Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments

SoylentNews is people

posted by CoolHand on Friday December 11 2015, @10:26AM   Printer-friendly
from the coming-soon-to-a-vehicle-near-you dept.

An electric car has been tested that managed a huge 1,100 mile range on a single charge. A massive jump from current electric cars.

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/129419-electric-car-with-light-aluminium-air-battery-travels-1-100-miles-on-a-single-charge-take-note-tesla

-- submitted from IRC

An electric car has been tested that managed a huge 1,100 mile range on a single charge. A massive jump from current electric cars like the Tesla Model S which tops out at around 300 miles.

The secret to this super range is a type of battery technology called aluminium-air. This uses oxygen naturally occurring in the air to fill its cathode. This makes it far lighter than liquid filled lithium-ion batteries to give car a far greater range.

Phinergy, who created the battery, is an Israeli company who worked with aluminium specialist Alcoa Canada to create the batteries.

[...] Aluminium-air batteries drain turning the metal into aluminium hydroxide which can then be recycled to make new batteries. That will mean swapping out batteries every few months. But since it's so much lighter and cheaper than current efforts it should offer huge mileage and be affordable.

Original Submission

This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Display Options Threshold/Breakthrough Mark All as Read Mark All as Unread
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
  • (Score: 3, Funny) by Rivenaleem on Friday December 11 2015, @10:43AM

    by Rivenaleem (3400) on Friday December 11 2015, @10:43AM (#274916)

    Just wait for the other big electric car manufacturers crush this new technology with law suits and cheaper alternatives. This will never make it to market because all people really want is massive electricity guzzling muscle machines that have terrible fuel efficiency.

    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @01:53PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @01:53PM (#274962)

      Well they only said how far it went on a charge, not how fast it was able to go that entire time.

  • (Score: 5, Informative) by theluggage on Friday December 11 2015, @11:26AM

    by theluggage (1797) on Friday December 11 2015, @11:26AM (#274924)

    An electric car has been tested that managed a huge 1,100 mile range on a single charge^H^H^H^H^H set of non-rechargeable batteries. FTFY.

    Still impressive - but, as TFA says, you'd have to use something like Telsa's battery-swap stations to replace the battery every few months. What TFA doesn't say is that the battery-swap stations would have to be constantly supplied with new batteries, unlike the Tesla system where they can recharge them on-site, so the infrastructure is going to be even harder to set up and who knows what the replacement cost is going to be?

    Also, this seems to be throwing the baby out with the bathwater: being able to recharge overnight for most of your day-to-day driving is a big advantage of current EVs - its the issue of occasional long journeys that needs fixing. The idea in TFA of a hybrid system - with a Li-Ion plus this as a "range extender" sounds more interesting - if the numbers work out.

    • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday December 11 2015, @11:47AM

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Friday December 11 2015, @11:47AM (#274928) Journal

      An electric car has been tested that managed a huge 1,100 mile range on a single charge^H^H^H^H^H load of non-rechargeable batteries.

      To be profusely and utterly pedantic to the (bitter?) end.
      (I suspect they aren't changing the entire battery, but only flush the Al(OH)3 and load another amount of aluminium to be corroded).

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
    • (Score: 1) by Delwin on Friday December 11 2015, @02:55PM

      by Delwin (4554) on Friday December 11 2015, @02:55PM (#274982)

      Months? I go through 1,100 miles (about four tanks of gas) in just under a month. Fill the tank about once a week.

      • (Score: 5, Informative) by mr_mischief on Friday December 11 2015, @03:35PM

        by mr_mischief (4884) on Friday December 11 2015, @03:35PM (#274994)

        You add water every couple of hundred miles. Then every 1100 miles that this is the source of power, you replace around 55 pounds of aluminum plates and send the old ones for recycling. It's likely to end up as a range extender for smaller lithium-ion batteries. You'd drive your first fifty miles or so on the lithium ion or lithium polymer batteries. Then this would kick in giving you the rest of a day's driving until you can recharge the rechargeable battery. It gives you a better weight to power ratio than filling the car with more heavy lithium ion cells.

        http://www.gizmag.com/phinergy-metal-air-battery/26922/ [gizmag.com] (April 3rd 2013)

  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Gravis on Friday December 11 2015, @11:32AM

    by Gravis (4596) on Friday December 11 2015, @11:32AM (#274926)

    while electric cars are great and all, the US has a huge market that has yet to be tapped: electric tractor trailer trucks. since many are going long distances, having a lighter battery that goes further would be a huge advantage. maybe install 100 automated battery swap locations around the country and you've got the market for continental trucking. it would certainly be a better application of the huge amount of torque that electric cars have and could maybe do away with your typical 10 gear setup. this would result in lower maintenance for trucks which would be great. however, people can't stay awake forever so autonomous driving would be a good solution. now we just need to standardize the loading and unloading of goods and we can put a large amount of the population in the unemployment line!

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @02:37PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @02:37PM (#274976)

      maybe install 100 automated battery swap locations around the country

      That would be 'good start'. But not nearly enough by a factor of at least 500x (even that may be too small). A typical long haul guy can crack off 600-800 in 1 shift. Swapping with another dude to finish the shift. Some trucks never stop rolling.

      people can't stay awake forever so autonomous driving would be a good solution

      A separate problem dont mash the two together.

      Instead of swapping the battery it may be simpler to just swap the whole cab. With pre charged cabs ready to go. Then let the 'dead head' cab sit and charge. This could be better if the cost can be reduced (which getting rid of things like those crazy transmissions would do). Most cabs start around 250k. Get that cost down and swapping makes more sense.

    • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @04:08PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @04:08PM (#275004)

      " now we just need to standardize the loading and unloading of goods and we can put a large amount of the population in the unemployment line!"

      Or on the ground in the Middle East.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @08:08PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @08:08PM (#275126)

        Unsure which side you are saying they would be on.

  • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @12:18PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @12:18PM (#274931)

    if all those paris talks were of serious nature (and not just "pull-wool-over-your-head-we're-goin'-nuclear")
    then anticipate a huge new demand for aluminium for solarpanels and frames and whatnot.

    i betcha the nuke lobby is doing some hard-core calculation to figure out if helping to push
    this type of battery will again push up prices of solarpanels because aluminium is diverted (and
    coincidentally reloaded thru nuke powerplants) for this battery and thus another new hurdle
    for one of the sane ways to get electricity ...?

  • (Score: 2) by t-3 on Friday December 11 2015, @12:39PM

    by t-3 (4907) on Friday December 11 2015, @12:39PM (#274939)

    If a single charge only goes 1100 miles, how do they foresee swapping out batteries only every 3 months? I saw the article says owners would have to add water occassionaly, is that the "charge" referred to?

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by FatPhil on Friday December 11 2015, @12:55PM

      by FatPhil (863) <pc-soylentNO@SPAMasdf.fi> on Friday December 11 2015, @12:55PM (#274947) Homepage
      You're supposed to use the rechargeable Lithium battery for day-to-day short runs. The Al-air is just for occasional long runs where the Li won't do.

      Thinking out of the box... If there's room for X Li and X Al batteries, and you only need the Al rarely, wouldn't it be better if you could just have 2X Li batteries for day-to-day use and only swap in the Al when you knew you'd need it. And what's about swapping in 2X Al batteries for ultra-long runs where you know you can just get replacements at the end. I wonder how much complete modularity would cost in terms of complexity?
      --
      Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @01:50PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @01:50PM (#274960)

        First saw an Al-air battery in a car at a trade show in the 1980s -- not a new idea. The problem at that time was low peak current. Stores lots of energy, but can't deliver high power bursts for acceleration.

        TFA didn't really say much, but it seems like the Al-air battery in this test car is used in the same way as the range-extender engine in the Chevy Volt or other range-extended electric cars.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @07:45PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @07:45PM (#275113)

          IANAEE, but couldn't you add capacitors or something like that to store up power for those sudden bursts of acceleration?

    • (Score: 2) by Nesh on Friday December 11 2015, @01:47PM

      by Nesh (269) on Friday December 11 2015, @01:47PM (#274959)
      that's because these are not rechargeable batteries but primary cells: meant to be used once and discarded/recycled after use.
      See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium%E2%80%93air_battery [wikipedia.org]

      This is not new tech either. This kind of setup has been tested in 1989 but in combination with lead-acid battery instead of current lithium-ion batteries.
      • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @03:14PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @03:14PM (#274988)

        I figured out 15 years ago that Electric Vehicles will always be at a disadvantage for long-haul uses: precisely because they have to store the reaction products, while vehicles venting to the atmosphere after reacting with free oxygen (including hydrogen vehicles) do not.

        THS points out that this design DOES in fact store the reaction products: in the form of aluminum hydroxide. This battery design actually get HEAVIER with use: the opposite of how your traditional fuel-tank works.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @03:16PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @03:16PM (#274990)

          null dummy text. MOre null dummy text.

        • (Score: 3, Insightful) by FunkyLich on Friday December 11 2015, @04:42PM

          by FunkyLich (4689) on Friday December 11 2015, @04:42PM (#275019)

          I'll take this heavier variant where everyone driving carries their own shit with them and don't burden others, instead of the lighter variant where every driver dumps shit in the atmosphere for everyone else to breathe, even the non-drivers and even the non-humans.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @06:43PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @06:43PM (#275090)

            I agree, that is why I specified "long haul" applications.

            Sometimes while I am riding my bike in traffic, I feel like I am taking one for the team with all the fumes.

        • (Score: 2) by bzipitidoo on Friday December 11 2015, @07:43PM

          by bzipitidoo (4388) on Friday December 11 2015, @07:43PM (#275111) Journal

          That is true, but electric motors can be close to 100% efficient at converting electricity into motion. Think a typical figure is 98%. (However, not every kind of electric motor is that good.) In contrast, gasoline engines max out at about 30% to 35% efficiency. And that is only at the optimum RPM and load. With such a huge disparity, an electric motor more than compensates for the extra weight of the less efficient fuel storage. It's the other problems with batteries that are holding back the electric car-- the long recharge times, limited energy capacity which makes for short ranges, short battery life, and expense. It is really tough to compete against the humble gas tank for simplicity and practicality.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @07:45PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 11 2015, @07:45PM (#275115)

          >"This battery design actually get HEAVIER with use"

          True, but the system could be designed so that you can dump the AlOH periodically independently of changing the whole battery. If you did that when adding water, it would be a minor inconvenience. A good design would be a car that could hold five 200 mile batteries that are used one at a time, so that a battery could be entirely depleted before swapping it out. For around-town use, you could run with just two such batteries, saving some weight and opening up some cargo space.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday December 12 2015, @04:30AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Saturday December 12 2015, @04:30AM (#275303)

          Hydrogen doesn't have to be burned. With a fuel cell, electricity can be produced from it.

  • (Score: 2) by Username on Friday December 11 2015, @09:00PM

    by Username (4557) on Friday December 11 2015, @09:00PM (#275146)

    Or you could skip the aluminum/water and put in a alcohol based turbine generator in the car and stop off at any gas station or liquor store when you need to refill.