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posted by CoolHand on Monday December 14 2015, @09:57PM   Printer-friendly
from the rock-on-to-electric-avenue dept.

Ford announced that it would be investing some $4.5 billion over the next five years toward its goal of building better "electrified vehicle solutions" and bringing electrification to 40% of its vehicle lineup by 2020. Seeing as transportation is a key climate issue, it's only fitting to learn about Ford's sharpened focus on EVs as a solution. According to the company, it will be adding 13 new electrified vehicles to its portfolio by 2020, which could offer more options for the potential EV customers who aren't currently able to drive electric, either because of price or driving range or size.

The most significant news in the near future of Ford's electric vehicle lineup is the rollout of the new Focus Electric next year, which will feature a 100-mile range and a DC fast-charging system that is claimed to give the vehicle an 80% charge in 30 minutes, a full two hours faster than the current model. No announcement was made about the price of the new Focus Electric, but based on last year's model prices, it would be somewhere in the neighborhood of $30,000. That's not exactly an entry-level car purchase, but it's a lot more affordable than a Tesla at the moment, and if a pure EV fits your driving habits, it could slash your fuel bills for years and be a cleaner transport option than a fuel-efficient gas car.


Original Submission

Related Stories

Google and Ford to Collaborate on Autonomous Vehicles 1 comment

Yahoo Autos reports that Google and Ford will be teaming up for a joint venture that will commercialize autonomous vehicle technology. The venture will be formally announced at the Consumer Electronics Show in January:

By pairing with Google, Ford gets a massive boost in self-driving software development; while the automaker has been experimenting with its own systems for years, it only revealed plans this month to begin testing on public streets in California. Google has 53 test vehicles on the road in California and Texas, with 1.3 million miles logged in autonomous driving.

By pairing with Ford, the search-engine giant avoids spending billions of dollars and several years that building its own automotive manufacturing expertise would require. Earlier this year, Google co-founder Sergey Brin said the company was looking for manufacturing partners that would use the company's self-driving system, which it believes could someday eliminate the roughly 33,000 annual deaths on U.S. roads.

While exact details of the partnership were unclear, it's understood the venture would be legally separate from Ford, in part to shield the automaker from liability concerns. Questions of who will be responsible for any crashes involving self-driving cars have been seen as a major hurdle to putting them on the road; earlier this year, Volvo said it would accept responsibility for crashes in autonomous mode, a pledge followed by Google and Mercedes-Benz.

The deal is understood to be non-exclusive; Google has been talking to several other automakers for some time about using its self-driving systems. Most major automakers and several auto parts suppliers are developing their own self-driving controls as well, with a few—Nissan, Volvo and Mercedes-Benz among them—promising advanced vehicles for customer sales by 2020.

Related: Uber vs. Google: The Race to Monetize Autonomous Vehicles
In Pilot Programs, Ford Embraces a World Where not Everyone Owns a Car
Ford Investing $4.5 Billion to Bring Electrification to 40% of Its Vehicles by 2020
Ford to Test Autonomous Cars in California in 2016
Is California Overregulating Driverless Cars?


Original Submission

Ford Will Lose $3 Billion on Electric Vehicles in 2023, It Says 3 comments

https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/03/ford-will-lose-3-billion-on-electric-vehicles-in-2023-it-says/

There's no doubt that Ford is embracing electrification. It was first to market with an electric pickup truck for the US market, and a darn good one at that. It has a solid midsize electric crossover that's becoming more and more common on the road, even if it does still upset the occasional Mustangophile. And there's an electric Transit van for the trades. But its electric vehicle division will lose $3 billion this year as it continues to build new factories and buy raw materials.

The news came in a peek into Ford's financials released this morning. As we reported last year, Ford has split its passenger vehicle operations into two divisions. Electric vehicles fall under Ford Model e, with internal combustion engine-powered Fords (including hybrids and plug-in hybrids) falling under Ford Blue. The move was in large part to placate investors and analysts, no doubt starry-eyed during a time when any EV-related stock was booming.

Related:
Tesla Exceeded Revenue Estimates in Q4 2021 by More than $1 Billion (20220127)
Tesla Burns More Cash, Fails to Meet Production Targets (20171102)
Ford Investing $4.5 Billion to Bring Electrification to 40% of Its Vehicles by 2020 (20151214)


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  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by TrumpetPower! on Monday December 14 2015, @10:16PM

    by TrumpetPower! (590) <ben@trumpetpower.com> on Monday December 14 2015, @10:16PM (#276372) Homepage

    The first major manufacturer to release an electric version of its pony car (Ford's Mustang, Chevy's Camaro, etc.) will be seen as revolutionary and will mop the floor with the competition until they catch up. Such a car will significantly outperform any gasoline-powered option from the competition and cost somewhere in the middle of the price range. Once that happens, a lot of the testosterone-poisoned market will start to think of gasoline as old-and-busted, with electric the new hawtness. And the "wife approval factor" of such cars will be phenomenal.

    There'll always be nostalgia for the roar of the V8 and all the rest...but those who care about the numbers on the timeslips will go all electric about as fast as the manufacturers can crank out the cars.

    b&

    --
    All but God can prove this sentence true.
    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by bob_super on Monday December 14 2015, @10:39PM

      by bob_super (1357) on Monday December 14 2015, @10:39PM (#276380)

      If the idiots living in my area are anything to go by, those EVs need a second battery just to power some kind of "look at me, dammit" speaker system to replace the engine roar.
      Whether it's on Harleys or with V8/10/12s, too many Americans, right in the target demographic you speak of, believe they ain't cool if you don't hear them from a couple miles away.

      • (Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Tuesday December 15 2015, @06:36PM

        by Grishnakh (2831) on Tuesday December 15 2015, @06:36PM (#276747)

        A bunch of modern cars (including Mustangs I believe) already play a fake engine noise over the stereo so that the 4-cylinder or V6 sounds like a V8 to the driver.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @10:43PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @10:43PM (#276381)

      The problem is that the high-end pony cars are so over priced. The margins must be freaking enormous.
      Top end 2016 mustang is $37,000 [truecar.com] (shelby mustangs are much higher)
      Top end 2016 camaro is $43,000 [truecar.com] (z models not priced yet, but 2015s were $60K-$75K)

      Any (successful) electric pony car is going to cannibalize the most lucrative part of their own model line-up. Detroit has a very strong history of short-sightedly avoiding that kind of internal competition. It seems unlikely that it will happen voluntarily. It will probably take the equivalent of an electric datsun 240z to push detroit into action.

  • (Score: 0, Offtopic) by buswolley on Monday December 14 2015, @10:56PM

    by buswolley (848) on Monday December 14 2015, @10:56PM (#276385)

    Finally after years 7 years
    I am become

    Ph.D.

    WOOOHH YEAH!!!

    MOD ME DOWN! Hell yeah I did it!!!!!!!!!!

    --
    subicular junctures
    • (Score: 1) by Flyingmoose on Monday December 14 2015, @11:12PM

      by Flyingmoose (4369) <reversethis-{moc ... lf} {ta} {esoom}> on Monday December 14 2015, @11:12PM (#276394) Homepage

      You am become? You might want to see if you can get a refund for that Ph.D.

      • (Score: 2) by buswolley on Monday December 14 2015, @11:17PM

        by buswolley (848) on Monday December 14 2015, @11:17PM (#276399)

        It's archaic but not ungrammatical. It's an example of an old style of present-perfect sense: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Present_perfect [wikipedia.org]

        In any case, I am a neuroscientist.
        but you could have pointed out I wrote years twice.

        --
        subicular junctures
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:20PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:20PM (#276401)

          present-perfect sense
          damn
          present-perfect tense

          I hope your dissertation was not so sloppy :P

          • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:23PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:23PM (#276405)

            Leave it to a geek website to shit on someone for a typo.

            There's gotta be at least one neuroscience dissertation's worth of research explaining that phenomenon.

            • (Score: 2) by buswolley on Monday December 14 2015, @11:27PM

              by buswolley (848) on Monday December 14 2015, @11:27PM (#276406)

              Funnily, I was that Anom and I was making fun of myself for sloppy typing.

              --
              subicular junctures
              • (Score: 2) by takyon on Monday December 14 2015, @11:50PM

                by takyon (881) <{takyon} {at} {soylentnews.org}> on Monday December 14 2015, @11:50PM (#276418) Journal

                Multiple personality disorder, eh?

                --
                [SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @05:57PM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @05:57PM (#276726)

                  Does that mean you not fit nor licensed to practice for evening house calls if you Mr. Hyde during the night?

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:42AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:42AM (#276492)

          In any case, I am a neuroscientist.

          As much of an expert as Ben Carson?

      • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:58PM

        by Phoenix666 (552) on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:58PM (#276621) Journal
        --
        Washington DC delenda est.
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:19PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:19PM (#276400)

      Here's your new sig:
      ------------------------------
      That's DOCTOR moron to you.

    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:36PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 14 2015, @11:36PM (#276413)

      From one Doctor to another, much congrats to you and welcome to the club.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:31AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:31AM (#276426)

      congrats!

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by xpda on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:04AM

        by xpda (5991) on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:04AM (#276477) Homepage

        I second it!

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:28AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:28AM (#276453)

      "Now, I am become death, the destroyer of worlds."

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:40AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:40AM (#276489)

      BS = bull shit
      MS = more of the same
      PHD = piled higher, deeper

  • (Score: 2) by HiThere on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:25AM

    by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:25AM (#276424) Journal

    Somebody better be investing a lot in electrical generation, or brown outs will be an everyday event.

    --
    Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:54AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @12:54AM (#276436)

      The grid will be mostly fine if the cars typically charge at night (when nobody else is drawing much power). In fact, initially, the grid may become more efficient as the power plants can run at a more consistent load.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:52AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:52AM (#276470)

        Furthermore parked cars can be a source of power to help smooth demand spikes. [greencarreports.com] It is called Vehicle-to-Grid (V2G) and nissan is already experimenting with that concept. [ecowatch.com] Since most cars spend over 90% of their time parked it would only take a couple of percent of each car's capacity to create an enormous reservoir to buffer the grid.

        • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @05:44AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @05:44AM (#276533)

          So if I want to drive off just after peak power, my car will have minimal power left. This sounds great, but I don't see it working unless there is some magical agreement as to exactly how and when everyone's car gives up its power.

          Regardless of when cars charge or discharge, the grid will have to significantly increase its capacity. No amount of load levelling is going to avoid the fact that cars take an enormous amount of energy to operate. My back-of-the-envelope calculations for where I live show that converting all the cars to electric (and assuming a doubling of efficiency compared to internal combustion engines) the grid has to double. Twice the nukes, twice the hydroelectric dams, twice the gas generators, twice the wind power, twice the solar. IOW - it ain't gonna happen anytime soon, while the auto makers are not gonna wait. In the end, it will just be a blame game - it was the politicians who didn't act or the power companies protecting the status quo or the environmentalists blocking progress, or...

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @09:12AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 15 2015, @09:12AM (#276579)

            No. In reality, increased demand for energy will push electricity price high, and then elevated prices will have double effect: one, more demand for efficiency of not only cars, but every house appliance and every manufacturing process which uses electric power, too, and the other effect - elevated profits in electric energy generation business - leading to boost in investment into power generation. So, in short, the inevitable time lag in building more energy supply to meet demand will build the pressure on energy efficiency first. And as necessity is unwilling kicking and screaming mother of invention, we are about to see another engineering renaissance. We are already sort-of working on efficiency, but this work lacks real feverish pressure and resulting revolutionary ideas.

      • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:07PM

        by Phoenix666 (552) on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:07PM (#276625) Journal

        It's a data point of two, so take it with a grain of salt but the two guys I know who own and drive electrics to work have stopped recharging at night and charge at work to shift the cost of the electricity to their employers. With most Americans being pushed to the financial brink, great numbers of them may do the same thing and charge during the day at the workplace.

        --
        Washington DC delenda est.
  • (Score: 1) by xpda on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:07AM

    by xpda (5991) on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:07AM (#276479) Homepage

    How much will Ford, Samsung, and other giants hurt Tesla? Is Tesla's gigafactory intended to hedge their auto business by selling batteries to Ford, et. al.?

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:43AM

      by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday December 15 2015, @02:43AM (#276493) Journal

      Tesla is likely one of the stimuli that is pushing Ford and the other major auto makers. More people want Tesla's vehicles than there are vehicles. If the auto makers sit on their thumbs for much longer, they may find that Tesla has a near monopoly on electric vehicles. Had they made the first move, all future EV's would have to measure up to Ford's vehicles. Having allowed Tesla to have center stage for a few years already, Ford is going to have to measure up to Tesla's offerings. If they fail to measure up in any aspect, they will be punished by the market, and Tesla will be rewarded.

      --
      We've finally beat Medicare! - Houseplant in Chief
      • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:16PM

        by Phoenix666 (552) on Tuesday December 15 2015, @01:16PM (#276629) Journal

        I would say it goes deeper than making an electric car. Tesla has built an electric car, but they've also re-thought the entire car, with over-the-air upgrades, autopilot, supercharger networks, leveraging a battery factory to supply cars and homes...the other auto companies have deep pockets but Elon Musk has strategic vision that has Tesla playing 3 dimensional chess while everyone else is playing checkers.

        All you have to know about their potential is to look at how much they've already disrupted the auto business with their tiny production line. Once their battery factory comes online and their mass-market Model 3 becomes available, it'll be all she wrote for the internal combustion engine.

        --
        Washington DC delenda est.