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posted by Fnord666 on Saturday March 18 2017, @11:07AM   Printer-friendly
from the about-time dept.

Seminal role-playing game Dungeons & Dragons looks to be going digital.

The game's publisher, Wizards of the Coast, calls its new effort "D&D Beyond", describes it as "a digital toolset for use with the Dungeons & Dragons fifth edition rules" and has given the service the tagline "Play with advantage".

Wizards' canned statement says the service will "take D&D players beyond pen and paper, providing a rules compendium, character builder, digital character sheets, and moreā€”all populated with official D&D content." We're also told the service "aims to make game management easier for both players and Dungeon Masters by providing high-quality tools available on any device."

Details of just what's on offer are thin, but the beta signup site for the service says subscribers will get the following features:

  • A "D&D Compendium with Official Content"
  • The ability to "Create, Browse, & Use Homebrew Content"
  • The ability to "Manage Characters - Build, Progress, & Play"
  • D&D News, Articles, Forums, & More
  • Anywhere, anytime, access on any device

It will never work: psionics only travel through paper. Impotent mind flayers make god cry.


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  • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday March 18 2017, @12:12PM (3 children)

    by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Saturday March 18 2017, @12:12PM (#480821) Homepage Journal

    So, this sounds right nifty but I can't help thinking they're likely going to try the SaaS route with this. Probably with no export option. I think I'll stick with either good ole paper books or those online services that only make you pay once and allow you to export your data.

    --
    My rights don't end where your fear begins.
    • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @01:22PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @01:22PM (#480827)

      They'll certainly have to be competing with the folks over at roll20.net [roll20.net] who have been at the SaaS side of PnP gaming for years now with some pretty sweet features such as infinite card decks, builtin webcam conferencing, etc. I'm sure this will get some adoption but they sure did wait awhile to bother with it.

      • (Score: 2) by Celestial on Saturday March 18 2017, @04:57PM

        by Celestial (4891) on Saturday March 18 2017, @04:57PM (#480870) Journal

        I've used Roll20 to play both ICONS and Mutants & Masterminds (both super-hero tabletop RPGs), with a group of friends for three years now. It works really, really well. Roll20 is SaaS, but it's worth the money IMO.

        Still, I don't think that they're quite competition for D&D Beyond. D&D Beyond seems to be aiming to help people play Dungeons & Dragons Fifth Edition at the tabletop, enhance it. Not replace it, like Roll20 does. There's some overlap but that may be enough especially for people who just play Dungeons & Dragons Fifth Edition, (which seems to be at least half of all tabletop role-players at the moment).

      • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday March 18 2017, @07:50PM

        by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Saturday March 18 2017, @07:50PM (#480902) Homepage Journal

        Yeah, I'm a pretty big Roll20.net fan myself, as well as Fantasy Grounds (they actively support running the client under wine). Fantasy Grounds even allows for eternal purchases and exporting of your data.

        --
        My rights don't end where your fear begins.
  • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @01:48PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @01:48PM (#480832)

    This is just a tired rehash/rebrand of their lame, failed D&D Insider program, updated to 5th edition.

    Anyone who was around for the 4th edition debacle should remember the abysmal failure of WotC's digital initiative for that release. They went to GenCon and demo'd digital products that didn't exist, promising they would be available the same day 4th edition shipped. Well, that didn't happen and it was months (years?) before they produced any digital tools for 4th edition, at all. Even then the results were lackluster and disappointing. Gamers were promised a character builder, a character visualizer, a virtual tabletop, and other native apps that were all supposed to be integrated, taking you from character design to online play. Instead we got some lame web tools and (a long time later) a half-baked character creator that required a subscription fee. And throughout the whole thing, WotC lied to their customers repeatedly about what was going on.

    I jumped ship to Paizo about a year into 4th and never looked back. 5th D&D edition might be the greatest game ever, but I will never give WotC another dollar.

  • (Score: 2) by looorg on Saturday March 18 2017, @01:59PM (4 children)

    by looorg (578) on Saturday March 18 2017, @01:59PM (#480837)

    This has been on ongoing new feature now in boardgames and pnp roleplaying games for the last few years, as far as I know it's quite a divider as in some people like it or don't mind and some people hate it. In some regard it is slowly eroding the line between the physical and digital gaming experience and not everyone likes it. I'm not a super big fan of it personally but I'm ok with it. From my perspective there are a few problems, the main one being what happens when the platform becomes old or the app stops working. Then the game is dead. Some games allow for the app to make the game faster and such but can be played without the app -- Alchemist is one of them while others such as Mansions of Madness 2nd edition can't be played without the app since they have removed all the Keeper functions from the game and put them into the app instead. Then there is the whole blurring the line of boardgames vs computer games, I like both types but I prefer them to be separate entities - as in I can play computer games anytime but when I meet my friends these days I (or we) prefer to play physical boardgames instead of sitting with phones, tablets or computers while we are all in the same room.

    Fantasy Flight publishes at least two games that use the APP to drive the game -- replacing the "monsters" with the app instead of it being controlled by a person, this way everyone can play the game together versus the board. X-COM the boardgame, I personally didn't like this all to much. They added a bit to many time aspects to it and I wasn't to fond of it. No time to plan or talk, I guess you could have run it on a lower level or paused all the time. Don't think most people I play with liked it all that much either cause I think since it was bought we played it twice and that was it. We had previously played a fair bit of one of their other games called Mansions of Madness. This has now been updated to a second edition and the part of the Keeper (or the evil) has been replaced by the app so that everyone that plays play as an investigator instead. This has made the game a lot more fun and it has also speed up the process of play.

    Alchemist was another one where you even used the phone to take pictures of resources and then you mix your resource (or regents) cards into potions and the app tells you what happens when you mix. It was an ok almost Sudoku kind of deduction game. This game could be played without the app but then you need to have one player act like the judge and be in charge of the solution to the puzzle.

    My main issue as mentioned is that when I bought something I want to be able to use it forever in whatever fashion I like. This is why replacing the books of D&D or the complete functionality of the a game shouldn't in my mind be replaced by some blackbox-app. It doesn't really make the game better as far as I'm concerned. Also if they ever appify Arkham Horror they can go and fuck themselves cause I'll keep my old box version of it instead.

    https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/xcom-the-board-game/ [fantasyflightgames.com]
    https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/mansions-of-madness-second-edition/ [fantasyflightgames.com]
    https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/161970/alchemists [boardgamegeek.com]

    • (Score: 1) by helel on Saturday March 18 2017, @03:06PM (3 children)

      by helel (2949) on Saturday March 18 2017, @03:06PM (#480856)

      I think Alchemist really does the digital aid thing well because you can always fall back to a human if you want to or in the future if (when) the application becomes unavailable.

      In the realm of rpgs I find online character sheets really really useful. I've written my own small character sheet manager for my game and it's great because I can reference the sheets while planning the game, the players have access to them between sessions and can spend exp or the like automatically, and all the character's powers and abilities are right there for reference. Just click on a thing and you get a popup with the rules text.

      However I see a distinct limit to the usefulness of these tools for the hobby as a whole. My system works perfectly for me because it's written up with all the house rules, custom content, and quirks exactly as I run the game. A commercial product can present rules as written but every single group I have ever witnessed* runs their games with house rules and that's hard to account for when writing one of these applications. Sure, you can let users change the damage of a spell or weapon but what about the group that adds an extra attribute or plays Epic 6?

      * Some claim they run rules as written but the've, in my experience, either been confused about the rules, unaware that such-and-such form another game was a house rule, lying, or some combination of the above.

      • (Score: 2) by looorg on Saturday March 18 2017, @03:24PM (2 children)

        by looorg (578) on Saturday March 18 2017, @03:24PM (#480859)

        Character sheets might be one of those things that work good as a digital replacement. We all know that after a while of erasing and writing you have to transfer it all to a new paper. Problem comes as you mention when you have various householdrules or modifications to the game aspects of the sheet becomes obsolete or doesn't work like you want it to. Sure it could also be great to quickly find rules and stuff in books by the search function. This isn't usually a big deal in my mind since after a while you start to know all the rules, or your version of the rules, and even if you have to look things up you kind of have an idea where to look and you can usually find it quite fast.

        But for example Mansions of Madness 2nd edition really bothers me. It's quite an expensive game - just the main box is about $100 and it requires the app. Without the app the game can't be played. If for whatever reason one day the app stops working you are left with an unplayable game and just a really nice box with cardboard tiles and plastic figures. But utterly useless as a game. I'm sure someone will come up with some flowchart at that time and make rules for implementing and using the 1st edition Keeper cards but it will still be really weird. Plus sometimes it's fun to the be the evil force and try to murder all your friends -- that aspect is now gone and no longer an option. You can't create your own little adventures for a setup like that either - you can buy the stuff from FFG and like it or not play at all. With the 1st edition you had options in that regard.

        • (Score: 1) by helel on Saturday March 18 2017, @09:36PM

          by helel (2949) on Saturday March 18 2017, @09:36PM (#480940)

          If your players can be trusted to read and remember the powers their characters have their a might bit better then mine, at least in that regard...

          Mansions of Madness requiring the app is doubly disappointing to me because I'd much rather see them work on expanding customization to make the game a better one-shot rpg where you can easily run your own adventure for the night. The mechanics of the first game (haven't played the second) offer so much promise for a simple but very hands on rpg.

        • (Score: 2) by ShadowSystems on Sunday March 19 2017, @02:01PM

          by ShadowSystems (6185) <ShadowSystemsNO@SPAMGmail.com> on Sunday March 19 2017, @02:01PM (#481134)

          My friends & I found a great way to reduce the wear & tear on our sheets, dispite all the corrections & updates you make during a session.
          Fill the sheet out in pencil, slip into a plastic "sheet protector" like what you would use for a high school book report, & then mark on the plastic with wet erase markers.
          HP changes get done in the marker, then the sheet updated *once* at the end.
          Repeat this for everything that changes frequently, so you only ever do the erase & rewrite bit once per session.
          We even used different color markers to represent different values, like bright red for the HP, green for the GP, black for the XP, brown for temporary bonus/penalty modifiers, etc.
          It turned the sheet into "rainbow barf", but it meant the character sheets lasted far, far longer than before.
          You just have to be careful not to accidently smudge/erase something with a swipe of the hand, since the wet erase markers are designed to come off easily.

          Hope that helps!

  • (Score: 2, Disagree) by Nerdfest on Saturday March 18 2017, @02:54PM (9 children)

    by Nerdfest (80) on Saturday March 18 2017, @02:54PM (#480852)

    Anybody who's anybody moved on to Pathfinder years ago.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @03:34PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @03:34PM (#480863)

      Rules are for noobs who need a guide to learn the game, experienced player left them behind long ago and concentrate on the role playing.

      • (Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday March 18 2017, @05:28PM (1 child)

        by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Saturday March 18 2017, @05:28PM (#480876) Journal
        They help keep people honest. I played diceless a few times. A common problem was that the DM would occasionally rig combats to have certain cinematic outcomes. I recall, for example, one Winter Wolf game where my character attempted to attack the primary bad guy twice (in different conflicts) and failed hard each time due to plot armor. With dice rolls, it would have allowed for chance to enter in these conflicts.
    • (Score: 2) by Celestial on Saturday March 18 2017, @05:02PM

      by Celestial (4891) on Saturday March 18 2017, @05:02PM (#480871) Journal

      Bah. In the genre of medieval fantasy, Magic World RPG by Chaosium is king. :P

    • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday March 18 2017, @08:23PM (4 children)

      by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Saturday March 18 2017, @08:23PM (#480907) Homepage Journal

      Pathfinder was peachy keen if you weren't a 3E/4E fan but 5E kicks the utter crap out of it for one very simple reason: streamlined math.

      --
      My rights don't end where your fear begins.
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @09:57PM (3 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @09:57PM (#480948)

        5E is a power gamers dream for those that want to play superheros it's great!

        • (Score: 2) by Celestial on Saturday March 18 2017, @10:01PM (2 children)

          by Celestial (4891) on Saturday March 18 2017, @10:01PM (#480950) Journal

          You're thinking of Fourth Edition. Fourth Edition was pretty much a super-hero tabletop RPG in all but name.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @10:10PM (1 child)

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 18 2017, @10:10PM (#480954)

            If you say so, I haven't played 5e but what I looked at from the tubes sure looked like superheros

            haven't really played since 2e unless you count NWN

  • (Score: 1) by ShadowSystems on Sunday March 19 2017, @02:39PM

    by ShadowSystems (6185) <ShadowSystemsNO@SPAMGmail.com> on Sunday March 19 2017, @02:39PM (#481143)

    Given that the D&D Wiki already lets players & DM's access tons of Open Game & Homebrew content, that's a "we've already GOT that!" function.
    Given programs like Hero Labs & Hero Machine, we've been able to create our characters, track them, & even make portraits if we like.
    Considering that there have been countless fan created Excel spreadsheets, DOS BASIC programs, various databases (MS Access & others), & assorted & sundry submissions for the keeping of records^, we've had no shortage of ways to create, manipulate, track, & trade characters.
    ^: My favorite was an Excel spreadsheet that included all the source material until 3rd edition.
    You typed in your character's name, but nearly *everything else* was a series of drop down menus.
    Pick a race from the DDM & it automaticly adjusted the racial ability modifiers accordingly.
    All their traits, boosts, limitations, etc were all auto-populated into the right spots, thus saving you the need to look everything up.
    All the gear, armor, weapons, variants, spells, you name it, if it was included in any of the core books then the spreadsheet's author had painstakingly entered in the game data into the mix.
    It was only made for D&D, you couldn't use it for any other game, but it was basicly what Hero Lab is today minus the fancy GUI.
    The file was *HUGE*, it had separate sheets for each of the books, races, equipment lists, etc, so if you had a question about anything it was a simple matter to flip to the right sheet, do a search for the term, & get the answer you needed.
    Best of all, you could export JUST the character page as a Character Sheet, complete with all the stats, gear, spells, et al.
    Dice rolls were handled by the pseudo random number generator with defaults for if you had rolled a d2, d4, d6, d8, d10, d12, d20, or d%.
    You could make it do others, but the results were always wonky on the wierd ones.
    ("I tried to roll a d11 & it told me Divide By Cheese error!")
    *Cough*

    So WotC offering all this stuff is nice, but it's SERIOUSLY late to the game.
    Everything they boast about we've been able to do for decades already, just not officially.
    So if the unofficial fan made stuff isn't surpassed by exponential leaps & bounds by what WotC is offering, then WotC's efforts will fail just as badly as 4th edition.
    My friends & I are still playing 3.5 (makes comical cat gagging faces at the PathFinder folks) because 4th was such a fustercluck, & we're hesitant about moving to 5th on the "burned once twice shy" principal.
    After all the money we've collectively spent on D&D material over the decades, WotC had better make DAMN sure 5th edition doesn't turn out to be just a fresh coat of varnish on an old turd.
    =-|

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