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posted by CoolHand on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:03AM   Printer-friendly
from the skynet-here-we-come dept.

In order to get law enforcement lobby support for a law requiring warrants to deploy drones for surveillance, North Dakota legislators decided to allow law enforcement to use "less-than-lethal" weaponized drones:

Legal experts are very concerned that a new North Dakota law which allows law enforcement drones to be armed with so-called less-than-lethal weapons—including stun guns and beanbag rounds—could be highly problematic. The law, however, explicitly forbids lethal weapons. Previous drafts of the bill specifically included prohibitions on non-lethal weapons, language that was later removed.

Among other reasons, such weapons have been shown that they can, in fact, kill people. According to research by The Guardian, 39 Americans have died this year alone at the hands of police wielding a Taser. Meanwhile, the Associated Press reported Wednesday that more than 20 North American cities are pursuing large silicone-based projectiles as yet another alternative weapon.

North Dakota is believed to be the first state in the union to allow such weapons aboard state and local police drones.

[...] The law, known as House Bill 1328, which took effect earlier this month, imposes a significant pro-privacy victory: requiring that police and sheriff's deputies get a warrant when deploying a drone for surveillance. [...] However, in order to get the measure through the state's legislative body, the bill's author told Ars that he had to do a little horse trading with the state law enforcement lobby, the North Dakota Peace Officers' Association, which had strongly lobbied against it.


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  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:08AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:08AM (#229778)

    Don't need riot control drones as long as Teh Internets stay on, everybody is too lazy to go outside and start a riot.

    • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:20AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:20AM (#229782)

      Have you ever been to North Dakota? The State tree is the telephone pole. There probably are more prairie dogs than people, and they certainly vote more often. But as far as outside, often it is 40 degrees below, whether you prefer F or C. And besides, less than lethal is still partly lethal, so you know probably this will turn into a new hunting opportunity for the perennially couch-ridden.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:36AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:36AM (#229788)

        Have you ever been to North Dakota? The State tree is the telephone pole.

        They do have phones now? Oh, wow, what a progress!

      • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Sunday August 30 2015, @03:30PM

        by Phoenix666 (552) on Sunday August 30 2015, @03:30PM (#229858) Journal

        It is true that North Dakota is very flat. It has almost always been incredibly boring. Even the governor of the state was once caught doing 110mph with a radar detector in his Cadillac. Even he didn't want to spend more time looking at the landscape in his home state than he had to. It is the one place in the world where you are glad to see the constant billboards (all for Wall Drug), because they save you from having to look at the countryside.

        North Dakota has changed a great deal in the last 5 years. The oil operations in the Bakken Formation have re-created the Wild West that surrounded the Gold Rush in California. It spills over into my home state, which also shares some access to the formation. Bus drivers make six figure salaries, every possible form of lodging down to campsites is taken by oil workers, prostitution, drug use, bar brawls, shootings, etc are epidemic.

        The idea of police using weaponized drones is terrible. It should not be allowed. It opens the door to everyone following suit. You can see, against the backdrop of what's happening there lately, why police and legislators have reflexively allowed it.

        --
        Washington DC delenda est.
        • (Score: 2) by Reziac on Monday August 31 2015, @03:18AM

          by Reziac (2489) on Monday August 31 2015, @03:18AM (#230022) Homepage

          My first thought was -- what on earth does ND need drones for anyway? to chase farmers hauling hay across the Canadian border? (Lots of farms straddle the border. Including my great-granddad's.)

          My second was -- when does the season open?

          BTW if you like to eat, flat is good. Flat is productive. Flat is easy to cultivate, plant, irrigate, and harvest. The more lumps, the less productive for crops. Next time you're stuffing your face, give thanks to flat.

          --
          And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
          • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday August 31 2015, @11:03PM

            by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday August 31 2015, @11:03PM (#230506) Journal

            North Dakota is not particularly productive. It's all strip farming because otherwise they'd have to let everything lie fallow every 3rd year to avoid completely depleting the soil. Flat also has little to do with productivity. Soil quality and growing season and fertilizer and technique do. Indonesia does quite well with productivity and much of their arable land is terraced hills. People in the amazon basin growing on terra preta can get *8* crops/year.

            --
            Washington DC delenda est.
  • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:42AM

    by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:42AM (#229792) Journal

    with the state law enforcement lobby, the North Dakota Less-Than-Lethal-Peace Officers' Association

    There, FTFY.
    "Rhymes" well with the Dept of Defence.

    --
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by basicbasicbasic on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:55AM

    by basicbasicbasic (411) on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:55AM (#229795)

    If 39 people have been killed by tasers then they need to be reclassified as lethal weapons and regulated accordingly, in the same way a gun doesn't always kill but is still classified as a lethal weapon.

    A quick look on Wikipedia shows the British police class tasers as "less lethal" which is a step in the right direction, but does sound almost as absurd as "slightly fatal".

    • (Score: 1) by basicbasicbasic on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:56AM

      by basicbasicbasic (411) on Sunday August 30 2015, @11:56AM (#229796)

      I should have read the article.

      • (Score: 2) by inertnet on Sunday August 30 2015, @01:16PM

        by inertnet (4071) on Sunday August 30 2015, @01:16PM (#229817) Journal

        Well, there is a potentially lethal difference between "less-than-lethal" and "less lethal".

    • (Score: 3, Funny) by Entropy on Sunday August 30 2015, @01:30PM

      by Entropy (4228) on Sunday August 30 2015, @01:30PM (#229821)

      Warning: Lethal post, read at your own risk.

      39 People? Are you serious? A HUGE number of people have been tased..and 39 people is completely insignificant statistically speaking.. Anything can kill. Air, rain, or yelling "Surprise!" at a Birthday party. Somewhere, somehow, someone died from it. Thus by your rule everything is lethal...including this post. Feel your blood pressure rising? Heart attack is on the way.

      • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @03:17PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 30 2015, @03:17PM (#229854)

        If there's a nigga behind the trigga, it don't matter if you smalla or bigga.

    • (Score: 2) by darkfeline on Sunday August 30 2015, @10:54PM

      by darkfeline (1030) on Sunday August 30 2015, @10:54PM (#229986) Homepage

      I don't know about you, but if somehow I end up on the wrong side of an officer I'd much rather he tase me than shoot me.

      --
      Join the SDF Public Access UNIX System today!
  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by LowSpeedHighDrag on Sunday August 30 2015, @01:33PM

    by LowSpeedHighDrag (5592) on Sunday August 30 2015, @01:33PM (#229822)

    I'd really like to see changes in who is allowed to lobby in the US. In this case, law enforcement groups should not be involved in lobbying for or against legislation. The role of police is to enforce the laws as those laws are determined by the citizens through the citizens' representatives (elected officials). The only involvement police should have in the legislative process is to respond to any questions from the legislature as they consider new laws. And those questions should be technical in nature. Questions of policy belong with citizens and their representatives.

    TLDR: Cops should work for the citizens not the other way around.

    • (Score: 2) by Entropy on Sunday August 30 2015, @02:19PM

      by Entropy (4228) on Sunday August 30 2015, @02:19PM (#229838)

      And lawyers shouldn't be allowed to be politicians either.

  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Sunday August 30 2015, @02:17PM

    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Sunday August 30 2015, @02:17PM (#229835) Journal

    I listen to a radio talk show on my way home from work in the mornings. They feature a daily taser report. About half of them seem to be reasonable use of force. Some of the rest are probably reasonable judgement calls as well. Others are just examples of people who never should have been cops, abusing their authority and/or power.

    I think that every time a taser is used, the cop should also be jolted after the arrest is made. They need to be reminded again and again that 50,000 volts is more than enough to kill. Make them play Russian Roulette with the taser, and they won't be so very quick to use it.

    I'm not against tasers, so much as I'm against cop's readiness to resort to force.

    • (Score: 1) by LowSpeedHighDrag on Sunday August 30 2015, @10:26PM

      by LowSpeedHighDrag (5592) on Sunday August 30 2015, @10:26PM (#229978)

      I know a number of cops mostly because I enjoy shooting and firearms training and have met quite a few that way. The subject of Tasers (and other Less than Lethal stuff) has come up many times. The Taser company requires that any LE training includes the trainees being Tasered themselves. A good policy IMO. Quite painful from what friends tell me - every muscle basically goes into spasm. But it also stops completely when the trigger is released. Everyone I know that has experienced it also says that they would vastly prefer the Taser to getting pepper sprayed because the pain is very brief with a Taser but goes on and on with pepper spray.

      Side note: I mis spelled pepper spray as: peeper spray before I hit preview. That would be a whole nother ball game!

  • (Score: 2) by VortexCortex on Sunday August 30 2015, @09:56PM

    by VortexCortex (4067) on Sunday August 30 2015, @09:56PM (#229976)

    more than 20 North American cities are pursuing large silicone-based projectiles as yet another alternative weapon.

    I'll see your Dildo Gun, and raise you a DD Cup Catapult.