A group in Washington is promoting an initiative to reduce gun crime by using laser-etched bullets to track shooters. According to their website, the data will only be used for legitimate investigations (no datamining) and secured with "recursive verification" features (sounds like a blockchain). Washington state already requires ammunition purchasers to produce valid ID when making purchases. Googling reveals that previous efforts by state legislatures to enact similar legislation have been torpedoed by the gun lobby. Initiatives are not subject to lobbying, so it should be interesting to see how the opposition tackles this campaign.
http://dosomethingwa.org
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-guns-ammunition-idUSBRE90J02K20130120
http://igg.me/at/dosomethingwa
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 10 2016, @06:59AM
I click on links indiscriminately. The last link redirects to https://www.indiegogo.com/distil_r_blocked.html?Ref=/at/dosomethingwa [indiegogo.com] . Other people, who don't indiscriminately click on links, might prefer to know a link's ultimate destination. Of course I don't speak for them.
(Score: 2) by AndyTheAbsurd on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:42PM
This is fairly obvious, if you know that igg.me is a link-shortener for IndieGoGo. Insert TheMoreYouKnow.mp4 here.
Please note my username before responding. You may have been trolled.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2016, @07:04AM
The more you know, the less often you get conned.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:01AM
Yes, because the use of lasered ammunition make this an unbeatable solution.
Quick, somebody publish a... something... for self 3D-printed bullets (say, ain't I nerdy?)
(grin)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 1) by anubi on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:12AM
Uhmmm. Nobody's using molten lead / recycled solder and molds anymore?
We used to do that all the time back home. Those brass shells were valuable and re-usable.
In the backwater area, it was pretty common to go through thousands of rounds of ammo before one got really proficient on how to aim the firearm properly. Most typical usages were things like defending the henhouse against a skunk at 3AM. You did not wanna shoot your hens!
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:28AM
Uhmmm. Nobody's using molten lead / recycled solder and molds anymore?
WELL DONE! you exposed that it will only work for almost all violent crime so we should scrap the entire idea! i'm so glad you posted.
((ヾ(≧皿≦；)ノ＿))Fuuuuuu—-！
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:56AM
I may be better to be scrapped. See... better X guilty escape than a single innocent suffer.
(in other words: how hard it would be for one to frame another for a crime?
An IP address fails to be an ID, why do you think a laser-etched code functions better?)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 1) by anubi on Wednesday February 10 2016, @08:29AM
Now, that's even scarier.
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Gravis on Wednesday February 10 2016, @09:13AM
An IP address fails to be an ID, why do you think a laser-etched code functions better?
I don't, you presumed that. What it will do is provide information where previously there was none. It's the same reason cars have license plates.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by c0lo on Wednesday February 10 2016, @09:48AM
Unreliable or bad info is worse than no info: be it if only because takes time/resources to verify it.
What guarantees one has that the information will be reliable (or, indeed, even available)?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Tork on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:42PM
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈
(Score: 2) by kurenai.tsubasa on Wednesday February 10 2016, @04:49PM
For the same reason people think fingerprint locks are futuristic sci fi, the world of tomorrow, today, despite how easy they are to disable. iow, magical thinking.
At least existing forensics of rifling patterns requires some detective work to find the weapon used.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 12 2016, @12:12AM
is pure tv grade csi bullcrap.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday February 10 2016, @08:36PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Wednesday February 10 2016, @10:16PM
What guarantees one has that the information will be reliable (or, indeed, even available)?
why does it need to be a guarantee? what guarantee is there for serial numbers on guns? what guarantee is there for license plates on cars? should we do away with gun serial numbers and car license plates?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 11 2016, @03:23AM
Yes. Next question?
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday February 11 2016, @06:37AM
To paraphrase: great costs requires great benefit. And: there's greater costs in huge numbers.
How many guns/cars in circulation in US? Now, how many bullets?
How fast/cheap a car without a license plate can be detected? Now, how would one detect a non-licensed bullet? How expensive would it be to produce such a bullet?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Thursday February 11 2016, @08:30AM
How many guns/cars in circulation in US? Now, how many bullets?
millions and many millions. what's your point? do you think we are going to run out of numbers or something?
How fast/cheap a car without a license plate can be detected?
it's super easy to remove and replace the plates, so you could wait until just before you commit a crime to remove them. it couldn't be detected in time to prevent crime but that's not the point of them, now is it?
Now, how would one detect a non-licensed bullet?
the same questions apply to gun serial numbers. it's after the fact but that doesn't mean we should just give up on them.
How expensive would it be to produce such a bullet?
the expense is in the time it takes, just like serial numbers on guns.
just because it doesn't work 100% of the time does not mean it's not worth doing.
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Thursday February 11 2016, @08:32AM
To paraphrase: great costs requires great benefit. And: there's greater costs in huge numbers.
why do you think it's going to cost a lot of money to simply start putting serial numbers on ammo?
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday February 11 2016, @09:55AM
Come one, mate: a bullet is not a digital bitcoin (to be easy to attach a block chain to it and record the transactions). Even assuming that everything would go legit, recording a transaction of a bullet changing hands every time means quite a huge amount of info to be entered in a system. And this come with an effort: you sure do know what happens when you ask others to put an effort for you, effort from which they derive no benefit.
Plus, the entire system can be gamed so easily, this info will be unreliable at best
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Thursday February 11 2016, @11:51AM
It's not the etching of the codes, it's the tracking (of those great numbers of bullets) that comes with high cost.
non-sense. POS software would just be adjusted so that you scan an extra barcode on the package of bullets and maybe swipe an ID card and you are done. the transaction goes into a DB somewhere and sits until queried. why is it going to be expensive?
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday February 11 2016, @12:21PM
Where's that barcode etched? If somewhere visible, then I'll guarantee you a black market of "fake barcoded bullets" will appear in a very short time - not like one has troubles in buying an engraving laser.
If it's not easily visible, then the transfer of a bullet could only be done only in specialized places. Yeah, sure, the good citizens will always do it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Thursday February 11 2016, @01:02PM
how many times do you have to be told?
just because it doesn't work 100% of the time does not mean it's not worth doing.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday February 11 2016, @08:49PM
How many times do you have to be told: even if it works 100% of the time, it may not worth doing (due to the cost).
(your position reminds me of some micromanagers that I encountered during my professional life: putting a burden on the team of reporting on daily activities and wondering why the things progress so slow towards completion)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Thursday February 11 2016, @09:26PM
even if it works 100% of the time, it may not worth doing (due to the cost).
which part of a simple database of sales is going to be costly? you act like we'll have to invent some sort of new technology just to incorporate it into the existing framework of our society/economy.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday February 11 2016, @11:15PM
That part in which the real-world transaction need to pause for the data to be recorded in the system. A big number of times.
Even honest players will game the system to gain back their time, making the recorded data unreliable.
Which, in turn, will cost the investigators effort to certify the data. So the investigators will use it only if everything fails.
The result? Everybody pays for little benefit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Friday February 12 2016, @01:53AM
That part in which the real-world transaction need to pause for the data to be recorded in the system. A big number of times.
your ID lookup would take maybe 200 milliseconds but the storage transaction would take no time because it's an asynchronous database insertion. it would be a few extra seconds for people which would be used swiping their ID.
The result? Everybody pays for little benefit.
you can't spare a few seconds to help make more murder cases solvable? are you really that self-centered?
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday February 12 2016, @05:26AM
Asynchronous my ass. The operation involves taking the bullet, scanning it, putting it aside, taking another and repeat. Yeah, I can really see this happening whenever a bullet (together with others) changes hands.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Friday February 12 2016, @05:49AM
Asynchronous my ass. The operation involves taking the bullet, scanning it, putting it aside, taking another and repeat. Yeah, I can really see this happening whenever a bullet (together with others) changes hands.
bullets are sold in boxes, so it make a lot more sense to put a barcode identifying the box number on the outside and just push that info to the database. stop making this out to be some sort of monumental effort.
(Score: 1, Troll) by c0lo on Friday February 12 2016, @06:02AM
(yeah, sure, seems wise)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Immerman on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:22PM
Well, you'd need to get the bullet ID associated with the framing-victim's Id. And I can only think of two ways to do that: steal their bullets, or steal their identity to buy the bullets. Or I suppose hack the database to link your purchase to their ID instead and hope that you don't overlook any backups. So three ways.
Not impossible, but not exactly convenient either.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday February 10 2016, @09:04PM
You think of a "framing a specific ID for your crime". That's a too strong requirement, it's enough to "frame some other id, no matter who but not me".
Suddenly other scenarios become possible. Like (but not limited to):
* collect some spent bullets from a shooting practice and reload them in your cartridges.
* arrange a bullet swap with some "just stick it to the man" like minded others (tell you what... I'm sure a P2P anonymized BulletSwap app would be so successful, it will appear in a week after this "solution" sees reality).
Granted, the cost of your "attack" goes up, but the "defender" (the non-criminal society) will spent a lot more to track you. Doesn't seem like a good security solution
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 10 2016, @08:24AM
umm, no. he exposed that this would not work at all for violent crime, since those users of bullets would simply make sure to make their own. if you go out to rob people at gun point, it's easy to get the ammo from some friends rather than buying it from a store.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by maxwell demon on Wednesday February 10 2016, @09:10AM
I guess it would also open up a new business opportunity for criminal organizations: Smuggling of non-etched bullets. Most of the world is not bound by American laws.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 10 2016, @10:07AM
Oh you know, they will break in and rob people of their bullets (just like the break in to steal guns now). That way the poor SOB who bought the bullets legitimately would be the prime suspect in any crimes committed with the tagged bullets.
(Score: 2) by tibman on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:24PM
Or just dremel/grind the etching away.
SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:51PM
It's easier to make new bullets, than trying to alter bullets. Tampering with those bullets could possibly cause one to go off in your face - not likely, but possible. Far more likely is that a carelessly altered bullet lodges in the chamber or barrel of the gun, causing the firearm to explode. Barring any accidents, your altered bullets will no longer fit as precisely into the chamber and barrel, thus becoming far less accurate. Did I mention that it's easy-peasy just to make your own bullets? Lead can be melted on a kitchen stove. Molds are available on the internet. Brass, primers, and powder are all available online. The press is a little expensive, but it's also available online. Measuring tools cost little. Any wannabe criminal or criminal's helper can set up and make bullets for a living.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by kurenai.tsubasa on Wednesday February 10 2016, @05:01PM
For some reason your post made me want to link to The Gunsmith of Williamsburg [youtu.be]. (All though, that's probably a terrorist video these days since it shows how to manufacture a gun and bullets from raw materials /s.)
(Score: 2) by tibman on Wednesday February 10 2016, @05:06PM
So smelting metal ingots, pouring them into a mold, pressing the new bullet into a shell that you have cleaned and pressed a new primer into and deposited a carefully measured amount of gunpowder into... is easier than filing a laser etch off?
SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday February 10 2016, @06:26PM
It has already been noted by another poster that the laser markings go into the tail of the bullet. You'll have to remove the bullet from the brass, do your filing or dremeling, then put the bullet back into the casing. The removal and replacement of that bullet, without resizing that casing, will likely damage either the bullet or the casing. Additionally, you have upset the ballistics of that bullet by carving into it. It may or may not fly true with scallops cut into the end of it. But, why go to all that bother, when it really is easy to produce your own without any markings?
Added benefit of making your own: you can "wildcat" the load, if you're into that sort of thing. Just add a few grains of gunpowder, and your rounds are considerably more powerful, as well as more accurate. Or, if you really want to get wild, add even more powder, turning it into a cannon. Of course, the hotter the load, the more dangerous it is to YOU. Not only will the barrel of the firearm wear out quicker, but the possibility of a round exploding in the chamber increases.
(Score: 2) by tibman on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:39PM
Ballistics don't matter as much as you think. So much of the ammo i shoot is dinged up or with the bullet not perfectly seated (slightly tilted to one side). The bullet tips are very roughly painted to denote it's construction and/or capabilities. That paint is often partially scratched off. Bullets aren't even close to perfectly shaped. The butt end matters even less. The hot gasses often melt a hole right in the ass of the bullet (if it doesn't have a full-metal jacket, even then it may not cover the back-side). If you get a wicked ricochet (that lands near you) you can pick up the bullet with pliers and take a look. Liquid metal (lead) may be dripping out of the backside. I've had it happen with very high powered weapons. No idea if pistol ammo does the same thing. Anyways, bullet shape and defects don't affect accuracy as much as you think. Just look at hollow point. Or carve up some of your ammo the next time you go to the range.
You made good points but i don't think a criminal would do all of that. They'd just use pliers to remove the bullet, file off the etching, and re-seat the round (maybe even with a weak glue). No special tools required.
Did a quick youtube search. This guy pulls bullets with an empty case, doesn't even use pliers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVaE_LKmjPc [youtube.com] This guy here loads the bullets backwards: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZAyhv0xqUI [youtube.com]
SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.
(Score: 2) by Tork on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:45PM
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 11 2016, @03:37AM
No, the point is that this is all ridiculous.
Any serious shooter already reloads. I know half a dozen I can think of (I know, I counted) who make their own bullets as well, and you can buy bulk bullets from outside your own state.
Shooters do it for a number of reasons: cost savings, improved accuracy, specialised purposes.
So, yeah, this is based in a fantasy world. And laws based in fantasies ultimately do everybody a disservice.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:44PM
Actually, it won't work for "almost all violent crime" either. It may help to catch some of the stupider criminals, I'll grant that. But, as prior posts suggest, it's not high tech, or even very difficult, to produce your own bullets. Organized crime will produce their own, in quantity. By "organized crime" I don't mean just the Mafia - I mean every drug runner coming out of Mexico will be supplied by his sponsoring cartel with virgin lead bullets. Not for his own use, but for distribution among the cartel's gangs here in the states.
Seriously, it takes no great education, only some minimal education, no strength, no great skill, to make bullets. Your typical high school kid can produce a thousand rounds on a Saturday afternoon, in between a morning basketball game and getting cleaned up for a hot date.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:47AM
You mean... one doesn't need hitech to create a bullet on one's own? Really?
What of fucked up world!
Next you gonna tell me that an effective defence against a multimillion LaWS [wikipedia.org] would be a shiny paints, misting fans and/or smoke flares.
How can a poor member of MilInd complex make a honest buck anymore?
(grin)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by CoolHand on Wednesday February 10 2016, @12:49PM
Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job-Douglas Adams
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 10 2016, @09:50PM
It's not even that hard. Just fire the bullet safely into a target. Cast your own bullet by melting down some lead. Refill the bullet (press out the primer with an punch, re-primer it, refill the gunpowder, press the lead back into the jacket with a C clamp). No gunpowder or primer? Fine, just use match books. [youtube.com] Seriously, this shit is not rocket science. This is the real reason why they say: If you outlaw guns only outlaws will have guns. Any idiot can make guns and bullets.
They make ammo refillers / presses for doing lots of shells, if you want to get industrious about it.
Thugs will delight in having a new market for their own non-laser etched "thug ammo". Just like the thugs in prohibition created their own brands of booze... Will the world ever learn?
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday February 11 2016, @06:41AM
No. The righteous will always believe that there's a God that will reward their effort, no matter how much pain their righteousness is causing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 5, Disagree) by jmorris on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:19AM
This proposal is stupid because:
1. Most bullets deform and or shatter into multiple parts.
2. Shotguns.
3. Reloaders.
4. Has anyone actually bothered to track how many rounds of ammo are produced for domestic consumption annually? Every single round tracked from manufacture, through initial sale, potential trade/resale and possible storage for decades? We are reliably told the government lacks the IT resources to track the 11 million illegals (half to a million more enter each year but the number has remained 11 million since the immigration debate during the Bush 43 administration.... anyway back ontopic) but we are expected to believe they can track hundreds of billions of rounds of ammo?
5. The cost will be truly Yuge. Since this is obvious to anyone with a room temp IQ and the problems above are insurmountable, it is rational to conclude that this cost increase IS the point.
6. These idiots believe we are dumb enough to let them guilt trip us into not resisting. No way. War!
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Sir Finkus on Wednesday February 10 2016, @08:22AM
I don't think the shattering would be a big deal. Based on the little I know about the technology, it actually looks like it'd work pretty well at preserving the numbers, since they are at the back of the bullet. Finding even a few fragments would probably narrow down the potential purchasers by quite a bit.
I have two main objections, aside from that pesky 2nd amendment.
First off, as has been proven time and time again, we simply cannot trust the government with a database. They claim they won't datamine, but if they ever want to confiscate firearms you can bet your ass they're going to consult that database and compile a list.
I also am suspicious of the group's motives. We've got a company proposing that their (patented I'm sure) process be integrated into a rather large industry by law. It's a government mandated monopoly that's prime for abuse. These kinds of collaborations between government and private industry are manipulative, unfair to the populace, and unfair to companies competing with those that get these kinds of laws written.
Join our Folding@Home team! [stanford.edu]
(Score: 3, Touché) by Username on Wednesday February 10 2016, @09:49AM
You’re assuming the criminal isn’t going to melt the numbers off like they do on the guns.
(Score: 3, Touché) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday February 10 2016, @11:47AM
Way too difficult. Easier to just not buy your ammo in Washington. It's not that long of a drive to Idaho from anywhere in the entire state to stock up on anonymous ammo.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by VLM on Wednesday February 10 2016, @12:36PM
The other alternative of "not buy in WA" is shoplift or outright steal.
Someone who is planning on very serious criminal activity is not going to be scared off by mere shoplifting.
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Wednesday February 10 2016, @10:23PM
Someone who is planning on very serious criminal activity is not going to be scared off by mere shoplifting.
well there are ways around that but just because a system is not 100% effect does not mean it's worthless. i mean, if that was the case, nobody would use computers.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 11 2016, @03:45AM
Important details missing from your post:
Criminal laws that are highly (risibly) ineffective, ludicrously easy to circumvent, place a burden on the public and interfere with fundamental rights are not worthless.
They have a vast negative worth, and should be avoided like the plague.
This bears all the hallmarks of political thinking: SOMETHING MUST BE DONE ... this is something, therefore we must do it.
Other posters have already pointed out the massive barn door sized holes in this plan, but I might be the first to point out that the supreme law governing this kind of legislation is the law of unintended consequences.
Perhaps the most damning thing I can say about these politicians is: "Well, they MEAN well."
(Score: 2) by Tork on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:49PM
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈
(Score: 2) by Sir Finkus on Wednesday February 10 2016, @04:04PM
Yeah, I am because the number is etched on the back of the bullet and would require that it be pulled out, filed, then reinserted.
Join our Folding@Home team! [stanford.edu]
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Thursday February 11 2016, @08:52AM
First off, as has been proven time and time again, we simply cannot trust the government with a database. They claim they won't datamine, but if they ever want to confiscate firearms you can bet your ass they're going to consult that database and compile a list.
i don't disagree but why do you think they are going to confiscate firearms? without that particular threat, it's a harmless database that is used to identify people who murder other people with firearms. given the upside, what makes you think there is so much of a threat of your firearms being confiscated to nullify it? mass shootings are a regular occurrence and they still aren't confiscating guns, so what do you think would cause them to change now?
(Score: 2) by Sir Finkus on Thursday February 11 2016, @09:41PM
Because the US is an outlier when it comes to our weapons laws, and there is a lot of pressure to make gun ownership laws less liberal.
I hate to Godwin the argument, but when Hitler wanted to kill the Jews and other undesirables, he didn't start by sending them off to the gas chambers. He started by making a list of Jews and requiring that they register. The "Registration -> Regulation -> Confiscation" scheme is a pretty common pattern used by governments to erode rights.
I think most gun owners wouldn't mind if there was such a system in place, they just don't trust the government with that kind of power. It's a justified fear.
I'm also sick of being put on so god damn many government lists. The state doesn't need to know everything about it. I pay my taxes and try not to break the law. I go to jury duty and can establish my citizenship and which congressional district I reside in. That's pretty much all the information that I believe the government should require me to provide while participating in lawful activities. We (as a country) need to think long and hard before we allow the government to build yet ANOTHER database.
Join our Folding@Home team! [stanford.edu]
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Thursday February 11 2016, @10:10PM
I think most gun owners wouldn't mind if there was such a system in place, they just don't trust the government with that kind of power. It's a justified fear.
justified fear? really? guns are already registered and yet nobody has come for your guns! why would registered bullets be any different?!
(Score: 2) by Sir Finkus on Friday February 12 2016, @03:23AM
None of my guns are "registered", and that's normal in most states.
Join our Folding@Home team! [stanford.edu]
(Score: 2) by Gravis on Friday February 12 2016, @05:11AM
and yet my point still stands. why would they start because of bullets with serial numbers?
(Score: 3, Touché) by c0lo on Wednesday February 10 2016, @09:02AM
Don't underestimate the power of barcoding, it's what enabled the "retail revolution".
How many food cans are produced/sold annually? Does it stop a recall if contamination is discovered in some of them?
This is to show that the immigrants are much less dangerous than bullets, isn't it?
If bullet tracking would be a solution (a big if, because it's not a solution. It's only an instance of the politician syllogism) then...
...If noone can do it, NSA can.
And it would be a better use of money, given the rate of deaths because of crime vs the one due to terrorism.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by deimtee on Wednesday February 10 2016, @11:04AM
Don't underestimate the power of barcoding, it's what enabled the "retail revolution".
How many food cans are produced/sold annually? Does it stop a recall if contamination is discovered in some of them?
All the cans of the same type have the same barcode. Most also have a batch code, which is generally either a days production, or an entire production run.
When there is a recall, it is entire batches, not a single can.
I suppose that you could use the same code on all the bullets in each box of ammo, but you would still have a huge amount of data to track.
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 2) by Kromagv0 on Thursday February 11 2016, @01:42PM
Your comment got me thinking of an easy way to defeat this. If one were to simply swap the contents of a few boxes of bullets (assuming it isn't the 500 count box of .22lr which would be a bitch to do in store) the system would become very unreliable. If I lived in WA and this became law I would do it mostly as an act of civil protest even if I didn't buy any ammo. Unless it is match grade ammo I don't think I have ever seen it shrink wrapped, and I doubt the military surplus stuff that comes in a spam can is going to have the number etched. Also people in WA under this bill would no longer be able to buy surplus ammo which can be very cheap and pretty reasonable quality if you are looking to sort a gun out, or waste ammo on paper.
T-Shirts and bumper stickers [zazzle.com] to offend someone
(Score: 2) by Anne Nonymous on Wednesday February 10 2016, @01:38PM
> Every single round tracked from manufacture, through initial sale, potential trade/resale and possible storage for decades?
On the plus side we're going to have much bigger ammo, since we'll need the room for bigger tracking numbers.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday February 10 2016, @04:03PM
LOL - I can see it now. .75 caliber replaces the .22LR in popularity, because they can't fit the tracking data on anything smaller!
(Score: 1, Troll) by Sir Finkus on Wednesday February 10 2016, @04:06PM
Or you could RTFA and realize that they want to do it box by box rather than numbering the rounds individually.
Granted, I've seen boxes from 10 rounds to 5000, so I'd be curious to see what they consider a "box".
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(Score: 2) by bob_super on Wednesday February 10 2016, @05:48PM
Got it. I'll remember to not leave my boxes of ammo behind during my next mass shooting.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 10 2016, @07:48AM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:10PM
Honest!
(Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Wednesday February 10 2016, @03:52PM
but you can bring your gun on the bus provided it is in plain sight.
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