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posted by n1 on Wednesday October 22 2014, @03:51AM   Printer-friendly
from the coffee++ dept.

Don Brushett has an informative piece over at phys.org on the taste vs. smell of coffee.

Most of what we taste we actually smell. The only sensations that we pick up in our mouth are sweet, sour, bitter, umami and salty. Without its smell, coffee would have only a sour or bitter taste due to the organic acids. Try it with your next cup of coffee – hold your nose as you take your first sip.

The rich satisfying sensation of coffee is almost entirely due to the volatile compounds produced when we roast coffee beans.

The compounds that are formed in the roasting process are very similar to any other compound that is formed in the cooking process. The smell of baking bread is from compounds produced when a sugar reacts with a protein in what is called a Maillard reaction.

coffee++

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  • (Score: 2) by mendax on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:06AM

    by mendax (2840) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:06AM (#108545)

    I always thought that coffee worked on the theory that it takes so awful that it shocked your system into alertness. That's why when I do drink coffee, I drink it strong. But I have to put a lot of creamer and sweetener in it to overcome the bitterness.

    --
    It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
    • (Score: 2) by SlimmPickens on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:00AM

      by SlimmPickens (1056) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:00AM (#108562)

      I always thought that coffee worked on the theory that it takes so awful that it shocked your system into alertness.

      Haha, it might where you live! Last time I was in a department store (Sydney, Aus) they had a full seven shelves of espresso machines with just two of those drip thingy's on the end of the bottom shelf.

      I have an ECM Giotto. Need to upgrade my grinder and either procure a proper roaster or add some temperature control to my popcorn popper.

      There's a very good reason why Modernist Cuisine devotes thirty odd pages to espresso and about three to the other methods combined.

      • (Score: 2) by mendax on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:52AM

        by mendax (2840) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:52AM (#108567)

        On those rare occasions when I drink coffee I drink at Starbucks so I get whatever reasonably mild house blend is. However, for coffee I when I feel I need it at home (it does happen) I buy it at Peet's, a local chain in northern California. I will only drink good, high quality coffee. It's just that good coffee is still bitter to my tongue. Most of the time I drink tea anyway. It's cheaper and doesn't give me the shits like coffee does on occasion.

        The problem may simply be American coffee. There is an interesting story about how Americans got used to drinking bad coffee. Sometime after the second world war, after rationing stopped and it was possible to get the good coffee that Americans were used to before the war, there was a spike in coffee prices and the coffee roasters started mixing in cheaper beans into their blends and no one seemed to notice. So when the prices came back down, the cheap beans stayed. The trend continued until American coffee tasted awful by comparison to what Europeans were drinking (which must have been REALLY bad). However, the coffee companies used marketing to tell the American coffee drinkers that they were using the best beans, all that mountain-grown, Juan Valdez nonsense (for those of you old enough to remember those commercials on TV), etc. etc. in their coffee and we fools that we are when it comes to coffee believed it! It took the rise of Starbucks and their ilk to teach Americans what good coffee is, although I suspect that Starbucks will eventually, if they haven't done this already, start to blend in cheaper beans to increase their profit margins.

        Incidentally, there were some Americans who knew that American coffee was awful. Restaurant suppliers, for example, tended to sell good coffee. Also, the American-flagged airlines bought high quality coffee because of the many foreigners who were flying with them. Indeed, one of the best cups of coffee I've ever had was on a TWA flight.

        --
        It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
        • (Score: 2) by SlimmPickens on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:42AM

          by SlimmPickens (1056) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:42AM (#108570)

          Most of Europe drinks awful coffee too. Espresso was only invented in the late 1800's and the E61 grouphead was only patented in 1961. One thing I learned from modernist cuisine is that Seattle is the espresso capital of the world, seems to be true. There's actually a lot of Italians on the Australian espresso forums because they go out to drink it, it's Americans and Australians leading the charge with home espresso making.

          There's been a lot of science done on espresso. Extraction at 9 Bar is understood to minimise the bitter/astringent flavours while maximising the complexity, it's really hard to do well though. It's always bitter, but especially so if it's not ground or tamped properly. Both of those things can lead to "channels" where the coffee is over extracted nearby it's under-extracted, hard to get it even. "Tiger stripes" appear when you do get it right. You have to adjust the grind up and down almost daily for various reasons but the biggest one is humidity. Knowing how to tamp properly takes a while, and Latte Art and the silky milk required (so-called microfoam) is an art form in itself. There's a petty good chance Peet's aren't doing the best possible job and Starbucks definitely aren't (maybe the original one in Seattle is).

          It used to be in the espresso world that you'd have about 80% Arabica for taste and 20% Robusta for "crema", but nowadays everyone just uses Arabica. No-one serious uses Java or any other type of bean. Beans improve for 2-4 days after roasting, and from then should be consumed within a week or so, unless you have access to fancy packaging. Green beans however are good for over a year. Pretty easy to roast too.

          Roasting yourself and getting a conical burr grinder will both do more to improve your coffee than an espresso machine will.

          • (Score: 2) by mendax on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:41AM

            by mendax (2840) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:41AM (#108580)

            Well, I will yield to your expertise since it's obvious that you at least believe you know more about coffee than I do, which is probably true. Since I drink tea most of the time I'm happy with that. I know more about how to make a good cup of tea.

            --
            It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
          • (Score: 1) by N3Roaster on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:43AM

            by N3Roaster (3860) <roaster@wilsonscoffee.com> on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:43AM (#108583) Homepage Journal

            Interestingly enough, the 9 bar thing didn't become common for any sensory reason, at least not directly. It was picked as a starting point for pump pressure based on an average of measurements on the older lever machines that just happened to work pretty well. Some of the relatively recent high end commercial pump machines have moved back toward allowing the pressure to vary during extraction with interesting results.

            While I wouldn't discourage home roasting for those interested, I'd also note that home roasters are operating under different constraints than professionals and it's not a sure-fire way to improve your coffee quality, especially if you live near a local roasting company that knows what it's doing*. Home roasters generally aren't buying enough of any one lot of coffee to run it through a product development process to figure out how that particular coffee is best roasted (there is no universally optimal roast profile) and while home roasting equipment has gotten much better lately, you can get much better control and instrumentation on commercial equipment. Don't get me wrong. Good results are definitely possible and easier now than ever, but getting consistently excellent results is unlikely. But it is fun if you're into that sort of thing.

            Finally, I'm surprised at all the talk of bitter coffee going on across most of the comments to this story. Some compounds in coffee do have a slightly bitter taste but good coffee properly brewed and unadulterated is a sweet beverage.

            * full disclosure, I roast coffee for a living and do a fair amount of training roasters who work at other companies. I'm not trying to make a sales pitch (support your local roaster instead) but it's left as an exercise for the reader to decide if this is a biased opinion or an experienced one.

            • (Score: 2) by SlimmPickens on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:31AM

              by SlimmPickens (1056) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:31AM (#108599)

              You didn't always have your email showing? I'm sure I looked at your username once and wondered if it was about coffee.

              I'm pretty sure all machines allow the pressure to vary. Both machines I've owned have 15 Bar pumps and no way to regulate other than grind/tamp. The EM6910 even had a gauge for extraction pressure.

              As for roasting, there's no way I can do a better job than the local roasters (where I buy most of my coffee), for sure, but I prefer my dodgy popcorn popper roasts to the old stuff in the supermarket.

              • (Score: 1) by N3Roaster on Wednesday October 22 2014, @02:23PM

                by N3Roaster (3860) <roaster@wilsonscoffee.com> on Wednesday October 22 2014, @02:23PM (#108678) Homepage Journal

                Most pump machines aren't designed to allow variable pump pressure *during extraction*. It's adjustable and that's what the gauge is there for, but it requires a screwdriver and in a lot of cases having the machine open to access the pump head. I was contrasting that against machines that have a control for this right at each group head. That's still something that's only available at the high end and a lot of people use that to simulate the pressure profile found on lever machines (though the technology isn't limited to such a use).

                I'm don't remember if I've always had my email showing, but that was the intent. I have the same name in enough places that it's easy enough to figure out who I am and having it showing cuts down on (but doesn't eliminate) phone calls to work or emails sent to a more general purpose address.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @08:16PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @08:16PM (#108856)

              Finally, I'm surprised at all the talk of bitter coffee going on across most of the comments to this story. Some compounds in coffee do have a slightly bitter taste but good coffee properly brewed and unadulterated is a sweet beverage.

              The first time I cupped fresh roasted coffee against Folgers (and then several other grocery store coffees), it became obvious that the grocery store coffees all contain the same, terrible contaminant. To me, it smells like mildew and immediately became the dominant aroma. I suspect this is the flavor people are describing as bitter. That, or the ash that's common in Starbucks and Peets super-dark roasts.

              • (Score: 2, Interesting) by N3Roaster on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:05PM

                by N3Roaster (3860) <roaster@wilsonscoffee.com> on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:05PM (#108885) Homepage Journal

                It's a bit more complicated than that. Bitter has a real meaning and coffee can be bitter either due to defect in the coffee or improper brewing, but most people aren't used to doing any sort of critical sensory evaluation (ugh, can't we just enjoy our food?) and at least in the US as another poster already pointed out there's not a lot in the American diet that really is bitter so most people don't know what that word means. Bitter then becomes whatever it is about the coffee that they don't like, and that can happen with even the best coffees if there's something about it that falls outside of a personal preference.

                As an interesting experiment for those who don't get sweet out of coffee, try taking a sip of black coffee (preferably something that you like) and holding it your mouth for around 30-60 seconds. Chances are good that you'll notice the sweetness by the end. Now you might think that something is going on like sucking on a soda cracker, but swallow the coffee and keep drinking the rest of the cup normally. You'll still taste it.

          • (Score: 1) by caffeine on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:01AM

            by caffeine (249) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:01AM (#108595)

            I've got a Giotto as well. Great machine.

            I know a couple of micro rosters who still use robusta in their blend. And in defense of robusta, one of the best espressos I've ever had was 100% robusta.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 15 2014, @05:32PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 15 2014, @05:32PM (#116222)

        9pQnWl nqzhjbseqnkq [nqzhjbseqnkq.com], [url=http://wpvevbslnpsf.com/]wpvevbslnpsf[/url], [link=http://mystafhquytx.com/]mystafhquytx[/link], http://fxwlbrhqstyi.com/ [fxwlbrhqstyi.com]

    • (Score: 2) by davester666 on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:02AM

      by davester666 (155) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:02AM (#108563)

      Well, if you really believe that, try splashing it on your face instead. You will be WAY more alert than if you were just drinking it.

      • (Score: 2) by redneckmother on Thursday October 23 2014, @01:41AM

        by redneckmother (3597) on Thursday October 23 2014, @01:41AM (#108976)

        ... until the anesthesia kicks in at the ER...

        --
        Mas cerveza por favor.
    • (Score: 1) by KozmoNaut on Wednesday October 22 2014, @08:57AM

      by KozmoNaut (4814) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @08:57AM (#108594)

      The best coffee I've ever had comes from my Aeropress, with medium roast, medium grind beans. The key part is to adhere to the recommended brewing and pressing times, and to use water that isn't too hot.

      When everything comes together, the result is a cup of coffee that actually tastes like fresh-brewed coffee smells, and has no bitterness even if allowed to cool. Any other coffee is mud to me now.

    • (Score: 2) by mcgrew on Wednesday October 22 2014, @03:40PM

      by mcgrew (701) <publish@mcgrewbooks.com> on Wednesday October 22 2014, @03:40PM (#108723) Homepage Journal

      I always thought that coffee worked on the theory that it takes so awful that it shocked your system into alertness.

      Are you trying for a "funny" mod? Coffee works because of the naturally occurring stimulant (caffeine) in the bean.

      --
      mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
      • (Score: 2) by mendax on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:23PM

        by mendax (2840) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:23PM (#108785)

        Are you trying for a "funny" mod?

        Well, sort of. Yes, I know how coffee is "supposed" to work, but why is it that coffee, which tastes horrible, does a great job in waking me up when tea, which tastes far better, does not even though tea generally has as much caffeine as coffee if not more.

        --
        It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
        • (Score: 2) by urza9814 on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:26PM

          by urza9814 (3954) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:26PM (#108815) Journal

          Depends on your tea. Last I checked (several years ago), Lipton boxes claimed their regular black tea has half as much caffeine as coffee.

          Personally I use a blend of gingko, ginseng, yerba mate, skullcap, lemon balm, echinacea, st john's wort, dandelion, and green tea. With a bit of honey. Now THAT will wake you the hell up! :)

          Yerba Mate all on its own will do a damn good job too though -- three times the caffeine of black tea IIRC.

          The other compounds in the drink certainly have a huge effect though. The "high" from coffee, black tea, or yerba mate all feel totally different. Yerba Mate is the closest IMO to what I get from a dose of my 100% purity caffeine powder. It's much more mental, and a lot less "jittery" than coffee in particular.

    • (Score: 1) by dpp on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:47PM

      by dpp (3579) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:47PM (#108825)

      You really need to try better coffee.
      From my experience, when I lived there, hard to find in the states except for very few exception boutique roasters/coffee shops.

      Have you been to Europe? Italy in particular opened senses to outstanding coffee.

      • (Score: 2) by mendax on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:57PM

        by mendax (2840) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:57PM (#108831)

        I've been to Europe (and Italy) but I don't remember drinking coffee there. The last time I went to a coffee place in Europe it was in York (in the UK). It was a Starbucks and I ordered cocoa, not coffee.

        --
        It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
  • (Score: 2) by Snotnose on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:07AM

    by Snotnose (1623) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:07AM (#108546)

    I'm a pretty good cook and am familiar with the maillard reaction. It takes a hot pan, much hotter than boiling water (212f, 100C). I enjoy a nice cup of coffee. I agree, it's a nasty, bitter liquid, especially as I drink it black. But somehow I don't see how my coffee enjoyment, when I brew my coffee at much less than boiling, has anything to do with the maillard reaction, which requires much higher temps.

    --
    Why shouldn't we judge a book by it's cover? It's got the author, title, and a summary of what the book's about.
    • (Score: 2) by Snotnose on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:09AM

      by Snotnose (1623) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:09AM (#108549)

      aaand I should have read the TFA, which sez the maillard reaction occurs before I dribble hot water over those roasted beans.

      --
      Why shouldn't we judge a book by it's cover? It's got the author, title, and a summary of what the book's about.
  • (Score: 2) by keplr on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:09AM

    by keplr (2104) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:09AM (#108548) Journal

    from the coffee++ dept.

    Hey, I get that reference!

    I drink an heroic amount of coffee every day, nearly two litres. I'm very discerning about my beans and brew. Ice coffee tastes just as good as hot coffee, yet delivers little smell. Something else must be going on. For the interested, I sleep an average of five fitful hours a day.

    --
    I don't respond to ACs.
    • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:34AM

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:34AM (#108558) Journal

      ice coffee tastes just as good as hot coffee, yet delivers little smell.

      An "au naturel" ice coffee - without milk or cream - tastes awful (to me, at least).
      However, once you add milk: the fats dissolve those flavours (mostly oily stuff) and stick to your mouth long enough to melt and release enough of those flavors for you feel the "coffee taste".

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:09AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:09AM (#108576)

      I drink an heroic amount of coffee every day, nearly two litres.

      How do you dare to call that dirty water you drink "coffee"? You don't have the slightest idea what real coffee is, smells or tastes. If you did, you'd be dead [wikipedia.org].

      • (Score: 2) by keplr on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:14AM

        by keplr (2104) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:14AM (#108577) Journal

        No, I'm drinking close to 10 cups (6 fluid ounces) of coffee per day. It doesn't kill me.

        --
        I don't respond to ACs.
        • (Score: 2) by tibman on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:46PM

          by tibman (134) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:46PM (#108763)

          I know coffee can give my urine a different and stronger smell. I imagine after you go you have to spray some air-freshener.

          --
          SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
          • (Score: 2) by urza9814 on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:28PM

            by urza9814 (3954) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:28PM (#108816) Journal

            That's not directly from the coffee -- it's a sign of dehydration. Your body is concentrating the stuff to save water.

            • (Score: 2) by tibman on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:31PM

              by tibman (134) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday October 22 2014, @09:31PM (#108901)

              I drink 2 liters on a desk day and 3-4 when doing physical stuff. Not much yellow going on here, lol. If i drank 10 cups of coffee i would just pee even more.

              --
              SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Skwearl on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:21AM

    by Skwearl (4314) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday October 22 2014, @04:21AM (#108553)

    this is a crock of shit. I like coffee for the bitter taste, simply put, cause so few things in the north american diet taste bitter.
    I lost my sense of smell before i ever drank coffee. I prefer a dark roast. No cream, gods no, no sugar. Black as nature intended.

    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Paradise Pete on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:04AM

      by Paradise Pete (1806) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:04AM (#108574)

      The article is about why coffee tastes good, not why it tastes bitter. Two different things are combining to create that taste. Except for you. You get only the bitter.

  • (Score: 1) by robind on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:42AM

    by robind (3) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:42AM (#108565)

    Reminds me of this stuff, which is totally as delicious as claimed: http://www.funraniumlabs.com/the-black-blood-of-the-earth/bbote-vs-coffee [funraniumlabs.com]

    • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:24AM

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:24AM (#108569) Journal

      which is totally as delicious as claimed:

      You should try these [seriouseats.com] (Kyoto style cold brews).
      When you do, please tell me how it tastes.

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
  • (Score: 2) by wonkey_monkey on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:42AM

    by wonkey_monkey (279) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:42AM (#108582) Homepage

    Why Your Coffee Tastes Good

    What do you know about "my" coffee? I might only have access to bad coffee. I might not drink coffee at all*.

    *this one is true.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk
  • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:49AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:49AM (#108585)

    My coffee tastes good because it is strong enough that an American would not like it.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:52AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 22 2014, @07:52AM (#108586)

      Hey, why did Slashcode eat my gd&r tag *despite* escaping with (amp)lt; and (amp)gt;?

      (And in Preview it was still there!)

      • (Score: 2) by sudo rm -rf on Wednesday October 22 2014, @11:19AM

        by sudo rm -rf (2357) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @11:19AM (#108607) Journal
        interesting, I can't remember ever having to encode (fantasy)-entities... But I noticed after clicking Preview the content in the input textarea changes (gt and lt get encoded) Oh yeah offtopic and systemd
  • (Score: 1) by Alien8r on Wednesday October 22 2014, @01:04PM

    by Alien8r (1322) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @01:04PM (#108628) Homepage

    I like my coffee the way I like my women; cold and bitter.
    It's an acquired taste.

    --
    No brain, no pain.
    • (Score: 2) by dyingtolive on Wednesday October 22 2014, @01:17PM

      by dyingtolive (952) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @01:17PM (#108639)

      I like my coffee the way I like my women; roasted and ground up.

      :P

      --
      Don't blame me, I voted for moose wang!
      • (Score: 2) by tibman on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:16PM

        by tibman (134) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday October 22 2014, @05:16PM (#108783)

        Mine screams from time to time but yours.. wow, couldn't imagine.

        --
        SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
    • (Score: 1) by Atatsu on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:42PM

      by Atatsu (4251) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @06:42PM (#108822)

      I like my coffee the way I like my men; strong and black.

  • (Score: 1) by barnsbarns on Wednesday October 22 2014, @01:40PM

    by barnsbarns (4730) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @01:40PM (#108650)

    It certainly isn't the Pumpkin Spice™ that makes coffee taste good.

  • (Score: 2) by PizzaRollPlinkett on Wednesday October 22 2014, @03:48PM

    by PizzaRollPlinkett (4512) on Wednesday October 22 2014, @03:48PM (#108728)

    Apparently, umami is a Japanese word. Something about disappointed in the cooking of the duck meat.

    Anyway, what about people who don't drink coffee? I know I don't- -- I mean, this guy Joey Jo Jo Junior Shabadoo I know who doesn't -- drink coffee at all.

    --
    (E-mail me if you want a pizza roll!)
  • (Score: 2) by arslan on Thursday October 23 2014, @12:40AM

    by arslan (3462) on Thursday October 23 2014, @12:40AM (#108965)

    I enjoy both of them. The bitterness plus sourness and the fragrant aroma. Sucking bitter gourd whilst smelling freshly brewed coffee just isn't the same... these guys should try it out