tibman (134) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:53PM (#25757)

      Secession is something the US has dealt with in the past and makes Crimea leaving the Ukraine look like jay-walking. So any American commenting on the secession (if you prefer that phrasing over invasion) will be very biased.

      Anyways. Did the US do any of that with soldier's wearing uniforms stripped of name, rank, and country of origin? Did Russia also invade any of those countries as well? I completely agree with you about DC being full of hypocrites though. They want to avoid the issue of constantly violating Pakistan's sovereignty but then give a lecture to Russia? Silly and stupid, lol. It seems like there are so many ulterior motives that everything starts becoming fuzzy : /

      --
      SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
    • (Score: 2, Informative) by SurvivorZ on Thursday April 03 2014, @08:21PM

      by SurvivorZ (792) on Thursday April 03 2014, @08:21PM (#25818)

      There are many Texans who would *love* to be liberated by the Germans or Russians.

      My country, the Republic of Texas, has been subjugated by the Washington Empire for the last 150 years, since 1864. We were conquered, a large percentage of our population butchered, our native inhabitants forced off their lands 10 years later and forced to relocate to Oklahoma (Trail of Tears) and almost exterminated.

      Today, we pay about four times what we receive, in the form of onerous Imperial income taxes and the such, while being the engine of over 50% of all new jobs in the entire United States since 2008.

      We have a growing secession movement, but people are so incredibly scared that the U.S. military will invade us once again. Our secession movement's leaders continually disappear and/or are killed off. It's nuts. Talk of secession just brings up fears of military in the streets, like what happened to our next door neighbor during Hurricane Katrina.

      • (Score: 1) by Bob The Cowboy on Friday April 04 2014, @02:51AM

        by Bob The Cowboy (2019) on Friday April 04 2014, @02:51AM (#26011)

        Today, we pay about four times what we receive...

        Our secession movement's leaders continually disappear and/or are killed off.

        Holy lack of citations, Batman!

  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Snotnose on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:34PM

    by Snotnose (1623) on Thursday April 03 2014, @06:34PM (#25737)

    So what happens when Putin decides the American ISS astronauts can't board their taxi home? It's not kidnapping, they're free to leave. Not really hurting them, they still get food, water, and oxygen.

    Won't happen, but sure would be fun to watch Obama squirm on that one.

    --
    I hate when I put something off to tomorrow, and tomorrow arrives.
    • (Score: 2) by isostatic on Thursday April 03 2014, @08:43PM

      by isostatic (365) on Thursday April 03 2014, @08:43PM (#25842) Journal

      If Sandra Bullock can land a broken chineese space craft I'm fairly sure the iss chaps can land the Soyuz lifeboat

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday April 03 2014, @11:11PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday April 03 2014, @11:11PM (#25923)

        That Russian-owned Soyuz that Putin took away? Isn't that the point?

    • (Score: 1) by tftp on Friday April 04 2014, @02:21AM

      by tftp (806) on Friday April 04 2014, @02:21AM (#25992) Homepage

      So what happens when Putin decides the American ISS astronauts can't board their taxi home?

      That won't happen. Ride down to Earth will be available. However a ride up, for the next American, is questionable.

      It is really funny that NASA picks and chooses what "sanctions" it applies, as if they are the only player in this game. I would not be too surprised if Russia cancels all cooperation - and that would be a far more effective lever. Alternatively, Roskosmos can forgive NASA for yielding to the political pressure.

  • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 04 2014, @12:41AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 04 2014, @12:41AM (#25947)

    The US has no position of "moral high ground". And the notion
    that the US is the police force of the world is an old tired idea that
    in reality has its true roots in US imperialism which was performed
    at the behest of multinational companies which originated in the US.
    United Fruit, Halliburton, etc. are all the same sort of swine.

    Obama is not competent to serve in the office he gained by
    duping voters. I confess I was one of those duped, but having
    realized I was duped I now have profound contempt for Obama.
    I'd actually enjoy reading that he had terminal cancer, if that gives
    you an idea of how much respect I have left for the lying sack of shit.

    .