from the yes...-it's-the-year-of-the-chinese-linux-desktop dept.
China is one of the countries where Windows XP continues to be one of the leading platforms, with some stats pointing towards a 70 percent market share owned by the OS version launched by Microsoft in 2001.
From Ecns.cn:
China's Ministry of Industry and Information of Technology (MIIT) urged Windows XP users in China to switch to domestically made computer operating systems, China Central Television (CCTV) reported on Saturday.
The local government has apparently found a solution to move users off Windows XP by developing its own Linux-based alternative which would not only be offered with a freeware license, but also work on low-spec PCs, such as the ones that are currently powered by XP.
Work on this new Linux-based OS has already been started, with local authorities hoping that Windows XP users would actually give it a chance and abandon their existing operating systems that are more or less open to attacks.
It remains to be seen how many people are actually prepared to give up on Windows.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by aristarchus on Thursday May 15 2014, @09:18AM
It is not going to be Red Flag Linux.
(And does anyone else sense a powerful disturbance in the force? China and Kim Komander recommending Linux, in a matter of days. XP will be the death of MicroSerf!)
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Lunix Nutcase on Thursday May 15 2014, @12:38PM
China has been pushing Linux for years with little success. This is nothing new. Kim Kommando is a nobody that has an audience that amounts to less than 1% of the US population.
(Score: 4, Funny) by crutchy on Thursday May 15 2014, @09:29AM
mao torvalds
(Score: 2, Funny) by hoochiecoochieman on Thursday May 15 2014, @03:33PM
And the mascot is a black-and-white pandenguin.
(Score: 2) by nightsky30 on Thursday May 15 2014, @04:01PM
Maonix?
Keep the Lin in Linux. How about Linus Yenrai?
(Score: 4, Funny) by Horse With Stripes on Thursday May 15 2014, @09:29AM
With millions and millions of computers in China about to switch over to Linux, I think it's safe to finally say "2014 & 2015 are going to be the years of the Linux desktop!"
All it took was XP to age out of support. Maybe Microsoft should have discontinued XP support a few years ago ;-)
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 15 2014, @12:40PM
Why would they upgrade perfectly fine working XP machines? Linux users really are delusional.
(Score: 2) by WizardFusion on Thursday May 15 2014, @02:20PM
Not sure if joke or not, but I have to agree. I still run a few VMs as Windows XP (and server 2003) just because of the very low system footprint that it can work with. Less than 512mb ram.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Thursday May 15 2014, @06:57PM
Security. (XP has no more)
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Thexalon on Thursday May 15 2014, @01:17PM
Yes, it's a joke, but the fact is that the Linux desktop has gotten significantly better over the last decade. (Anyone else remember the days of manually setting vertical refresh rates?) When you look at what the vast majority of computer users want to do, it's:
- check email
- read Facebook and other web sites (but mostly Facebook)
- watch streaming video
- work with office documents
- maybe play a couple of games
Many Linux distros exist that can do all that right out of the box. The install is now ridiculously simple. LibreOffice has gotten better. Flash install is no longer a big pain. There are some decently fun games available. X is no longer a real challenge to get running. All those hours of work are actually paying off.
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 4, Informative) by hoochiecoochieman on Thursday May 15 2014, @03:49PM
I've been using Linux at home for years, and I'm very happy with it. I would also use it in my laptop at work. I've never taken that step because it would attract lots of shit from management. Every time something broke, it would be my fault for using a "strange" OS. I use it in servers, though. IT fellows are not so happy about it, but fuck them.
But then, I live in Portugal, which could be called Microsoftugal. Everybody here is so brainwashed into using Microsoft stuff that they don't even know any alternative.
I work in a multinational. Some of the other countries' development departments use Linux almost exclusively.
It's been slowly changing, fortunately. For instance, my kids' school uses Ubuntu, Libre Office, and other open-source stuff. They don't have cash for licenses, and pirating software is not an option. They were complaining about having to buy all those expensive licenses, and I told them about the open-source alternatives. To my amazement, they have never heard about them before. Now, they're perfectly happy with them, exploring the possibilities and spreading the word around.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Hairyfeet on Thursday May 15 2014, @04:30PM
Its not the software that is the problem, its Linus Torvalds refusing to let go of a 1970s driver model. You'd laugh if Windows went back to using .INI and VXD drivers, right? Well that would be considered high tech compared to the 1970s UNIX shit that Torvalds refuses to let go of. How many other OSes uses his model? NONE, zero zip. His model was fine when every driver for Linux could be handed out on a floppy, saying "let the kernel devs handle it" just doesn't work when you are talking over 100,000 drivers with more added weekly. Everyone touts Linux support for old hardware but if you actually try using old hardware? you'll find its half assed and badly done [osnews.com].
The Hairyfeet Challenge [soylentnews.org] has stood for over 5 years now and not a single person has stepped up, even though it takes less than 4 hours start to finish and costs nothing but your time. instead of taking up the challenge I've gotten death threats, had a cyberstalker for nearly 2 years, and the reason why they would sling hatred for so long instead of merely taking the challenge is a fact that no Linux will pass, the Linux driver model is broken. Sadly as long as Torvalds is in charge it will stay that way because he is an arrogant ass who thinks companies should have to put out new drivers forever rather than admit what worked in 1994 doesn't work in 2014. let the Chinese go to Linux, they won't have sound within a year and a half max and if their graphics are anything but Intel they won't have video for that long, oh and I hope they don't use wireless because that's right out, all thanks to the fact Torvalds will never admit he's wrong. Damned shame.
ACs are never seen so don't bother. Always ready to show SJWs for the racists they are.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by tangomargarine on Thursday May 15 2014, @07:08PM
OS X? "Certain parts from FreeBSD's and NetBSD's implementation of Unix were incorporated in NeXTSTEP, the core of Mac OS X. NeXTSTEP was the graphical, object-oriented, and UNIX-based operating system developed by Steve Jobs' company NeXT after he left Apple in 1985."
Please tell me we're not going to start arguing monolithic vs. microkernel again. That's been stalemated for ages now, and everybody has hybrid kernels anyway.
I would expect that this challenge you seem so proud of would go about the same trying to go from Vista to 7 to 8.
And just because a model has been in use a long time, doesn't mean it should automatically be thrown out. Sometimes things are actually well-designed. Not that I'm qualified to comment on whether UNIX fits that bill...what are your qualifications?
You sound like a very hateful person. I hope it's only Linux you hate this much.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Thursday May 15 2014, @07:11PM
Have you tried LTS releases? You'd only need 2 LTS upgrades and that seems more analogous to new Windows versions, until recently anyway.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Thursday May 15 2014, @07:24PM
Not to mention that Linux development is mostly volunteer work and provided for free (beer and speech), so comparing it head-to-head with Microsoft and Apple is rather loading the dice.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 15 2014, @07:55PM
The Hairyfeet Challenge
People who have this "problem" will go to Red Hat and pay for support.
That costs LESS than EULAs + CALs + support from M$.
If you want the same ~9 years of a supported platform *without* paying for support, there are the RedHat derivatives Scientific Linux and CentOS.
As with most Linux "problems", the solution is very simple.
-- gewg_
(Score: 2, Insightful) by arslan on Thursday May 15 2014, @10:44PM
Mate you sound bitter. I've been working in the IT industry for close to 20 years, I've never had any nor been in any organization where we "upgrade" OS. It is always a reinstall to move between OS-es, even then that is rare, the hardware typically gets tossed out after 5 years and the peons like us gets a new one with a new shiny OS.
As for non-corporate environments, apart from my techies mates, pretty much everyone non-techie that I know never upgrade an OS anyway. They either plague themselves upon friends/families (me being one of them unfortunately) to "fix" their PC or they buy a new one.
Good that you've come up with a "Challenge" that pokes a small hole in the Linux armor. Good that you've shown a side of Linus that is less than appealing, after all some of the worshiping do get disgusting, he is human after all and like everyone can be an ass. But in the words of the great Heath Ledger, "Why so serious?"
(Score: 2) by Hairyfeet on Friday May 16 2014, @02:18AM
Because I'm tired of bullshit, anecdotes, and downright lies being sold as truth with ZERO challenges? If I said OSX runs on a P2 with 50MB of RAM and never crashes, you'd want some proof, yes? If I said Windows never gets viruses and runs 3 times as fast as long as the case is blue, you'd want some evidence, yes? then why in the fuck should we let a bunch of loonies spread bullshit that is just as fucking ridiculous without so much as a single shred of proof AT ALL, hmm?
And THAT is why I came up with the challenge, which has gotten me everything from death threats to a cyberstalker. its impossible for them to argue it isn't fair because its actually giving Linux several advantages, less than half the Windows support cycle, no strange hardware like USB capture cards, hell i don't even make them support what frankly should be considered mandatory like a USB printer or all in one. Nope just take any average bog standard desktop or laptop with wireless, hell any $50 7 year old craigslist special will do (and in fact for a perfectly fair test against Vista a system from 06-08 would be preferable), install a Linux released during Vista's release, make sure all the drivers (and wireless using WPA V2) is working then update it to current using ONLY the GUI just as any SANE NORMAL PERSON would be expected to do.
But what do we see? What is posted above you? Bullshit, insane bullshit (yes a normal user is gonna pay $100 a year for 5 years of red hat support contracts instead of a one time $100 for a ten year windows support cycle) and anecdotes. Well if they want anecdotes I've run Win 7 on a 2003 Sempron and I've never gotten viruses so Windows runs on everything and is 100% virus free...aren't anecdotes great?
So I'm tired of their bullshit, either nut up or shut up. The challenge is free, can be done by anyone, is an accurate simulation of what an average user goes through, and will take a few hours max. oh and as for why not LTS? Because Canonical itself says LTS is NOT for consumers its for businesses that require Long Term Support. So by using LTS according to the company that made it you're doing it wrong and using it in a way that isn't intended which if you are gonna do that why not say joe user should have to compile their own? Canonical has a product for home users its called mainstream and is what users coming to their site will be offered if they type Ubuntu into Google so if they don't like the fact that Canonical doesn't want mainstream users using LTS they should take it up with Canonical. And if their "great and wonderful OS" can't even pass such a basic challenge? Maybe instead of insulting me they should take it up with Torvalds.
ACs are never seen so don't bother. Always ready to show SJWs for the racists they are.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Wootery on Thursday May 15 2014, @05:30PM
Not the Silverlight DRM'ed stuff though. Netflix/LoveFilm/NowTV/etc are a real pain to get working in Linux.
Yes, Wine works, but it's really slow at Silverlight video playback, to the point that it's unwatchable unless on a powerful machine.
Aside: don't believe the bullshit when they say Netflix will move to HTML5. They're going to develop a proprietary, platform-specific binary-blob, which interacts with the browser via an HTML5-standardised interface. It will not necessarily mean Linux support.
(I don't know what TBL was smoking when he decided that HTML5 officially supporting DRM was a good idea, but I hope he's kicked the habit.)
(Score: 3, Informative) by Marand on Friday May 16 2014, @06:46AM
Ubuntu users can just install a repo from here [compholio.com] for Netflix and have what is, basically, a simple install and "run this program for netflix" setup.
Anyone else can use this one [fds-team.de] and a user agent switcher for the browser. Also works for other things than just Netflix.
Could you provide more useful information here? Silverlight via pipelight works perfectly well pushing HD content to a 1920x1080 display on an Athlon X2 (dual core, 3ghz), which means it's from somewhere around 2006-2008.
That leads me to wonder what your idea of a "powerful machine" is, considering a 6-8 year old desktop can handle it. What did you try to run it on that you're basing your claim on, a Pentium 2?
Unrelated, but I find that Silverlight via pipelight actually works better than Adobe's horrible Linux flash plugin. Less CPU use and fewer overall problems, amazingly. I've seriously considered trying to use pipelight's flash support instead of the native one for comparison purposes.
(Score: 1) by Wootery on Saturday May 17 2014, @11:46PM
64-bit single-core AMD CPU from years back, 2.0GHz, Socket 754. (i.e. old but should certainly be up to the task.)
(I forget if I had the proprietary nVidia driver installed, but I think I did.)
I ran Windows Firefox + Silverlight, in Wine. The Netflix performance was horrendous. I've now installed Vista, and it now runs fine. (Admittedly I'm no longer with Netflix, but the NowTV service I'm now using is also Silverlight-based.)
I didn't try Pipelight. Would it perform better than Firefox-for-Windows in Wine? Less indirection?
(Score: 2) by Marand on Sunday May 18 2014, @05:21AM
I've only noticed silverlight/wine via pipelight using one core, so that should still be acceptable, though it might make multitasking while watching a bit crap. Not sure how badly the 2ghz (yours) vs 3ghz (mine) would affect it, so it might only work at non-HD for you. If it can't, it's probably just barely past the "works fine" threshold.
Using nvidia binary driver here, too. Admittedly my GPU isn't crap, so that could be a factor, but probably not much: although the GPU will assist with rendering the video, it won't be used for decoding, so CPU would matter more there.
(Note: this is my experience with using Pipelight directly. I don't use Ubuntu so I didn't try the netflix-desktop package, which is supposed to abstract the work away for you.)
It probably works better, yeah. I haven't tried using a Windows browser with Silverlight to compare, but Pipelight uses wine for the minimum amount of code possible. Pipelight works in two parts: a wine executable (pluginloader.exe) that loads Silverlight, and a native browser plugin that communicates with the exe. The end result is you get a wine instance, running Silverlight, embedded in your Linux-native browser window. Same way KDE's kparts plugin can embed KDE apps into the browser for handling filetypes. (Okular inside a Firefox tab for PDFs, for example.)
One really nice thing about the Pipelight setup is you can use it with any browser that supports NPAPI plugins and UA-switching, so you aren't limited to Firefox or Chrome. I tend to use Uzbl for it, since it has almost no UI and I can make the window small, stuff it in a corner somewhere and run it while doing other things.
Also, since it looks like just-another-plugin to the browser, it generally "just works" on anything that uses Silverlight. Or some other plugins; it has some extra plugins such as unity3d and flash, too. The flash support could become a big deal, since Adobe quit updating the native Linux one.
I've only noticed a few issues with it, none of which are performance-related, and two of which aren't actually Pipelight's fault.
1) Most sites do user-agent checks before loading, so you tend to need a UA switcher. Not a Pipelight issue.
2) Window resizes do odd things with the Silverlight frame for me. Workaround: resize the window first.
3) Since it's using wine, it screws with my gamma/colour correction that's set by nvidia-settings. This is a long-standing wine bug and not Pipelight's fault. Workaround: nvidia-settings -l after Silverlight's loaded, just like with anything else (Minecraft, any wine games) that mangles your gamma for no reason.
(Score: 2) by kaszz on Thursday May 15 2014, @10:52AM
In Chinese China attackers upgrade you to Linux! :D
(actually it could work as an self enforcing upgrade loop.. but I like BSD better)
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 15 2014, @01:00PM
If I was China, I would contribute my expertise and resources into further developing the Linux distro Q4OS [q4os.org]. Q4OS is an almost perfect clone of Windows XP!
If I was China, I would contribute my expertise and resources into further developing the WINE compatibility layer so that all the Windows-based software will run smoothly on this Q4OS system.
If I was China, I would stop wasting time re-inventing what already exists and start contributing manpower to currently existing projects !!!!!!
(Score: 3, Informative) by samuelpoon1234 on Thursday May 15 2014, @01:33PM
This is good news nonetheless, but I think for markets like China, the real competitor for Linux would be pirated copies of Windows. Only now changed to pirating Windows 7 instead of Windows XP.
(Ballmer to Hu: 90% of Microsoft customers in China using pirated software)m er-hu-china-software-piracy.html [networkworld.com]
http://www.networkworld.com/news/2011/012111-ball
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 15 2014, @02:08PM
Mod parent up. The only competition to XP in China is another pirated version of Windows. The average person in China could give fuck all what OS the government wants them to use.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 15 2014, @02:53PM
Gates even said that he'd rather people pirate windows than to use an alternative.
(Score: 2) by WizardFusion on Thursday May 15 2014, @02:28PM
As a Windows user and Windows system admin for the last 15+ years, my main issue with Linux is the choice. I know choice is good, but in the Linux world there is too much choice and little information about them for the novice Linux user.
(Score: 2) by emg on Thursday May 15 2014, @04:21PM
Unlike the Windows world, where there are only about thirty different operating system variants with four (or is it five? I've lost count) different user interfaces.
Not to mention that everyone who doesn't know what they're doing and just buys 'something with Windows' ends up with Windows 8 and hates it.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 15 2014, @07:32PM
too much choice
You must have a really difficult time when you walk into a shoe store.
**Oh, no. Look at all the styles and colors and sizes.**
3.x, 95, 98, 98SE, ME, 2000, XP
Visduh, 7, 8, 8.1 (Oh, wait; that's already been declared obsolete), 8.2
Now, what were you saying about "too many"?
It's just silly that people still trot out this nonsensical FUD.
.
little information about them for the novice
What did you do when you were getting started with Windoze and you encountered a pebble in your path?
Of course, you ASKED someone. [google.com]
Can we stop with the silly canards?
-- gewg_
(Score: 2) by Yog-Yogguth on Wednesday May 21 2014, @12:33AM
Yeah? I'm telling you to install Linux Mint 16 with Mate >:P
See wasn't that the easiest choice you've made? Choice is only there if you want it :3 Otherwise just listen to me, always, because I decide so :)
Doing it isn't too hard either (given a little patience if someone is completely inexperienced with computers): .iso file, if in doubt choose 32 bit version. Download it! Install to USB thumb drive like this http://community.linuxmint.com/tutorial/view/744 [linuxmint.com]
1. Have empty USB thumb drive, go to http://blog.linuxmint.com/?p=2493 [linuxmint.com] and and choose torrent or mirror to get
2. Plug USB into target computer
3. Turn target computer on
4. Run it and do some ordinary stuff like web browsing before you decide to install
5. Double-click the install icon right on the Mint desktop (you can install alongside Windows or other OSes if you want to as long as you have free space, I do that all the time out of laziness since I'm not short on space and that's even though I only use Linux)
6. Answer something like six questions (the same as Windows used to ask: time, location, keyboard that kind of stuff, done in minutes and the most time you'll spend is on figuring out computer name and user name and password)
7. Let it finish installing (same as Windows)
8. Shut down computer (start menu | quit | shut down)
9. When prompted remove USB thumbdrive and press Enter
10. Done! Easier than didgeridoo
Feel free to genuflect in my general direction (that way ) out of gratitude for how hard other people have worked to make it this easy.
Bite harder Ouroboros, bite! tails.boum.org/ linux USB CD secure desktop IRC *crypt tor (not endorsements (XKeyScore))
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 15 2014, @03:25PM
Why do I think that's the British telly?
(Score: 2) by WizardFusion on Thursday May 15 2014, @03:33PM
You are thinking of the BBC - British Broadcasting Corporation.
CCTV is for security cameras, et al - Closed Circuit TeleVision
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Thursday May 15 2014, @07:56PM
...that the Chinese trust their government more than Americans, Europeans or anyone else for that matter?
My guess (backed up by nothing but my own distorted worldview) would be that a Chinese government made 'nix, would A: NOT be open sourced B: Full of backdoors, spyware, keyloggers and such C: Make any version of pirated Windows more attractive, because I don't think the dumbest Chinese citizen would trust it.
Would you Trust an American, Russian, German, etc government endorsed O/S for your computer?
If your ONLY choice were that or pirated Windows, which would you choose?
As a further guess, is it possible that there is some status in China to using an 'expensive' US O/S for free?
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.