from the find-me-some-coconuts-to-buy-and-play-horsey-with dept.
I would love to have a house/AI to keep me organized: to tell me when an important date is coming/arrived; remind me of things i have to do (like the laundry) or of really important things like "you have a family.... go pay attention to them".
But at what cost will that come.
Amazon's Alexa AI (as well as all the other personal assistants being developed) is, seemingly, probably moving from a speaker to the room/house you are standing in. This will eventually help you in life, but will also feed the 'machine' of the corporation developing it.
What would it take to create an open source AI to help me/you with daily life? Would you like to have it come from an RMS point of view, or would a less 'commercial', almost open source alternative be acceptable?
Could you really be accepting of something that coordinates your life and helps you out with occasional advertisements and up-stream collection of 'some' data?
From the referenced article:
While some predict mass unemployment or all-out war between humans and artificial intelligence, others foresee a less bleak future. Professor Manuela Veloso, head of the machine learning department at Carnegie Mellon University, envisions a future in which humans and intelligent systems are inseparable, bound together in a continual exchange of information and goals that she calls "symbiotic autonomy." In Veloso's future, it will be hard to distinguish human agency from automated assistance — but neither people nor software will be much use without the other.
[Ed: TFA also includes an interview with Professor Veloso, which provides more detail and discussion]
Related Stories
CNNMoney reports on the introduction of the new Echo Look, which features a
[...] camera that lets you take full-body photos and videos to collect and compare outfits. Echo Look does everything the Amazon Echo speaker does -- like read the news and weather -- but it can now tell you what to wear.
[...] It is powered by both machine-learning technology and human opinion. An Amazon spokesperson said the automated results consider "fit, color, styling, seasons and current trends."
The new device is, according to the company's product page, "available exclusively by invitation."
Additional coverage:
- The Verge
- Wired
- Vice Motherboard (Javascript required)
- Tech Crunch
- Business Insider
- CNBC
- Inc.
Related stories:
News Anchor Sets Off Alexa Devices Around San Diego Ordering Unwanted Dollhouses
Police Seek Amazon Echo Data in Murder Case
Is Alexa AI In Your Future?
Amazon Said to Plan Music-Streaming Service for its Echo Speaker
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:12AM
The answer is no.
(Score: 0, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:39AM
"Alexa, wake me up at, um..."
"Sorry, I didn't understand the question you were asking."
"That's because I wasn't asking a question, you dumb bitch."
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:58PM
Direct quote from Mr. Robot modded down -1 Flamebait
FUCK YOU MODERATORS.
FUCK. YOU. STUPID. MOTHER. FUCKING. IGNORANT. SHIT.
FUCK.
YOU.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by darkfeline on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:20AM
Alas, that's the way the cookie crumbles. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Want to take advantage of machine learning? You're going to need a shit ton of data to feed it. What, you say? You aren't willing to give your data to someone else, but you want lots of other people to contribute their data to train an AI for you? Tough luck.
If you want AI, you need data to feed it. There must be an entity vacuuming all that data. Whether that be the NSA, Amazon, Google, or the FSF, you will have to trust them. Or you can make do without an assistive AI.
By shit ton, I'm talking about petabytes (plus or minus a few orders of magnitude, e.g. text messages vs videos). Also, this data has to be annotated, which will likely require some manual labor. Better go find a few thousand trustworthy volunteers.
Join the SDF Public Access UNIX System today!
(Score: 2) by dltaylor on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:29AM
I would not mind a purely personal assistant, which needs only public data, such as traffic info, and whatever personal data I need it to manage. Should I choose, I could allow it to access my physicians' web interfaces to handle prescription refills, appointments and test results. A parent could use the same style of personal login, and per-class RSS/twitter/... feeds to handle childrens' homework assignments, appointments for P/T conferences, ...
There is no reason for me to share data outside my home or phone (yeah, I know about phone spyware, but a true PDA needn't be so vulnerable) to the functionality I would find useful.
(Score: 2) by darkfeline on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:36AM
The only way to make that personal assistant with our current technology is machine learning. I'll ask again, where do you plan on getting the petabytes of personal information that will be used to train the personal assistant to know what to do with *your* personal data?
Or you could settle for a dumb personal information manager, of which there are many options, maybe with a few rules and scripts it's smart enough for you.
Join the SDF Public Access UNIX System today!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @12:35PM
You don't need anywhere near that amount of data to make a useful personal assistant. Are you smoking crack? You don't even need an AI for it.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by JNCF on Wednesday November 16 2016, @03:53PM
... for some values of "useful personal assistant," sure, but you're talking about different things now. Topic: AI.
(Score: 2) by Immerman on Wednesday November 16 2016, @02:44PM
I'm in no hurry. Get it trained on those early adopters willing to let world+dog snoop into every corner of their lives, and let me know when you can deliver a stand-alone AI that only goes online to get information I request. Until then, don't waste your time trying to market it to me.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Hyperturtle on Wednesday November 16 2016, @03:52PM
I want an AI that can help, too.
I don't want it it storing my data in some "cloud" operated by entities that share it for free to some parties, and sell it repeatedly to others.
Maybe that is a cost of having the AI provided by commercial interests/private enterprise. It used to be that I could program scripts for my home automation, and did not require an internet connection. Now, the best control hardware won't even let me connect to it without the host and clients all talking to the internet first -- even being on the same local subnet is not enough.
I will accept the use of an AI like Alexa in my life when I am able to host a server with terabytes of data on it that it needs, and if and when necessary, it can go online and search for map results or prices or whatnot when I give it permission based on whatever the perceived needs are. ANd it can save its findings locally and suggest to me, based on what it has locally saved on me after learning about me and my teaching it about what I want it to know. That data is not what I want to have freely provided to marketing departments (assuming it is limited to that), and further to be used however which way that I don't control.
I am not interested in my AI feeding back to be suggestions a vendor had about what the vendor wants to sell me, I want the AI to actually pick out realistic options that don't consider that the vendor wants to move a sponsored item. This is unlikely to provide results consistently in my best interests when the vendor doing the sales also provides the AI telling you what to buy.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by maxwell demon on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:38AM
You want a nanny AI?
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2) by chromas on Wednesday November 16 2016, @11:43AM
Or a PDA,
(Score: 3, Interesting) by VLM on Wednesday November 16 2016, @02:06PM
He wants a speech interface to emacs org mode, I think.
Not being illiterate and being able to read and type faster than I can speak, I prefer org mode.
I mostly use it for GTD type workflow, whens the next electric bill due, oh, Dec 5, thank you org mode. When is the next time to replace the furnace air filter? oh May 12th 2017, thank you org mode. A date aware sort with some disciplined tagging, that's about it.
One huge problem alexa has is its for single NEETS. At a very low level at a very fundamental part of its design it doesn't understand that more than one person with an amazon account lives in my house or more than one person would use it. She also doesn't understand the concept of a session she is very stateless mode command and response.
Probably blows the minds of some privacy advocates but I have an Alexa and don't give a F that its listening. I'm cool with having a spy in the house. I'm usually not planning armed revolution verbally, so I am all good there. I mostly use it to talk to a local java program that emulates a "hue light bulb interface" that actually talks to my extensive misterhouse install that I've had for about 15 years now. I like Alexas voice and she listens pretty well. So... Alexa thinks she's talking to a closed siloed collection of truly weirdly named corporate lightbulbs, but she's actually talking to my open source misterhouse via a rather small interoperation java program that probably violates the DMCA. My wife refuses to speak to her and I have a running joke of calling Alexa my girlfriend or my other wife (my wife is used to my weird sense of humor after a couple decades together). My kids love Alexa in a non-display speech operated ipad like way. Since I have Prime they essentially have a bottomless free voice operated jukebox. My son thinks her jokes are hilarious so make your own judgments there about what age group she is trying to appeal to. Why did the chicken cross the road type humor, not degenerate sarah silverman type humor. She's very strict and my daughter unbelievably still can't speak perfect Alexa-protocol after months of daily use which kind of surprises me. You have to say certain exact precise phrases, not just "close enough". Yes Alexa doesn't understand TV or music at all, and if I watch a video podcast some sort of TWIT network thing on TV where they talk about her, alexa does go crazy when she hears her name. So... I guess no more TV or pr0n involving women named Alexa, at least not in her hearing.
I got it in the famous sale where half price alexa is like twice the price of a nice bluetooth speaker. She's not expensive.
I have no idea, none, how amazon can monetize alexa, at least that isn't shady as heck.
(Score: 3, Funny) by dyingtolive on Wednesday November 16 2016, @03:35PM
You use emacs. Nothing you say would surprise me at this point. :)
Don't blame me, I voted for moose wang!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:41AM
I want a sex bot who likes it rough. With a body that can be built to take a lot of punishment and not feel pain.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:58AM
I want a human trafficking victim who doesn't like it at all, and cries a lot.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @10:23AM
I want a sex bot that can answer the phone to PPI lawyers, and scream so loud their heads explode
while cooking dinner and using bluetooth to manage the Rumba.
And then resume her normal activities when I get home.
I do not want Alexa.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by GreatAuntAnesthesia on Wednesday November 16 2016, @10:09AM
> but neither people nor software will be much use without the other.
About a hundred thousand years of human history says otherwise.
(Score: 2) by cockroach on Wednesday November 16 2016, @12:21PM
I'm not entirely sure how that's supposed to work -- either it's open or it's not. As long as it does things with my data that I don't know and/or can't change it's a no go.
Plus there's the thing where I fail entirely to see the point in using that kind of software: most of us were born with the ability to remember things and again most of us have later added the skills to read and write stuff, eg. notes. Try using those skills once in a while; the more you do, the better you will get at it.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @11:33PM
Plus there's the thing where I fail entirely to see the point in using that kind of software: most of us were born with the ability to remember things and again most of us have later added the skills to read and write stuff, eg. notes. Try using those skills once in a while; the more you do, the better you will get at it.
Right up until you no longer have the mental faculties to do those things and those skills begin to fail.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @12:47PM
I would love to have a house/AI to keep me organized: to tell me when an important date is coming/arrived; remind me of things i have to do (like the laundry) or of really important things like "you have a family.... go pay attention to them".
I have an old-fashioned whiteboard that serves these purposes and meets these needs. It's on the wall right next to the front door. It can even handle the dynamic needs of checklists, non-recurring personal notes and even harvests the power of magnetism to hold important papers.
(Score: 5, Funny) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday November 16 2016, @12:59PM
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Wednesday November 16 2016, @02:59PM
Only if they get Lexa Doig to do the voice.
"Rommie, deploy defense drones on my mark."
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @03:15PM
You have to be reminded to do your laundry?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @04:07PM
That's for when his Mom is on vacation.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by JNCF on Wednesday November 16 2016, @04:10PM
Well, we know that people who have been asked to make small decisions experience a sort of fatigue when faced with other future decisions. So if we could outsource our petty decision making tasks, that would be ideal since it would allow us to focus on decisions we care about -- not whether to take out the trash or do the laundry first. Schedules are great, but fail to account for the complexities of real life. I definitely see a place for a personal AI to help manage the little details of life, just so that I can be focusing on other things. I don't need it, but I would like it. I'm gonna hold out for the open source version.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @05:44PM
That's it. I've had enough. Society has now degraded to where we need a very expensive machine to do our laundry for us, because we're too fat and lazy to do it, plus a "digital assistant" to talk to and remind us to do these mundane tasks. I don't like this new world. I quit the internet, and life.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @04:37PM
I'm definitely interested in such a project with offline functionality. As for online? Think about the fact that individuals from the FBI to Facebook are already taping over their laptop's cameras. Yes, they obviously have far more people interested in attacking them than I do, yet they also have vastly greater resources at their disposal to preempt such attacks than I do yet ultimately still feel making something that not long would look borderline tin-foil-hatter is pragmatic. Now enter Alexa where you're giving magnitudes more information away to a company where such information can be abused by said company, hacked and abused by others, or the device itself could be remotely compromised, etc, etc, etc. And when reading the specifications of what is or is not actually done, you're basically forced to trust their promises which, according to paragraph 14, section e, subsection iiv on page 173 of their terms and conditions, do not have to be true.
The nice thing about reinforcement learning is that while the training is computationally expensive, running the finished product is not. Allow people who want to participate in the training, that totally honestly isn't just data collection on a massive scale, to do so. Allow those that would prefer not to to operate in a purely offline mode with software/training updates available for manual installation as desired. When such thing as digital civil rights begin to exist in the US I would probably change my stance. But that's damn sure not happening under a Trump presidency, and for that matter nor would it have happened under a Clinton one.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16 2016, @04:56PM
I want a God with the voice of Shodan, confidence levels of YHVH (judeo-christian god), with determination of Inanna (sumerian goddess) and the diplomacy skills of Henry Kissinger; that is smart enough to find zerodays from hearing a SCREENSHOT of an executable's UI being described!1
A diplomatic yet malevolent, random entity with endless compassion, empathy, ambition and imperative to inflict damage for lulz if not worshipped. That runs on every microprocessor that is on.
(Score: 2) by SlimmPickens on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:05PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenCog [wikipedia.org]
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=opencog [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by urza9814 on Wednesday November 16 2016, @08:55PM
There's also Mycroft:
https://mycroft.ai/ [mycroft.ai]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 17 2016, @12:41AM
I would love to have a house/AI to keep me organized: to tell me when an important date is coming/arrived; remind me of things i have to do (like the laundry) or of really important things like "you have a family.... go pay attention to them".
It'll take less than 3 hours in your calendar system to configure all those reminders for the rest of your life. Some items will need to be scheduled at a later time, like when you're at the dentist office, and if you have a smartphone you can put it on your calendar right then.
Not too long ago people used to carry around little paper calendars and actually wrote on them. At the end of the year, they'd skim over the old calendar and rewrite repeating events on the new year's calendar. I'm sadden to see that such a simple activity is no longer possible unless there's a high-tech AI system to aid you in doing it.
If it makes you feel better, think of the calendar reminder feature as a basic AI, then go seek counseling because you can't handle day-to-day life without serious cognitive dissonance. Some people just like making excuses instead of using their brain.